[shygirl]

im terrible at making bread. i tried a new recipe today with great hope but same old results.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/food/bread

the problem i have is it always rises great the first time but second time it doesnt. today it even seemed to shrink as there were wrinkles on the dough. it is still edible once cooked but isnt as big a loaf as it should be, and is quite heavy in weight and texture. its quite strong in taste too which i guess is down too it being too dense.

i thought maybe our house was too cold hence why it never rose very well but today was really warm so no excuses.
any ideas as we love making it but i dont know how to make it taste better.
thanks

[Greenerlife]

I depend on my breadmaker for most of my loaves and I have to say, it is extraordinarily good at making basic loaves.  However, I have made hand made bread many times over the years and I have to say practice is the answer!  The recipe you have used is by Paul Hollywood, and I use his recipes more than others as I find the results consistent.  It may be just down to the heat in your kitchen, or over proving first time around and exhausting the yeast.  I am sure you will enjoy the results anyway! If at first you don't succeed...

[lachlanandmarcus]

I only managed to start making consistently good bread when I started using fresh yeast, before that I found it very dispiriting. Mind you ive had to subscribe mail order to get the fresh yeast and it isn't cheap (altho you get loads).


I like the Bertinet bakery books, haven't had a failure yet with them and the books come with DVDs too.

[dyedinthewool]

I'm not sure why you are getting this problem   Shygirl I'm sure someone more experienced that me will come along with and explanation.  AHHH I see someone has....
 
I'm very much a novice at bread making and I had lots of disasters but I did find a 'sponge' bread recipe that seems to work -though we never get to eat it 'fresh'  I make it up through the day and cook them in the evening when the oven is then on, I make 4 loaves at a time and freeze them.
 
If you want the recipe I use email me.
 
I have found a fantastic soft roll recipe which are just like the ones from the supermarket.
 

[shygirl]

over proving first time around and exhausting the yeast. 

does that mean we overkneaded it or left it to rise too long the first time?

[Greenerlife]

I am not too good at diagnosing afterwards I am afraid!  I know when I see it in my loaves, but that is after having years of mixed results!  My advice to you wouldbe to take notes of what you did and what happened, then change one thing and measure any improvement.  I am pretty much always disappointed with my second rise - it is so difficult to "measure" twice the bulk isn't it?

[jaykay]

It's ages since I made bread (since becoming allergic to gluten  ) but from what I remember, what you're describing can come from insufficient kneading, leaving it to rise for too long the first time, and also problems with the yeast.

Are you using dried or fresh?

What are you doing to 'activate' it?

[shygirl]

we are using dried yeast. today was the fast acting one. (allinsons)
once wev kneaded it the first time, we cover it with oiled clingfilm for about an hour. this stage rises well. then we knead it again with a bit of flour, shape it and rest it again for an hour. this time it doesnt rise much.

[jaykay]

Well, for what it's worth:

I activate the yeast first, ie get it started, with a bit of sugar and some warm water.

I don't knead the second time, just 'knock it down', possible a couple of light kneads to distribute the gases.

Also, even a bit of added flour for kneading can make it too dry, which limits rising.

It's all trial and error, not suggesting these will work, just things to try.

[shygirl]

thanks jaykay. today was the first time we didnt put the yeast in sugar/water.
we will have another shot tomorrow...
sometimes i wish i had spent more time cooking with my mother than riding ponies , lol, thankgod for youtube 

[Fleecewife]

Is it white or wholemeal bread you are making?    Are you putting it in loaf tins or on a tray.   Wholemeal has a tendency to come out too heavy for various reasons, including as jaykay says adding too much flour to the board you are working on. The precise amount of water used is also crucial, and the miller - different flours have different characteristics.   Make sure your flour is not past it's sell-by-date, or the yeast.  Adding a 1/4 teaspoon of Vitamin C powder (the kind without added zinc) helps with the rise, but is hard to get as certain folk use it to cut drugs apparently.
 Using loaf tins helps the second rising to work better as it supports the shape.   Also be very careful not to bang the tins anywhere once the bread has risen, such as when you put them in the oven - this would cause the bread to flop.
 
I use a breadmaker now since we moved to our smallholding as our house is too cold to get a good rise with handmade dough.  I tried putting it near the fire but there was always a draft on one side.  I tried putting it on the boiler but it got cold coming down the corridor so tended to flump.

[gerpsych]

I know the feeling and had a couple of years of disappointing loaves. I now find that this mix give a really good white loaf (one big bloomer or two tin loaves). I use the breadmaker to make the dough with 600g flour, 360 ml tepid water, 1 tsp salt, 1 tsp sugar, 1 sachet yeast, 1 oz lard. Then I knock this back and knead it again. Previously I was always a bit scared to do this second kneading properly (it seemed a waste to get rid of all that "rising") but it really is part of the key to the success. Then into the oven for 35-40 mins.

[MikeM]

I se a similar method to jaykay and use the allinsons yeast and generally get good results. I try to warm everything that will touch the yeast, the bowl it is mixed in, the flour etc. The 1st knead is important, you want to be able to stretch out the dough a good foot or more, then leave to rise somewhere warmish. I try to make the mix as wet as I can, and add flour to get it right as I knead. You want it so that it's only just not sticking to your hands, experience will help you with this. Then I knock back and only leave to rise again while the oven heats up. It is a lot denser than shop bread, but that's cos they put all manner of stuff in it to make it all fluffy like that.
HTH

[shygirl]

YIPPEE  i have done it! for the first time ever, iv made bread that would not smash a window!
the problem was my dough was too dry. we did have a couple that dropped when i tried to score the top before baking, dont know how to solve that problem, but if i dont touch it and just bake it, it comes out perfect, light and fluffy.

only technical hitch is im not keen on the flavour, maybe more salt would help. maybe i will get used to it.
we used morrisons strong white bread flour, and vegetable oil instead of butter.

[gerpsych]

YIPPEE  i have done it! for the first time ever, iv made bread that would not smash a window!
the problem was my dough was too dry. we did have a couple that dropped when i tried to score the top before baking, dont know how to solve that problem, but if i dont touch it and just bake it, it comes out perfect, light and fluffy.

only technical hitch is im not keen on the flavour, maybe more salt would help. maybe i will get used to it.
we used morrisons strong white bread flour, and vegetable oil instead of butter.

Llongyfarchiadau !

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