[Frieslandfilly]

Does anyone regularly have to look after and bottle feed puppies from a day old? if so i could use some advice

Yesterday a friend who was looking after some dogs while the owner was away found 8 puppies in the kennel, she went back later in the day to find them outside and left by the mother, they tried to get the mother to engage but she would not. So we now have 4 of the puppies here and 4 are at another house being bottle fed.

I am not clueless in the matter of rearing puppies but one of them just cries ALL the time, even after he has been fed, had his toilet seen to (by stimulation) and even stroking or cuddles do not pacify. They have a heat lamp that they can get under or not depending if they are hot or cold, we have also tried a hot water bottle to no avail. Any idea on what we may be missing out?? Luckily I do have the time today and they are being fed on demand so it's not that, it was crying all night and it's crying all day with only little naps in between, the other 3 are fine and snuggled up sleeping nicely. I know that in amoungst the other 4 is also one that does this, it does  not appear to be in pain, just whinging!! I am at a loss

[Jackie]

Probably stomach ache. Feed once every 4 hours and use lamb replacer or goats milk or puppy orphan milk.
I use a baby bottle not a puppy bottle but then I have golden retriever pups as there is less air in a baby bottle.

Have you tried smearing chocolate spread over the pups bums so mum can clean them? She will only need to do this a couple of times and if where the pups are is very quiet then she will take to the pups. Feed mum in the whelping box to encourage her to return to the pups.

I try to make the whelping box rather like a cave by putting blankets over the top to darken it down as in the wild this is the type of place the bitch would choose to give birth.

Mum and pups need to be in a warm, quiet and darkened area of the house and only 1 person to go in to help with the pups.

[Frieslandfilly]

Hi Jackie

We have replacement milk and the tiny little bottles, i did think that the teats are not quite right for them so probably will try baby bottle, it did occur to me that it's tummy might hurt (maybe colic type pains) but not sure what to do about it. The mother is a definate no no, we tried all sorts for a few hours but sadly she does not want to know. One of the other puppies being looked after elsewhere has since died, but these all seem fine at the moment, noisy and active, the noisy one does seem to like being rocked genlty like a baby so it could be tummy ache.

Dawn

[doganjo]

Hi Jackie

We have replacement milk and the tiny little bottles, i did think that the teats are not quite right for them so probably will try baby bottle, it did occur to me that it's tummy might hurt (maybe colic type pains) but not sure what to do about it. The mother is a definate no no, we tried all sorts for a few hours but sadly she does not want to know. One of the other puppies being looked after elsewhere has since died, but these all seem fine at the moment, noisy and active, the noisy one does seem to like being rocked genlty like a baby so it could be tummy ache.

Dawn

I take it the pups got colostrum?  Can't you hold the bitch down and let the pups get some natural milk from her?  Even muzzle her if she is likely to bite them.  Sometimes you have to be cruel to be kind.  I assume the owners were stupid enough not to know their bitch was in season nor to know she was in whelp so she won't have had the normal good care that a breeder would have given her.  Tell them they must educate themselves on caring for a dog before having another one, and that they must have this bitch spayed as soon as possible after parturition, after having her checked over by their vet.  Sorry but I feel very strongly about negligence like this.  To go away on holiday and leave a dog in this condition is disgraceful - what did they think?  That she had suddenly got very fat? | Why? Don't they exercise her or is she overfed? I'm going to stop now as I'm so angry.  My apologies don't mean to rant but dogs are very special to me.

[Sandy]

My heart goes out to the little pups, I hope they make it, poor little mites....

[Frieslandfilly]

I understand completely how you feel, no they didn't know she was in pup, and no they didn't get colostrum, the girls minding her didn't realise that this would be vital, also the puppies got very cold during the first day as they assumed that the mother would take care of them but she didn't. They were born in an outside kennel and unfortunately 3 have now died, we still have ours under a heat lamp which is probably what is keeping them hanging on although I can detect a rattle in the chest when they drink their bottles. We are doing what we can for them and hoping they make it through tomorrow until the owner gets home (he went to a family funeral though not on hols). I don't know him, but the girls are hoping that he finds an adoption home for them that specialises in their breed which is White German Shepherd, which they also inform me is quite controversial among Shepperd breeders! Poor little things I hope they make it against all the odds and I will do my damnedest to make sure they get the best care possible.
Dawn

[knightquest]

Well done Dawn. They are obviously in the best possible hands. Good luck to you and the pups.

Yes, white gsd's are frowned on and long coated ones too  To me, a dog is a dog and I get very disillusioned with breeders sometimes. Anyhow, that's another topic. Sorry.

Hope the pups pull through 

Ian

[Jackie]

Get the vet to check the pups chest of it rattles, it could be pneumonia. This is an emergency!

And yes white GSD's are not welcome according to the breed standard. Actually in dogs white is an absence of colour.

I have 2 long coated GSD's

[Frieslandfilly]

Update:
Sadly the puppies have all been put to sleep, of the original 8 there were only 4 still alive this afternoon, they went to the vet and his recomendation was to put them to sleep as they were unlikely to make it. A great shame but we did the best we could for them and enjoyed thier company while they were here.
Dawn

[jameslindsay]

That's sad news, I am sorry.

[doganjo]

Maybe the best thing.  If the owner knows so little about dogs he/she would have had difficulty finding the right homes for the pups.  And tell the owner to get that bitch spayed if he/she can't tell when she's in season.  It's a damn shame letting her go through 9 weeks of pregnancy for this to happen.  Poor wee mites!
Sorry for the rant again - I'm passionate about dogs. My apologies.

[Frieslandfilly]

I understand how you feel but as I don't know much about the circumstances I cant judge, I think the bitch is being looked over by the vet too so maybe that is a decision they will make then.

[Sandy]

So very sad, believe it or not I realy hoped they would make it but in my heart I know they wound't!! If left to nature they would have died sooner or been something elses dinner.....horrid but so true..I was upset when two of our pups died and was angry with myself for days, but, the cycle of life continues......hope someone has learnt a valuable lesson!!! (not  you but the owners)

[knightquest]

Well done for trying your best. Sounds like they had the best possible chance with you.

It's always sad when things like this happen.

Run free little pups.

Ian

[Jackie]

Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Now I'm angry!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Lazy, ignorant, stupid, bloody people!!!!! (the owners I mean)

And that vet needs shooting too!!

THERE ARE GERMAN SHEPHERDS RESCUE SOCIETIES THAT WOULD HAVE TAKEN THOSE PUPS TO REAR. <----  the vet would have known this!

In fact I would have taken them and reared them as I do have the facilities and the knowledge, I really wish you had said something before putting them to sleep. 

I'm not blaming you in any way Frieslandfilly, I'm mad at the owners, the vet and the situation. You did the best you could and much more than most people would do, you put yourself out to help these babies.

 Some people should just not own dogs, in fact if they were near me I would report them for cruelty cos what they did was extremely cruel to the bitch and the pups.