[Marches Farmer]

I was sure someone on here could fill me in on the rules on puppy farming.  Not that I want to - oh, no - but we're concerned at the growing number of dogs someone down the lane from us appears to have and have seen ads for pups around the local shops which we think may be theirs.  Not friendly folk, nor kind to their animals as far as we can tell, so unsure of how to find out and how to stop it.  Any info or ideas most welcome.

[Jukes Mum]

Despicable practice. You could ask the council if they have any requirements.
Little more you can do unless they are actually cruel then you could try involving the RSPCA.
Name and shame?

[doganjo]

There seem to be no rules/regulations, no control. 

 Contact Dog warden if you believe there are nuisance issues: 
 Contact RSPCA  AND Police, AND Local Council (or SSPCA, if you are in scotland) if you believe there are cruelty issues.

You need to have a strong heart and if possible photos or recordings - sometimes subterfuge is necessary - pretext of wanting a dog/pup, or send a willing friend in - two people so one distracts while the other uses phone camera?

We persevered with one couple and got them taken to court, stopped breeding, dogs rehomed  or in some cases put out of their misery

Makes me so mad! 

[Jukes Mum]

Well done you Doganjo!

[Mammyshaz]

Trading standards have also been known to get involved but I think a person not happy with the purchase needs to be involve.

There is a house well known in the northeast. RSPCA have been in numerous times with police but still unable to shut it down. Seen someone recently who went for one designer breed but was handed a different Breed at the door. ( not invited in ) they were given one of each sex from the litter to 'breed' together   

Unbelievable, but too often so are the people who buy the pups, funding the squirms who breed them!!

[Old Shep]

well done Marches Farmer for wanting to do something.  This practice is making life hell for lots of dogs for lots of reasons in this country.  Cariad http://cariadcampaign.wordpress.com/ are a group formed just to stamp this out.  You could contact them for their help, I'm sure they would be glad to oblige.  They are a very reputable outfit and have MP's supporting them (you wouldn't have to worry about your postman delivering ticking packages to your neighbours if you know what I mean).  The other tack would be your local dog warden - some are very good, some are useless!

[cuckoo]

The relevant legislation is the breeding and sale of dogs (welfare) act 1997 - if someone breeds 4 or more litters any 12 month period they must be licenced by the LA.  In reality this is hard to police and requires evidence from say the KC of litters registered - harder if unregistered litters or crossbreeds.  Under the animal welfare act people have a duty of care to meet all their animals needs (section 9) and section 4 makes it an offence to cause unnecessary suffering - both of which might be applicable.  If there are genuine concerns that either of these legislations have been breached then I would contact LA Licencing section (look up on the LA website to see if they are licenced - many publish this data) and the RSPCA - they are likely to do a joint visit and the LA inspector will have the same power under the animal welfare act as a police officer.

[Marches Farmer]

Thank you all, that's very helpful.  I think I'll monitor the situation for a while and try to keep a note or two.  One of the dogs that's whelped is the most nervous dog I've ever encountered - a German Shepherd bitch - and I think to breed from her is so irresponsible.

[PipSqueak]

They are cracking down on dog breeding bringing in undeclared income at present, so if you believe the family is claiming benefits call the "whistleblower" line and they will take action. A friend of mine does this regularly on her estate and the authorities really do act on it.

[doganjo]

They are cracking down on dog breeding bringing in undeclared income at present, so if you believe the family is claiming benefits call the "whistleblower" line and they will take action. A friend of mine does this regularly on her estate and the authorities really do act on it.

or HMRC!     The tax man loves a cheater whether on benefits or not.  I'd bet my last pound that they don't submit returns! or even keep books!  I got shot at and blocked by a previous forum member for saying this ('guilty as charged m'lud')  - but to be honest if someone isn't paying their taxes then i am subsidising them so I'd do it!

[Pam Caulfield]

Hi Marches Farmer,

Would you mind messaging me? I am a journalist at BBC Hereford and Worcester and am interested in puppy farms.

Many thanks,

Pam

[Me]

To play Devils Advocate for a moment - not all puppy farms are bad - just nearly all! I have visited one which seemed to be doing a good job for all the animals young and old I must admit I could not find fault.

 

[doganjo]

As I said - if you have suspicions phone HMRC whistle blower line.  They'll check if the animals are being well looked after or not and call in appropriate authorities if not.

[Kimbo]

To play Devils Advocate for a moment - not all puppy farms are bad - just nearly all! I have visited one which seemed to be doing a good job for all the animals young and old I must admit I could not find fault.

Me, my first reaction to your post was one of " I cannot disagree more", but after a bit of thought here is my view. I know a fair bit about this issue as I support CARIAD and have an rescued puppy farm dog myself.

Firstly, the term "puppy farm", or "puppy mill" as they call them in USA, can be a bit misleading. There are good and responsible breeders who breed more than 4 litters of puppies a year, so they do need to be licensed but I would not describe them as puppy farmers, and neither does CARIAD. I am positively not against dog breeding. Im a dog lover so of course dogs have to be bred otherwise I couldn't have one as a pet. This isn't about responsible dog breeding.
I would describe a puppy farm as a place where dogs are treated purely as breeding machines, where they get little if any human contact, are not socialised, receive little veterinary care and are simply tools for profit. And I don't think that there is any way that such a place can be said to be even OK, let alone good. So, Me, I sincerely hope that the place you visited ( they don't usually encourage visitors tho) was not one of those.

My dog was in a puppy farm in Carmarthenshire for her 1st 5 years. She will have been mated in her 1st season and bred from twice a year until the size of her litters dropped to an "uneconomic" level. If she hadn't gone to a rescue at that stage she would have been summarily dispatched. Don't be under any illusion that a vet would have gently put her to sleep; that costs the puppy farmer money he cant recover.
Our dog came to us 4 years ago as a very underweight nervous wreck. She is still afraid of nearly all humans, loud noises, doorways, gates, sweeping brushes and feet. It took her 3 years to learn any sort of house-training and even now is not reliable in that. She is now obsessively attached to me, to the point that she has separation anxiety; but at least she trusts one human being so we forgive her this.
I cannot tell you how many tears I have shed over this poor damaged dog and the nightmare life she led.

Would I take on another ex-puppy farm dog? Yes; in a heartbeat. Why? Because until our useless/grasping/waste of money MPs show some compassion and ban puppy farming someone has to help those dogs who actually survive their wretched years in slavery.

[Me]

I have seen the inside of a fair few such places of varying standards and this was certainly the best - and happy for me to wander around. They certainly do appear to care about their animals... and there is no question that they do spend on Veterinary input. Whether there are nasty things I do not know about hidden away I cannot say. The ones that worry me are a lot more secretive.