[graham-j]

How many breeding ewes would you put on 30 acres of poor to fair grazing, allowing enough grass to feed the resulting lambs.

Regards Graham

[fsmnutter]

Depends a lot on where you are in the country, climate, type of grazing/soil/slope of the land, breed of sheep, what you intend to do with the lambs - sell store or fat, or keep through winter to hogget.

[graham-j]

I'm in the south-east,looking at commercial ewes ,lambing early finishing the lambs and getting them in to the market before winter.
But am open to any plan.

[pharnorth]

Canterbury conditions aren't very different to here so you may struggle with grass growth rates June to August as it can be very dry?  You may be able to go a bit more towards higher stocking levels if you can rest and rotate but otherwise if a typical breeding ewe and lambs is 0.15 LSUs then 40 to 50 ewes assuming stock carrying capacity 0.2 to 0.26 LSU/ acre?

And now for the knowledgeable replies.....

[farmers wife]

well as long as you are allowing for rotation - utter madness to plonk  ewes and lambs in one field for a full length of time.  We mob graze here with electric fence.  They (100ish)are moved along once a week they can strip the grass (say 4 acres) and as you say poor land you really arent aiming for quality fat thriving lambs. Worm burden and mineral deficiencies are one to watch for also dependant on the breed of sheep.


6-10 ewes per acre on productive grass. However it doesn state the length of time on an acre before its mowed down to bear soil. Grass stopped growing on Nov and only came back in May here so half the year our cows were in (I know thats cows but proves a point) our sheep have a lot of grazing due to being understock.


Sheep are fickle to any deficiencies in the ground and poor grazing wont help. Sheep are also poor at being controlled with electric fence system we have to use 4 strings!  You'll be seriously struggling to rotate grazing as grazed area needs 3 months to recover (worms etc) think poor lambs would be struggling to be thriving on that area. Unless you manage the land the lambs could have a worm burden. poor land opens up issues on selenium and cobalt.


ALso consider the land poaching in very wet weather (Nov - March!) that land will struggle to regrow.  Saying that I know plenty of people who keep sheep on fresh air around here I just dont get it however the poor lamb thrive rate % is poor, deaths in gen high, orf high and open cheque books into wormer and heptovac P.

[farmers wife]

I just looked up for length of time and found 14 acres 200 sheep for 1 week. So I find it impossible to get a good figure however I'd gauge a low number like 20 max (plus 20 followers) that may be pushing it.  Im sure someone can work something out for you.


Can you let us know what figure you are looking at?

[Foobar]

I suppose it depends on what you class as poor/fair grazing?


0.08 LSU for a commercial ewe, 0.04 per lamb from birth to fat/store, so average 0.15 per "family" (so some twins, some singles).


I would estimate 0.2 LSU per acre in summer, assuming you can rotate (say at least 6 paddocks).  Which would give you 40 ewes (incl their lambs) [30acres x 0.2LSU = 6LSU, 6LSU / 0.15LSU = 40].  Better to have too much grass than too little, then you can adjust in the following years.


If you are expecting lots of triplets then you need to allow for that and drop the number of ewes.


You should get a forage analysis done and see what minerals you are short of. Then bolus the ewes and bolus the lambs when they are old enough, as appropriate.  It will make big difference.

[henchard]

The more important question is winter or summer?

In winter you never have enough grass, in summer often too much.

[Marches Farmer]

Is it a new ley (probably Italian rye grass + white clover) or an old one, or ancient meadow?  The last two will cope better with a dry summer.  Don't know what the soil's like around your area but here on heavy clay we don't want grass cropped too short as the sheep can ingest a proportion of soil, which is high in manganese and iron, which in turn inhibits copper uptake.

[juliem]

I rent out to someone with 25 breeding ewes so together with lambs..tup theres usually about 50 on 12 acres of land.Plenty of grass in the summer..The ewes have a nice 4 acre field of abundant grass which has been allowed to grow most of the summer  from Nov.this usually lasts to Jan when hay has to be bought.The lambs are left to finish off the other 8 acres during the winter...
I have noticed far too much grass this year....I sometimes practice my golf but after May I loose too many balls.
I think my land is a bit too good for sheep.

[juliem]

I am here in  Shropshire...my little fields surrounded by arable farmers...who have huge fields having removed hedges

[graham-j]

Hi, this land used to be used for grazing cattle but has not had anything on it for two or 3 year,so when I say poor I mean neglected and when I say fair I mean it used to hold cattle.It has just been completely left and Ragwort will need to be delt with first.
I was looking at around 40 ewes total,starting off lower and building up as the grass improves through grazing.I all ready have a mixed small holding with 23 ewe but have outgrown what I all ready have.

[landroverroy]

You should have no problem with 40 ewes. Best to understock initially and maybe cut the surplus, while you find out what the land will support. You will find the sheep will get rid of the ragwort in spring as they eat the crowns out of the new plants and kill them before they get established.
Your lambs should do particularly well in the first year as nothing fattens lambs better than fresh clean grass, ie grass that has had no sheep on for several years and therefore carries no ovine worms.

[graham-j]

I hear so much conflicting advice when it comes to ragwort and sheep.so are you saying its not toxic when the new shoots come up in the spring.
What would you suggest I do with this land right now it is split into 5 or 6 fields. I was thinking of topping it and removing as much of the ragwort as I can either manually or spot spraying and then getting some sheep on it fairly soon afterwards.Fencing is there but will require maintenance.

Regards Graham

[pharnorth]

Your plan sounds good to me. The ewe numbers seem sensible and should b easy enough to flex up or down from 40 as you can't be far off the right number for your patch. I have also read that ragwort is not particularly toxic to sheep- though what that means I done know. Certainly the big issue is horses with ragwort. We are doing very similarly with a field that is just coming into use as you suggest, it has just been topped having pulled all the visible ragwort first and we are going to get some sheep on it as soon as it is fenced. It will be sprayed early summer prior to some horses going on.