The Accidental Smallholder Forum

Livestock => Sheep => Topic started by: ThomasR on December 12, 2015, 09:43:42 am

Title: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: ThomasR on December 12, 2015, 09:43:42 am
My tup has jumped the fence into the ewe lambs.  I was wondering if there is any way that I can get the ewes out of lamb, other than stressing them out? Is there a "morning after" pill for sheep?
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: fsmnutter on December 12, 2015, 10:11:00 am
Your vet can give them an injection which works most times but is not guaranteed, and/or you can have them scanned at the usual post tupping time to see if any are in lamb, and manage any that are extra carefully.
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: Marches Farmer on December 12, 2015, 10:59:57 am
What breed? He may have jumped over in response to one cycling but most native breeds will stop cycling around this time of year.  If you intend to get them scanned and normally give them some hard feed over Winter it won't hurt them to have a little extra feed as they'll still be growing themselves as well as growing their lambs.
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: Tim W on December 12, 2015, 03:00:39 pm
You can inject with 'Cyclix' which will cause them to abort

The window I think is between 12 and 45 days pregnant

I've just done 145 of them----ask me how well it works next spring
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: Penninehillbilly on December 12, 2015, 03:17:03 pm
You can inject with 'Cyclix' which will cause them to abort

The window I think is between 12 and 45 days pregnant

I've just done 145 of them----ask me how well it works next spring

So if I had my goat injected (estrumate?) at about 4 days I wasted about 35? Would explain why she hasn't been in season again  :(
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: Anke on December 12, 2015, 05:26:49 pm
I have just had a ewe lamb injected with Estrumate at 14 days after the (observed) mating, and will have to go back for another one 5 days after the 1st injection. No idea if it is different for goats, and hope it works...
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: ThomasR on December 12, 2015, 05:41:53 pm
They are Hebrideans. New fencing is going to be going. H e has jumped over a fence that he should not be able to jump, it has double barbed wire it taller than most. Many bad words were shouted at him :rant: :rant: :rant:, he did this when he was on rent this year for somebody else and now he is back he wants more. he has had over 20 ewes this year. He has been warned that he next time will be his last. :rant: If they are in lamb then I will be lambing from February until May, many sleepless nights.
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: Tim W on December 12, 2015, 06:06:30 pm
No idea about estrumate ---not even sure if it is the same drug as cyclix, someone will enlighten us I guess

My 145 were the result of somebodies ram getting in with my stud ewes (didn't think to tell anyone it had escaped 2 weeks previously )
Difference in price between fat/store lambs and my breeding sheep is considerable otherwise I would just have left it ----& the guy has no insurance!

So just to put it in perspective and encourage anyone who doesn't carry livestock insurance to reconsider

Store lamb value in August = 50?
I sell breeding ewe lambs in August at 105 (and have deposits for 2016 born lambs)

Multiply that by 145 ewes at 150% lambing rate
Add in 30 ram lambs at 700
Add in lack of genetic progress for a year
Add in any disease that the stray ram could have brought in and you could be looking at a large bill

Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: verdifish on December 12, 2015, 07:32:29 pm
What breed? He may have jumped over in response to one cycling but most native breeds will stop cycling around this time of year.  If you intend to get them scanned and normally give them some hard feed over Winter it won't hurt them to have a little extra feed as they'll still be growing themselves as well as growing their lambs.

Most natives will most definitely not stop cycling this time of the year!!!! 
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: Hillview Farm on December 12, 2015, 08:49:22 pm
Estrumate Is the same as cyclix :)
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: Penninehillbilly on December 12, 2015, 09:29:41 pm
I have just had a ewe lamb injected with Estrumate at 14 days after the (observed) mating, and will have to go back for another one 5 days after the 1st injection. No idea if it is different for goats, and hope it works...
Interesting, she didn't say anything about a second injection :-(
Just hoping if she is still in kid kidding goes OK and no deformities.

At least with goats they let you know when they are in season,
I know this is probably daft, but with sheep, can you tell if the fleece is messed up on the rump if she has been mated?
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: Anke on December 12, 2015, 09:40:11 pm
I actually saw the tup lamb merrily tupping away, so knew the exact day and who he was on for definite... my vet had to phone the company to make sure what the protocol for sheep is, as they don't often do them. I have also seen him on an adult ewe (she was wagging her tail at him like goats do!), not sure if he was successful as there is quite a height difference between pure Shetland (tup) lamb and adult Gotland ewe with some texel in her..., but I have left her and hopefully not too many others, he was in for a couple of days.

Reason I got this ewe lamb injected, is that she is a nice grey katmoget and he is white, so not a good match... I am not so worried about the white ones anyway, I know who daddy will be... and can make sure Heptavac and some feed goes in at the right time...

A friend has had to have one of her female kids done, I think it was single injection, but not 100% sure. She definitely came back into season.... and was caught again by a very agile buckling that managed to jump out from somewhere he definitely shouldn't have...
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: Big Light on December 12, 2015, 10:12:56 pm
Are you renaming him Mr very Friendly lol
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: ThomasR on December 12, 2015, 10:58:38 pm
Are you renaming him Mr very Friendly lol
Yes very Friendly with somebody else if He does it again, like the butcher for example. It's a pity he has been so good up until now. This year has been sheep wise problem free and we only had a few more days to go and boom. My neighbour has just seen him jump from the ewe lamb field back into the mature ewes, so who knows how long he has been doing this. Might just have to handle the ewe lambs a lot as well to stress them out and make them abort. Had a Hebridean ewe lamb in lamb because a tup jumped the fence last year so we improved the fence. The tups are a serious nightmare. :rant: :rant: :rant: :rant:
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: fsmnutter on December 12, 2015, 11:41:34 pm
We figured out very quickly how agile Heb tups can be. Within days of separating them in our first year, around August, he had jumped the fence and gotten in with everyone, thankfully got him out minutes later. Since then, the tup has had heras fence panels between him and whichever ladies he's not to get at! Coincidentally mostly keeps the billy goat contained too!
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: Red on December 13, 2015, 08:43:45 pm
My 2 heb Rams had to be moved yesterday for trying to fence jump! Randy buggers ... I've now moved them down wind and 2 fields away from my girls
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: ThomasR on December 21, 2015, 11:31:16 am
Mine is still at it. He is jumping fences he should not be able to jump, they are higher than average. Really starting to loose it with him, if he wasn't so nice in the flesh then he wouldn't still be here. >:( >:( >:( He is very lucky.
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: Anke on December 21, 2015, 07:39:44 pm
Mine is still at it. He is jumping fences he should not be able to jump, they are higher than average. Really starting to loose it with him, if he wasn't so nice in the flesh then he wouldn't still be here. >:( >:( >:( He is very lucky.

IMO - no ram is that nice that he would get away with this kind of behaviour.... but at the moment his meat will not be great either.... so no easy solution I guess.

Fortunately my tup lamb (Shetland) has stayed in the further away field, as he is really not big enough to go right now. He still stands at the gate though and glares at me... ::)
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: harmony on December 21, 2015, 08:56:16 pm
Mine is still at it. He is jumping fences he should not be able to jump, they are higher than average. Really starting to loose it with him, if he wasn't so nice in the flesh then he wouldn't still be here. >:( >:( >:( He is very lucky.

IMO - no ram is that nice that he would get away with this kind of behaviour.... but at the moment his meat will not be great either.... so no easy solution I guess.

Fortunately my tup lamb (Shetland) has stayed in the further away field, as he is really not big enough to go right now. He still stands at the gate though and glares at me... ::)


You can't blame him for being keen  :o
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: verdifish on December 22, 2015, 08:57:06 pm
Mine is still at it. He is jumping fences he should not be able to jump, they are higher than average. Really starting to loose it with him, if he wasn't so nice in the flesh then he wouldn't still be here. >:( >:( >:( He is very lucky.

What's average for a heb tup?  I've seen our old tup jump over heras fencing from a standstill, ok the last 18 inches was a scrabble but the bugger got over! 
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: Marches Farmer on December 23, 2015, 09:20:21 am
When we take our BF tup out he has to be put in a block and tin shed, with sheep hurdles tied vertically across the stock gate at the front.  That makes it at least 6ft high on every side - the only thing that'll hold him. 

Time of year ewes cycle may depend on whre you are in the country.  They begin as the days shorten, which means lambing will coincide with grass growth in Spring (well, apart from the Poll Dorset, which seems to have a calendar all of its own).  I have a ram lamb out on loan at present, but certainly wouldn't be wanting to lamb in early Summer myself - too many flies, for a start.
Title: Re: "morning after pill" for sheep?
Post by: ThomasR on December 23, 2015, 11:00:34 pm
I do have a stables to put him, Well I did have. Another member of my family thought geese would be a good idea (mistake 1). The geese now have that place every night so that is of limits. I'm sure the tup must have damaged himself in the brain as he is now jumping into his own field with the other tups. Mistake number 2 is getting a Hebridean tup, I do love the breed but they do test my patience some times.

The thread has made me smile... which I know probably doesn't help but thank you for cheering up my dark days!

The tup has almost made me laugh at his sheer determination to irritate and confuse me. I'm not sure how this is going to play out but I will not be lambing 7 hebridean ewe lambs this year while also sitting my exams in school! For his own sake I hope he hasn't covered all of them, will be getting them scanned.