[colliewoman]

RIght I'm gonna go straight in with the statement .......


I don't like docking.


I have worked on an off in kennels since I was 13.


I have seen more hounds  (especially greyhounds) than any other type of dog with tail injuries but they don't get docked. Spaniels have really long ears and last I checked tend to go head first into brash?
I honestly don't get it?


I was always taught that docking was brought about to denote a commoners dog from the gentry's status symbol dogs hence the reason for docking terriers and spaniels but not hounds etc.


But having drunkenly poked a hornets nest (I may have had a few crabbies ginger beers before typing this )
I will say that so long as it is done properly then it shouldn't make much difference to the dog.


Would I dock? nope, but then I have collies so don't have to think about it.
Would I dock my sheep? nope but then I have primitives with short tails so don't have to think about it.


Should I shut up now and go to bed? quite possibly

[doganjo]

I was always taught that docking was brought about to denote a commoners dog from the gentry's status symbol dogs hence the reason for docking terriers and spaniels but not hounds etc.

OK, so what do you make of the Brittany - deliberately bred for short tails by the English Gentry going to France on shooting holidays?

Otherwise I more or less agree with you, even without the Crabbies  . 

At 2 days a pup hardly knows what is going on and will squeal because it has been taken from it's Mum rather than beacuse it's tail has been cut  off, but that doesn't really apply to a sheep - and I believe they are docked later than up to 5 days? 


www.aberdon.org.uk

[in the hills]

My father used to work Flat coated retrievers ...... they have constantly wagging tails. One of his dogs that never had problems with tail damage when working, developed awful problems when he retired and came to live with us as a house dog. He wagged so vigorously that the end was always splitting as it hit furniture. Blood everywhere .... you would have thought there had been a massacre.    We had to secure a piece of hose pipe over the end of his tail on many occasions to protect it so that it could heal. What a sight 

[SallyintNorth]

At 2 days a pup hardly knows what is going on and will squeal because it has been taken from it's Mum rather than beacuse it's tail has been cut  off, but that doesn't really apply to a sheep - and I believe they are docked later than up to 5 days? 

Legally it's up to 7 days for a lamb, Annie.  Most sheepkeepers ring tails within the first 48-72 hours, and, done right, they mostly don't seem to feel it, or may wriggle their tails for a few seconds.  Every now and again you do get one seems to feel it more but it does wear off quickly.

I haven't witnessed a pup getting docked, so I can't compare. 

[Moleskins]

I haven't witnessed a pup getting docked, so I can't compare.

I hesitated at starting this thread because it could be contentious, however I'm glad I did because there've been some good replies.


I've done my lambs and I held the pups when they were done. I can only say there wasn't any noticeable difference to me, they both get upset more because they've been taken from their Mum.
I would never advocate docking dogs ourselves, I consider the vet I went to to have been excellent. I also think he was right to get me to hold them, on two counts really, firstly so that I could see they weren't hurt and secondly because if I'm asking for it to be done I should have to be part of it.
Nothing I've seen and nothing I've read has made me have second thoughts, I'm pleased to say. 


I've had Cockers in the past with anal gland probs. never thought it might be down to tail being too short.


If a list of things that were cruel to animals were made this would, IMHO be more towards the bottom ( NO pun intended )
If a list of things that were beneficial to animals were made it probably wouldn't be at the top but it could well be up there.
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[SallyintNorth]

I hesitated at starting this thread because it could be contentious, however I'm glad I did because there've been some good replies.

I was very glad you started the thread, moley.       You'd mentioned docking in another thread and it was a great decision to open a separate thread for any discussion that may arise on this potentially emotive topic.

I for one feel far more informed about this issue than I did before and I am very grateful for all those who shared their knowledge, views and experiences - all of us, I thought, without tipping over into preaching or proselytising.  Well done all of us!   

[colliewoman]

OK, so what do you make of the Brittany - deliberately bred for short tails by the English Gentry going to France on shooting holidays?

 
Errr......
 

[Rosemary]

I have no view to offer - we have collies that carry their tails low, so it's not an issue.

But I WOULD like to thank all the contributers to what could have been a contentious and emotive thread for behaving well. You are a wonderful example of how a forum should be conducted.

Thank you 

[Moleskins]

 

[doganjo]

   See  I TOLD you I'd be a good girl if I came back on!     For a while anyway 

[doganjo]

I knew there was something else I wanted to say - most vets cut the pups tails.  Mine always banded them, same as sheep.  Never any problems. 
I reckon the folkies that wanted docking banned thought they were chopped off with a  carving knife 

[omnipeasant]

I can sort of see the point of taking spaniel tails, but also agree that labradors have the most enthusiatic tail of any breed I have owned, perhaps docking to stiop things flying off the coffee table might be considered !

My argument would be for terriers. I have always had Jack Russels with a tail. Can't see the point in taking it off unless someone thinks it looks neater. But the same principal would have been used for hogging and docking cobs. At least the mane grows back. I would hate Poppy to not have the chance to express herself fully by wagging her tail.

And dew claws. I saw a video recently showing gundogs using their dew claws to scramble out of icy water onto the ice.  The ones without dewclaws could not retrieve the bird that had fallen on the ice across some water. So think about that one. I was amazed.

[doganjo]

Mine also use their dewclaws to climb fences!

[deepinthewoods]

i think i was told once that lurchers had had their tails bred to 'flag' where they were in the brush, often with a white tip. i cant get my head around docking either. it seems some dogs have  tails left on to be a help when hunting but others have them docked, also to be a help when hunting?

[thenovice]

When terriers used to go to ground, i would have thought they could have damaged them underground whilst wagging and baying at the fox