Smallholders Insurance from Greenlands

Author Topic: Can I treat brambles/nettles etc without killing everything else?  (Read 17015 times)

PaulM

  • Joined Oct 2011
  • Hampshire
We have a smallish area where we grow poppies and meadow flowers etc but we are constantly battling brambles, nettles and ivy? Is there anything we can do to help us in our battle? We do have dogs and small children around too.
Any help or advice gratefully received, thank you

robert waddell

  • Guest
Re: Can I treat brambles/nettles etc without killing everything else?
« Reply #1 on: October 10, 2011, 08:23:26 pm »
if you don't mind using roundup  you can  use this            you will need to use rubber gloves with sponge on the palm the sponge has the roundup in it you just squeeze the plant with the glove job done no overspray all wanted plants still living as long as you don't put to much roundup on the sponge :farmer:

deepinthewoods

  • Guest
Re: Can I treat brambles/nettles etc without killing everything else?
« Reply #2 on: October 10, 2011, 09:16:34 pm »
thats a good tip, cheers.d

Plantoid

  • Joined May 2011
  • Yorkshireman on a hill in wet South Wales
Re: Can I treat brambles/nettles etc without killing everything else?
« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2011, 10:20:39 am »
I didn't have much joy with Round up in a sprayer on nthe brambles & ivy for the bramble is a woody plant and the ivy has a slightly waxy water repellent leaf .
I must confess I hadnt thought of using a strong solution direct on the leaves with a sponge etc.

SBK is a brush wood , persistant weed and stump killer . mixed with a little paraffin or diesel or heating oil and painted on the growing tips on top of and under the leaves of the ivy and brambles will usually see them off permanantly .
 
My neighbour has grown an 18 foot tall row of leylandi infested with brambles that hang over my pathsways , at face height.
I've asked them to cut them back several times but nothing has happened .
So I treated the top six inches of the brambles that are over my property to a strong cocktail of SBK & paraffin five days ago .. they are wilting nicely .

If you can cordon off the area for a week or so after  spraying  it with a coarse spray such as a fence sprayer you'll do it much better and get any small emerging shoots as well .
 I cannot speak to highly about SBK for I used it with a back pack to clear 1 1/2 acres of chest high nettles and brambles and a massive bed of periwinkle  a few years ago .
International playboy & liar .
Man of the world not a country

mary denise sloan

  • Joined Oct 2011
Re: Can I treat brambles/nettles etc without killing everything else?
« Reply #4 on: October 11, 2011, 01:30:07 pm »
 I farm in Ireland and also have a reasonably large veg garden . last year 2010 I treated old manure covered in nettles with grazon 90  This year this manure was added to the greenhouse soil for tomatoes, within weeks of planting strong home grown plants all were failing with obvious chemical damage, all the soil had to be removed and replaced . The nettle cover was so thick on the manure very little chemical would have touched the soil on application. grazon will kill nettles and thistles. this year we  have a problem with lamb thrive after weaning further investigations are on going .but the fields were spot sprayed with grazon in the summer so a question remark is there . also be careful as skin irritation does occur with some users .

SallyintNorth

  • Joined Feb 2011
  • Cornwall
  • Rarely short of an opinion but I mean well
    • Trelay Cohousing Community
Re: Can I treat brambles/nettles etc without killing everything else?
« Reply #5 on: October 11, 2011, 06:07:46 pm »
The Grazon-90 label makes it abundantly clear that the product is for use only on established grassland.  ("Only use GRAZON 90 on permanent pasture or on leys that have been established for at least one year.")

It also makes its persistence into manure / compost very clear.  Cut and pasted from the Grazon-90 label (my bolding):

WARNINGS
GRAZON* 90 residues in plant tissues which have not completely decayed may
affect succeeding susceptible crops eg peas, beans and other legumes, carrots
and Umbelliferae, potatoes and tomatoes, lettuce and other Compositae.
Do not plant susceptible autumn-sown crops (eg winter beans) in the same year
as treatment with GRAZON 90. Where susceptible crops are to be planted in the
spring do not apply GRAZON 90 later than the end of July of the previous year.
Following good agricultural practice ensure that plant remains have completely
decayed before planting susceptible crops.
Do not use any plant material treated with GRAZON 90 for composting or
mulching.
Do not use manure from animals fed on crops treated with GRAZON 90 for
composting.




So I am sorry, mary, but you have been really rather stupid to use Grazon on manure.


Read on, however, because the stuff seems to persist even further than the manufacturers state in their labelling.

Grazon contains clopyralid.  There have been stories in the press for three years at least of crop failures after using manures from herbivores who have eaten hay made from aminopyralid-treated grasses.   

Here is one such story:
http://www.geologywales.co.uk/storms/summer-2011-aminopyralid.htm

We spot-spray Grazon from time to time for nettle and thistle control.  Any residues in hay or silage give us another hit when the muck from the cattle and sheep who have eaten it is spread back on the pasture.  We do have to be careful that it doesn't make it into muck we spread on land ploughed for veg crops, though - or for muck neighbours take for their gardens.

BTW, we have never had any problems with unthrifty lambs.

Oh, and the Grazon label also states that it will irritate eyes and skin, and can cause sensitisation in some people.  It makes it plain that operatives using the product should be wearing protective clothing, including gloves.  It says that if it gets on your skin you should wash thoroughly - and should also wash any contaminated clothing.  So you shouldn't really be letting it get to your skin to cause irritation.
Don't listen to the money men - they know the price of everything and the value of nothing

Live in a cohousing community with small farm for our own use.  Dairy cows (rearing their own calves for beef), pigs, sheep for meat and fleece, ducks and hens for eggs, veg and fruit growing

dizzy1pig

  • Joined Jan 2010
  • Leuchars, Fife
Re: Can I treat brambles/nettles etc without killing everything else?
« Reply #6 on: October 11, 2011, 08:19:32 pm »
HAve been known to use Pastor for nettles.. not sure if its still available though
Everything else broad leaved will go as well but especially good for nettles

SallyintNorth

  • Joined Feb 2011
  • Cornwall
  • Rarely short of an opinion but I mean well
    • Trelay Cohousing Community
Re: Can I treat brambles/nettles etc without killing everything else?
« Reply #7 on: October 12, 2011, 12:41:14 am »
I've been sent a message suggesting that I may have been a little harsh on mary.

Generally I think I try to be one of the more even-handed and tactful contributors to this forum.  I decided to be blunt on this occasion because I do think it is negligent to use a product such as this without reading and complying with the instructions.  It isn't as though there was a wee bit of small print that had been overlooked; the whole label shouts loudly and clearly that this is a dangerous product and should be used with care to avoid damage to the environment and the operator.

You can see for yourself here:
http://www.progreen.co.uk/Pr0gr33n/images/uploads/Grazon90-1ltr-product-label-information.pdf

Year on year more products are withdrawn from the market, or made less effective, or placed under license such that they are not readily available, because they are misused and end up damaging people, animals and/or the environment. 

I would be genuinely interested to know what mary thinks about this now, having had the contents of the label drawn to her attention.  Should the product be withdrawn because, misused, it can damage crops, people and the environment?  If not, what can and should be done to prevent such misuse?
Don't listen to the money men - they know the price of everything and the value of nothing

Live in a cohousing community with small farm for our own use.  Dairy cows (rearing their own calves for beef), pigs, sheep for meat and fleece, ducks and hens for eggs, veg and fruit growing

Mel

  • Guest
Re: Can I treat brambles/nettles etc without killing everything else?
« Reply #8 on: October 12, 2011, 09:23:48 am »
Sorry but I think whomever said you were harsh on Mary meant that you really should not be calling someone stupid,you have no right to put someone else down because of their errors or failings.

I think this is a little on the abusive side-I cannot tell you how I would feel if you said the same to me! Diplomacy would be better advising Mary that it was not a very good idea to use the product and she should use caution at all times whilst using chemicals...But calling someone really stupid I would say is a no no.

Always offer advice to your best ability,this is fine but I do not see it as nice to be putting others down in such a fashion,it is rude and intimidating and is in the least Tactful and very poor manners!

SallyintNorth

  • Joined Feb 2011
  • Cornwall
  • Rarely short of an opinion but I mean well
    • Trelay Cohousing Community
Re: Can I treat brambles/nettles etc without killing everything else?
« Reply #9 on: October 12, 2011, 11:07:01 am »
I'm sure mary isn't stupid, any more than any of us on here are stupid.  I do think she has behaved stupidly on this occasion; we all do that from time to time too. 

I would never mean to be rude or offensive.

I did think it worth making the point strongly that warnings on labels are there for a reason and should be read and acted upon, or face the consequences. 
Don't listen to the money men - they know the price of everything and the value of nothing

Live in a cohousing community with small farm for our own use.  Dairy cows (rearing their own calves for beef), pigs, sheep for meat and fleece, ducks and hens for eggs, veg and fruit growing

robert waddell

  • Guest
Re: Can I treat brambles/nettles etc without killing everything else?
« Reply #10 on: October 12, 2011, 12:29:05 pm »
o dont worry sally there is plenty of room in my corner      the bad baby corner ;) :farmer:

MikeM

  • Joined Jul 2011
  • NW Devon
Re: Can I treat brambles/nettles etc without killing everything else?
« Reply #11 on: October 12, 2011, 01:17:02 pm »
the other option to chemicals is the sharp, swinging blade approach. Either a brushcutter if it's a big area or long handled slasher for smaller areas. I used to work for the NT on several SSSIs and no chemicals were ever allowed on these areas for brush control. When you look at the amount you have to do it can be a tad daunting, but it's amazing how much you can get done in a day or so. Depending on how low you cut/slash the understory should recover pretty quickly.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2011, 01:25:26 pm by MikeM »

 
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