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Author Topic: Nose rings  (Read 21186 times)

pikilily

  • Joined Jan 2009
  • Do what you enjoy; And enjoy what you do!!
Nose rings
« on: November 16, 2010, 07:13:52 pm »
i noticed that Adam -countryfile- has rings on his pig's noses. MMmmmm!! yes lovely pasture, not all dug up.
BUT - i dont know how i feel about this.
what do the rest of you think- pros and cons
Emma T
If you don't have a dream; how you gonna have a dream come true?

Jackie

  • Joined Nov 2009
Re: Nose rings
« Reply #1 on: November 16, 2010, 07:37:39 pm »
I think its cruel.
Pigs naturally dig up the soil and root around and eat the plants and so to deprive them of this natural behaviour is cruel. :(

Re: Nose rings
« Reply #2 on: November 16, 2010, 07:56:16 pm »
Done by a lot of the commercial units - and some smallholders.

It is oficially classed as mutilation, as it does prevent the natural behaviour of the pig and should only be done if there are solid reasons to do it.

I'm sure I will get some flack for saying this though!

At least you didnt ask about teeth clipping and tail docking......

Thanks
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HappyHippy

  • Guest
Re: Nose rings
« Reply #3 on: November 16, 2010, 08:50:15 pm »
I couldn't do it  :(
As SFS said, it's depriving them of their natural behaviour.
Yes, I'm sure it makes for lovely green paddocks BUT how happy are the pigs ?
I raise my own meat as I want happy, healthy, outdoor pigs - putting a ring in their nose is almost as bad as keeping them on cement floors, it's not natural for them.
BUT having said all that, I've got Kune Kunes and although the piglets root a bit, the adults don't and my fields are fine so no worries there, time will tell with my 2 Berkshire girls  ;)  ;D

langdon

  • Joined Sep 2009
  • Pembrokeshire
  • The Happy Smallholder!
Re: Nose rings
« Reply #4 on: November 16, 2010, 08:57:58 pm »
why dont you send him ( adam ) an email???
if you think in anyway its cruel on his part, its no good asking others is it!
challenge him on his reason and find out why he has done it.
everyone does things different dont they?
langdon :pig:
Langdon ;)

Hilarysmum

  • Joined Oct 2007
Re: Nose rings
« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2010, 09:29:51 am »

Pigs nose ringed = children at a playground having to sit on the bench all day just watching and wishing!!!!!!!!

pikilily

  • Joined Jan 2009
  • Do what you enjoy; And enjoy what you do!!
Re: Nose rings
« Reply #6 on: November 17, 2010, 10:30:50 am »
thanks for the suggestion langdon, i will now! 

I just wanted to check the pros and cons with others who are more knowledgable than me.

So often judgments are made based on ignorance, and once there is greater understanding the 'judgments' are nullified. 

For example, there are, perhaps, people here who would judge me cruel for carrying a whip when i ride my horse. Yet if they were to examine the reasons why and how the appropriate ( and usually gentle)  use of the whip, or crop, is preferable to lots of strong legs aids and kicking! My horse is not affraid of the whip, she is not hurt by the whip, I use it more as a light flick, just slightly more than a tickle!! Yet judgments are made... ???

Please dont shoot people down in flames for asking a question, or seeking other peoples opinions. Otherwise there would be no free sharing of experiences, and skills...this forum would be pointless. I am sorry if my query offended or irritated!

Emma T



If you don't have a dream; how you gonna have a dream come true?

HappyHippy

  • Guest
Re: Nose rings
« Reply #7 on: November 17, 2010, 03:47:48 pm »
Hi Emma,
Your post didn't offend or upset me - I hope my reply didn't make it sound like it did (that's the problem with t'internet - no tone ;))
Judgements ARE quickly made, and when someone doesn't know anything about whatever subject they're judging on, it's easy to get it wrong (that's not a dig at you or anything - just a general observation)
Ringing noses is an OLD practice, done in the days before animal welfare was such a priority (or we didn't know any better) and I can see why (in large scale production) there would be a reasonable arguement for it BUT I don't agree with it. Just MY opinion, but like you it's always good to hear other's points of view.

Eve

  • Joined Jul 2010
Re: Nose rings
« Reply #8 on: November 17, 2010, 03:54:36 pm »
Quote
I am sorry if my query offended or irritated

No, Emma, you were exactly right in asking others what they think! And your whole argument is spot on!

I saw those nose rings too, hadn't seen them before - wouldn't that make the shocks of the electric fence worse?
HM's analogy is right - I'd never ring mine either. I have a fab photograph of one of my piggies when his face completely disappeared in the mud, his ears are the only thing level with the ground! When it's wet they blow bubbles whilst rooting in a puddle!  ;D
 
Didn't know about the horse wip reason, btw, thanks for explaining (I was one of those wondering why they were used  ::)).


Eve  :wave:

pikilily

  • Joined Jan 2009
  • Do what you enjoy; And enjoy what you do!!
Re: Nose rings
« Reply #9 on: November 17, 2010, 04:43:24 pm »
Hi All,
i have emailed Adam, via the countryfile website, to ask for his rationale for the nose-rings. .....LOL, hope i wont offend him with my questions. I will let you know what his reply contains.

Eve - that, in one short explaination, is a summary of the use of the whip :-\. It is often carried, but seldom used.

I also use a lunge whip for lunging the horses. It sort of looks like a ringmasters whip from a circus, six foot long with a seven or eight foot tail... BUT i have NEVER, in all the 40 odd years of owning horses, even touched a horse with one. They are used to encourage the horse to move forwards by snapping and popping behind the horse. The problem with whips is that they are most 'visable' to the public when watching horse racing....then it looks as if the jockey is thrashing the horse, which they are not actually doing! if they did they would be very very heavily fined...but the public perception sticks, and and that mud sticks to all horseriders!!! :(

some people concider the use of electric fencing to be cruel and restrictive......or a muzzle on a dog.....or castration....the list goes on!

Anyway back to the pigs, i didnt know whether i objected or not....I was undecided...hence the Q's.
cheers Emma T
If you don't have a dream; how you gonna have a dream come true?

robert waddell

  • Guest
Re: Nose rings
« Reply #10 on: November 17, 2010, 05:12:40 pm »
It will be interesting to see Adam's reply.On the subject of whipping or used as an encouragement. In pig showing with white pigs and lighter coloured pigs with constant tapping on their right shoulder you can visible see bruising if the classes drag on for ages with no objections from fellow competitors or members of the public our only experience of ringed pigs were kune kunes which we no longer have electric fences are essential at keeping stock separate it is better a quick jolt rather than hung up on a six wire fence and possible having to destroy your stock.     

oaklandspigs

  • Joined Nov 2009
  • East Sussex
    • OaklandsPigs
Re: Nose rings
« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2010, 05:20:21 pm »
I do not favour nose ringing, I think pigs should be allowed to root.

I did buy a sow (Dorris!) from a place where they ring because they are on SSSI land and it is part of their arrangements.  She was over 2 months in pig, so I continued with the ring until after weaning, and then removed it. It came out very easily with bolt croppers when she was asleep, but I didn't want to risk bolt croppers when she was pregnant or with young.

When she did have the ring, she seemed quite content, and did "nose" around loose earth, but not dig.  She now digs like a good-un !



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waterhouse

  • Guest
Re: Nose rings
« Reply #12 on: November 17, 2010, 05:25:59 pm »
One gets on tricky ground when trying to make things "natural".  What is natural in stabling a horse, but my guys queue up at the gate wanting to come in.  I suspect the woolly sheep is an consequence of selective breeding given that pretty much everything similar moults.

All farming is exploitative either of the soil or of animals but I think we have all gone too far to reverse out of it!  The humane alternatives aren't always better - having seen my Jack Russell in action with vermin I think his approach is considerably more humane than poisoning.

I don't approve of docking a gun dog's tails but then I don't shoot and I know there's another side to the argument.  Where it definitely goes wrong is docking an animal destined to be a household pet to meet a breed standard.

I think one has to have one's own moral standards, one of which has to be that other people think differently.


Eve

  • Joined Jul 2010
Re: Nose rings
« Reply #13 on: November 17, 2010, 09:09:58 pm »
You're right, especially on the breed standards thing, it's just that rooting is what a pig likes best after eating ;) It's just so big a part of them, their little tails waggle when they have their heads deep in mud  :pig:

And I'd love to borrow your Jack Russel to deal with some human vermin we have here, he's very welcome to deal with one of our neighbours! ;D ;D (She's only little, that neighbour, he'll find it an easy match!  ;D)

I'm looking forward to hearing what the reply to Pikilily's email will be, maybe the pigs were only temporarily on a different field - he's usually good, Adam, you saw the concern on his face when looking at that pig getting sunburnt in those horrible cages in the US a few weeks ago.






langdon

  • Joined Sep 2009
  • Pembrokeshire
  • The Happy Smallholder!
Re: Nose rings
« Reply #14 on: November 17, 2010, 09:25:32 pm »
 HERE HERE
we all ove sitting down to watch countryfile esp Adam as he so concerned with the wellbeing of livestock.
and as you said the way those pigs were kept ( kids were shocked ) i dont think nose rings for good reasons are the worst when it
comes to animal welfare.
cant wait to read reply of that email :D
langdon :pig:






Langdon ;)

 

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