[Me]

I think it is difficult to 'guess' at the reason for behaviours without seeing the dog.
[/quote]

Yep, you and the dog need to see someone whether it is the seller, a rescue centre or a trainer. Good luck LG

[Kitchen Cottage]

My twopenneth

Firstly, as a solicitor, yes you can write an payment plan.  It needs to contain 3 things (a) an acknowledgement that she is endebted to you (for the cost of the dog returned) (b) a acknowledgement by you that you will waive your right to immediate payment provided she keeps up with a scheduled payment provision that you list (c) an acceleration provision that if she misses a payment all payments become due immediately and she indemnifies you for all losses.

Secondly, as the owner of two old, blind, abused Bulgarian rescue dogs (Luca and Denzel) who hate each other, people and my beautiful working cocker Misty.  My house is Zoned with Denzel in one zone, Luca in another and Misty in the third.  They are my responsiblity and, given they have had NO pleasure or love in their long lives, I am not going to let either down BUT life is WAY WAY too short to spend it adjusting your life to a dogs issues.

Give him back, get your money back slowly or sue her.  In truth you can go down the behaviourist route (and Denzel has a FANTASTIC behaviourist who has helped him beyond words)  but it's more money, more stress and you just don't want it.  Give him back to her... he is her responsibility.

[devonlady]

I've thought long and hard about my reply, Mammyshaz. (and KC) If you take on a dog you have a moral if not legal responsibility for that dogs life and future. If the breeder/ former owner will happily take it back then fair enough. If not then he only has you to depend on. Yes, he can go into rescue and maybe be passed from pillar to post until he's put to sleep.
We have fostered dozens of dogs and our principle  was if the dog was returned twice it stayed, no matter what.
I would advocate professional advice, maybe the dog's breeder will help with the cost, though we have always found that firm, kind and consistent discipline has usually worked. Dogs, as I have often had to tell people ARE dogs, not furry children.
Good luck with the boy XX

[Ladygrey]

Sorry everyone for the late reply,

I have read everyones replies and thankyou all, however Im not sure I can reply to everyone individually

Right, I will try and bullet point things as I find it easyer

-when Jim was biting there was no damage caused and he seems to be rather soft mouthed, fights last/lasted a few seconds and afterwards the dogs both had drool and slobber on them but I think after watching them carefully its a bit of a joint effort as Tully does go back for him

-Today is Saturday, we got Jim last Sunday, so we have had him for 6 days, Monday was terrible, I cried, the day was awful, Tuesday was better, I didnt cry, Wednesday he was the same, Thursday when I posted this he was a little better, however since thursday he has improved so so much, he has come on leaps and bounds, he is sitting back and "leaving it" with his food
he is playing with Tully in the garden for hours and Tully is enjoying his company! He has not made a wee in the house for 24 hours and there has not been a scrap now since yesterday morning, the scrap was over a toy
He has calmed down loads and the difference in him right now is huge compared to Monday.
I am actually enjoying his company today and its very amusing having a dog that cant open the gate latch and walks around wagging his tail and hitting it on everything

-Ok so what I think he is/is feeling
I think he is NOT a bad or nasty dog, he has never been told what manners are, he has been "free-fed" wich is not so good and I have gotten off the breeder he only ever had toys outside
The owners seem to have treated him wrong/harshly and he is full of anxiety in some times hence why he wants to guard something
He has not been socialized enough and he has not been trained

Today I have had him at my parents, he has been told off by the two older dogs and he has settled hugely, Tully and Jim have been walking around together all day and playing in the garden and having a lovely time.

Right so thats what has happened on that side of things

On the breeder side of things, I asked for half the money back upfront and the rest over a month on friday, she has got back to me today saying actually no she does not want Jim back as she doesnt have the money.


Today after taking Jim out with Tully, Tully got out of the car in a public car park! which is absolutely amazing! he was looking at Jim and following lead, he then walked around town with no shaking or panicking or leaping or anything! it was such a shock, I never in a million years expected that

Yes if we think it would change things we would get Jim chopped, but with all of our other dogs and my parents foster dogs it has never made a behavioral difference so I would be hesitant doing this

So..... seeing as Jim HAS improved over the last 6 days and yes I was not expecting it but then again Tully had hangups when I got him, just of the nervous kind, if I put into this giant puppy and he is giving back already then there is no reason why I cannot try and keep this puppy and do the best I can for him

Thankyou all and I will try and keep you posted

Thankyou OldShep yes I agree with your post, he has stopped weeing over this last 24hours and I think he is feeling more secure and thankyou very much, Thankyou also Sally, very nice post, Thankyou everyone else

Yes perhaps I did get a dog too soon after Laddie leaving us, but I think Jim is happier here and I think I can give him a lovely life, also I am very happy with how Tully is over the last day or two

Thankyou again

[Bionic]

It sounds as if Jim has made some huge changes in just a few days and that Tully is enjoying having him there as well.  Jim continues to improve.

[NicandChic]

Lovely news 

[Mammyshaz]

Wow, that is great news. Hopefully it has just been a shock to his system leaving his home where he has never been given rules, crossed the doors or socialised. I so much hope the improvements continue  there are bound to be a few setbacks but keep looking forward. I hope you have many happy years ahead   

[sabrina]

So good to hear 

[Oopsiboughtasheep]

Lovely news. He is the doggy equivelant of a 'teenager' a very challenging time for them and for us (!). Proper 'Aggression'  in a puppy is one thing but 'mouthing' and 'leaning' on people' and being too big for their boots kind of comes with the package at this age. His life has been turned upside down and its so bewildering for them in a new environment. He has it all to learn and just needs the right home, love, time & patience to help him do that and it sounds like he may well have found it. Lots of hard work for you but so rewarding in the end. Wishing you all the very best and lots of fun with Jim.

[Old Shep]

Thats wonderful news! It may not be an easy passage but you will all learn so much together. My Jock is d
og reactive and i had to learn so much to deal with it. He is 9 yrs old this week and we have both learnt so much together. I love him to bits and i look forward to a post from you in 8 yrs time saying the same ;-)

[Fleecewife]

I am so delighted for you all 

Now of course we want a pic.......

[Alistair]

Me to

Delighted

Don't sit on your laurels though, you have an in there, get him trained

I'm made up for you. Now

[SallyintNorth]

I'm so pleased to hear this encouraging news.  Well done, Ladygrey 

There are bound to be setbacks, of course, but with Tully settling into having his new pal around, and Jim starting to learn that he's in a safe, secure home now where he'll have rules that he understands, you'll overcome them together - maybe with a little help and/or moral support from your friends on TAS from time to time!

And yes, please, we want PICTURES!   

[in the hills]

So pleased for you LG.   

In general, retrievers are eager to please and quick to learn and he is only a youngster so plenty of scope.

I had a Flat Coat as a teenager/ young lady who was, unusually for Flatties, dog aggressive. And I do mean aggressive. Even from an age younger than Jim his fights were 'serious' ones. He grew up with other dogs and was well socialised .... just how he was. It did upset me initially. He was the dog that I chose from the litter and was my dog to train, work and show. Was never 'cured' but was able to manage his behaviour so that few problems occurred and he went everywhere with me. If Jim turns out to have problems then would gladly talk about ideas to manage if you want to PM me ever.

[landroverroy]

 Brilliant.
Sounds like a happy ending for all.