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Author Topic: Civilisation reaches spain  (Read 3791 times)

tizaala

  • Joined Mar 2011
  • Dolau, Llandrindod Wells,Powys
Civilisation reaches spain
« on: August 31, 2012, 01:23:34 pm »
No more license permits for bullfighting events in the city San of Sebastian
The city of San Sebastian, under the nationalist Bildu mayor Juan Karlos Izagirre, has announced that it will refuse all license permits for bullfighting events in the city as from next year.

The nationalist group Bildu has said, and Juan Karlos (note the K) agrees, that it is 100% anti-bullfighting and looks forwards to the day that it is finally dropped across Spain, and that next years “la Semana Grande” of San Sebastian will be, for the first time ever, animal free.

PSE/EE (the local PSOE) and the PP both voted against the measure, and the PNV (the other nationalist party up there) says it is not against bullfighting.

Although the townhall can’t ban bullfighting, it can refuse to issue public licenses to any companies that want to put one on. Also, since all the bullfighting venues in town happen to be public buildings, the townhall says that it is exploring options to refurbish and reuse these venues for other sports, respecting, it added quickly, the historic and traditional values of the buildings.

It’s rumoured that the Illumbe, the famous bullfighting ring in the town, may be refurbished as a basketball court and used as the new stadium for the Gipuzkoa Basket Club (GBC), who already uses the building when there isn’t a bullfight on.
 
Now they might get round to stopping donkeys and goats from being thrown off church towers , all in the name of religion ........ :excited:

Mad Goatwoman of Madeley

  • Joined Sep 2011
  • Telford
Re: Civilisation reaches spain
« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2012, 02:49:33 pm »
Well, that's progress.  Never could see the point in bull-fighting. There'll be a lot of happy bulls around.

Ina

  • Joined Feb 2012
  • South Aberdeenshire
Re: Civilisation reaches spain
« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2012, 02:57:35 pm »
Very brave and applaudable.

Remember Terry Pratchett's "Witches abroad"? After the witches managed to somewhat disturb the bull run, the town decided to have an annual flower festival instead... Maybe somebody should suggest flower arranging as an alternative sport?  :eyelashes:

Sylvia

  • Joined Aug 2009
Re: Civilisation reaches spain
« Reply #3 on: August 31, 2012, 04:13:19 pm »
I'm not advocating bull-fighting at all but I once heard someone say that in their opinion there was as much cruelty inflicted in your average livestock market where the cattle couldn't even fight back and that at least the fighting bulls are enraged instead of just terrified. What do you think?

Bionic

  • Joined Dec 2010
  • Talley, Carmarthenshire
Re: Civilisation reaches spain
« Reply #4 on: August 31, 2012, 04:39:15 pm »
I have only ever seen a bull fight on tv and I loved all the dressing up bit but the rest is horrific. It would be great if they can find a way to continue the tradition without inflicting pain and death.
Sally
Life is like a bowl of cherries, mostly yummy but some dodgy bits

Moleskins

  • Joined Sep 2009
  • England
Re: Civilisation reaches spain
« Reply #5 on: August 31, 2012, 07:17:55 pm »
I'm not advocating bull-fighting at all but I once heard someone say that in their opinion there was as much cruelty inflicted in your average livestock market where the cattle couldn't even fight back and that at least the fighting bulls are enraged instead of just terrified. What do you think?
I'd tend to agree with you, last sheep I took to market were in the company of several poor specimens, one had a full scale prolapse.
Hard to imagine how it was going to get through the sale and trucked away without considerable distress.


As far as I know, and I'm going back to Gerneral Franco's day, the meat from the bulls is distributed to the poor.
Man v bull ( matador ) is one thing, but I don't agree with Picadors as this involves a horse which is blinkered and padded on one side, there is no doubt a lot of skill in keeping the horse from seeing what's going on, but even so.
Time flies like an arrow but fruit flies like a banana.

Ina

  • Joined Feb 2012
  • South Aberdeenshire
Re: Civilisation reaches spain
« Reply #6 on: August 31, 2012, 08:02:07 pm »
The fact that there is cruelty at lots of livestock markets (and abattoirs - I've seen some nasty things there, too!) shouldn't be used as an excuse for bull fighting, though. I find anything that afflicts pain or fear on animals abominable - especially if it's considered "sport" to humans.

SallyintNorth

  • Joined Feb 2011
  • Cornwall
  • Rarely short of an opinion but I mean well
    • Trelay Cohousing Community
Re: Civilisation reaches spain
« Reply #7 on: September 01, 2012, 12:14:16 am »
I'm not advocating bull-fighting at all but I once heard someone say that in their opinion there was as much cruelty inflicted in your average livestock market where the cattle couldn't even fight back and that at least the fighting bulls are enraged instead of just terrified. What do you think?
I'd tend to agree with you, last sheep I took to market were in the company of several poor specimens, one had a full scale prolapse.
Hard to imagine how it was going to get through the sale and trucked away without considerable distress.

An animal with a prolapse is unfit to be at a mart.  The mart staff, and the attending Trading Standards / veterinary staff should have rejected it on arrival.

It is possible she'd prolapsed after arrival, I suppose, in which case I would assume she would have been penned to one side awaiting veterinary attention.

The marts I attend are generally pretty hot on welfare, both in terms of fitness to be sold / to travel and in terms of treatment and handling while at the mart.  The ambience and experience can be very stressful to some cattle, there's no doubt - generally the mart staff will handle such animals with sensitivity and do what they can within the constraints of the sale process to minimise the stress felt by the animal. 
« Last Edit: September 01, 2012, 08:09:56 am by SallyintNorth »
Don't listen to the money men - they know the price of everything and the value of nothing

Live in a cohousing community with small farm for our own use.  Dairy cows (rearing their own calves for beef), pigs, sheep for meat and fleece, ducks and hens for eggs, veg and fruit growing

tizaala

  • Joined Mar 2011
  • Dolau, Llandrindod Wells,Powys
Re: Civilisation reaches spain
« Reply #8 on: September 01, 2012, 08:07:25 am »
Sally , I think your  " nut " may have got cross-threaded there. was this intended for somewhere else? :thinking:

SallyintNorth

  • Joined Feb 2011
  • Cornwall
  • Rarely short of an opinion but I mean well
    • Trelay Cohousing Community
Re: Civilisation reaches spain
« Reply #9 on: September 01, 2012, 08:12:28 am »
Sally , I think your  " nut " may have got cross-threaded there. was this intended for somewhere else? :thinking:

Sorry, Doug I should have quoted the bit I was replying to.  I've edited my post to do that now.

(I haven't responded to the main topic; my emotional reaction to bullfighting is the same as that of most Brits but I am aware that I have no firsthand knowledge nor any comprehension of the local situation, so I prefer to leave the debate to others better equipped.)
Don't listen to the money men - they know the price of everything and the value of nothing

Live in a cohousing community with small farm for our own use.  Dairy cows (rearing their own calves for beef), pigs, sheep for meat and fleece, ducks and hens for eggs, veg and fruit growing

Castle Farm

  • Joined Nov 2008
  • Hereford/Powys Border. near Hay-on-Wye
    • castlefarmeggs
Re: Civilisation reaches spain
« Reply #10 on: September 01, 2012, 08:37:53 am »
How anybody can call this barbaric spectical 'sport' is beyond me.

There are some seriously sick people attending shows like this. ::)
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Moleskins

  • Joined Sep 2009
  • England
Re: Civilisation reaches spain
« Reply #11 on: September 01, 2012, 09:07:38 am »
How anybody can call this barbaric spectical 'sport' is beyond me.

There are some seriously sick people attending shows like this. ::)
Have you ever been to one ?


I'm loathe to get too involved in this emotive subject, the last thing we want is another bustup.


What I would say is this, if the Spanish came over here shouting the odds about what we could and couldn't do we'd be seriously p1$$3d off.


I can recall several other topics on the forum where people have watched you tube videos and made extremely judgmental posts when they clearly don't know all the facts, none of us do if we're honest.


Can we dictate to Arabs or Jews how their meat is slaughtered? Will that be next?
Most of us on here have animals which at the end of the day we kill.
Many of us on here have animals which have suffered at some point due to our ignorance about stockmanship.


Think on.

Time flies like an arrow but fruit flies like a banana.

tizaala

  • Joined Mar 2011
  • Dolau, Llandrindod Wells,Powys
Re: Civilisation reaches spain
« Reply #12 on: September 01, 2012, 01:55:04 pm »
So Moleskins, you support throwing donkeys and goats off church towers in Spain and bear baiting in Turkey, and India, and clubbing seals to death in Canada, and whaling in Japan and Norway?
Just because these things don't happen here we should mind our own business ? ....Interesting. :thinking:

Small Farmer

  • Joined Jan 2012
  • Bedfordshire
Re: Civilisation reaches spain
« Reply #13 on: September 01, 2012, 03:43:27 pm »
That was not what he said and you know it.


Have you been to a bullfight?
Being certain just means you haven't got all the facts

Moleskins

  • Joined Sep 2009
  • England
Re: Civilisation reaches spain
« Reply #14 on: September 01, 2012, 04:14:06 pm »
So Moleskins, you support throwing donkeys and goats off church towers in Spain and bear baiting in Turkey, and India, and clubbing seals to death in Canada, and whaling in Japan and Norway?
Just because these things don't happen here we should mind our own business ? ....Interesting. :thinking:


You missed out using chimpanzees for photographs with tourists.
Time flies like an arrow but fruit flies like a banana.

 

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