[amesy]

Hi everyone

A bit background: we used to have 2 pygmy(crossed with a mystery breed) wethers, sadly the youngest of the pair had to be put down last March due to arthritis that eventually just crippled him so we decided to do the kindest thing. His older brother however is still going and is nearing 13 years old. When his brother died he understandably got very depressed, lost a lot of weight and truth be told I didn't think we would get him through the winter. But with a lot of TLC we have and hes coming back to his old self...slightly.

But I have a few questions that I was hoping you guys might be able to help me with as the internet has so far been very vague.

1. Obviously, since his brother and life long companion died he has been very lonely, getting another goat is, for various reasons not an option and he would not cope with being moved somewhere else, I'm sure this will stress him out more. So does anyone have any ideas how to cheer him up? I spend as much time as I can with him but with the weather so bad and I work full time it's become really hard so he spends a lot of time in his house on his own. (They did have a field but went in there once, broke out and refused to go back..grazing isn't really his 'thing')

2. I really want to make sure his diet is supporting him in the best way possible. Currently he is having:

Hay - unlimited good quality but he is very fussy and really doesn't eat much. I have tried haylage and alfalfa but he's not keen

A mix of D&H pygmy feed, haygates feed and molassed Allen and Page (he won't eat just one on it's own...) And he has been having outshine to help get the weight back on but I'm worried that's too heavy for him and he's gone off that too now...

In addition he has glucosamine sulphate, mint powder, molasses and either linseed or soya oil. He also gets fruit, veg and leaves mixed in to keep it interesting.

This is fed twice a day. At the moment he is on a lot of grain because that is all he will eat and he loses too much weight for me to cut it down, but I would really like to.

Does anyone have any 'essential' supplements he could have to keep him in tip-top condition? Or any feeding advise. He is literally the fussiest goat ever though so it's very much trial and error with what he will and won't eat.

Finally, he has recently been having small nose bleeds, on close inspection his nose inside isn't inflammed, cut or in anyway abnormal, just like a bit of bloody mucus has come out. Has anyone come across this before?

Sorry for all the questions, I'm just at a loss with him on many accounts.

Thanks in advance!

Amy

[Lesley Silvester]

Sorry to hear about the problems you are having. He probably is lonely, poor boy. Are there  no other animals nearby that he can see? Have you thought about getting another elderly boy in for company for him. I know you say it's not an option but just wondered.


For putting on weight, I've always found sugar beet helps. I use pellets that are soaked but others prefer shreds as they don't need soaking.


Rereading your post, I see he is 13 and I wonder if he is just nearing the end of his life and going down slowly. I don't know if pygmies live longer than dairy goats but it seems to be a good age. Do you have a good vet who you could ring for a chat?

[amesy]

Thank you It breaks my heart, he's such a big part of the family and after losing one I will do everything I can to give him the best chance. He's not overly sociable with other animals, my sisters puppy tries to play with him when she's here but he ignores her. We're in a fairly crop farming area so there aren't really any other goats or sheep around and as he's never been exposed to other herds before I'm not sure it would be the wisest thing to do at his age. There are horses but...well he isn't overly social. If we could I would get another one in a heartbeat but for many reasons we can't, it's mainly because he's at my parents house and mum is adament we can't get another one and I have yet to win that fight unfortunately.

Do you know which producers make shreds and which is better? I like the idea of soaking as he does like warm water mixed with its food when it's cold so I could soak that in warm water for him.

I also thought that, especially when his brother passed but over the summer he really perked up and he is still fairly active, he comes out in the garden, he wonders around, hes always up for play fighting (sadly my legs usually arent...) but since the weather turned he spends most of the day alone and I wasn't sure if there was anything we could do for entertainment - he doesn't climb like he used to so that's not really something we could do.

There aren't any specialist livestock vets around the area, mostly equine and small animal, we do have a small animal vet that treat him really well but they're also at a loss with this. I did wonder if it was just where he was headbutting things a bit roughly but it's become too common for it to be that.

I just want to do everything I can for him, especially when he looks so sad.

[ballingall]

It's really hard when this kind of situation happens. Whereabouts are you? I am wondering if it might be possible to borrow a goat? I can see why your mum might not want another one, as for all she knows the same thing might happen- you get another goat and in 6 months time he dies, and you are left with another lonely goat. But if you could arrange a borrow, or a loan agreement, would you mum be happier with that, knowing the new arrival can go back if they don't get on, or if your old boy doesn't make it. I would try soaking sugar beet for him, you can get mixes with bran as well as beet pulp for soaking too.


We feed flaked barley, it is also good for adding weight.


Beth

[amesy]

I'm in Cambridgeshire, and it's not so much that she's worried about having one after the other, she's just a bit funny about animals, she likes them, just from a distance and not near the house (Will lives in our garden in a big pen). I did suggest borrowing one from woodgreen but she won't have it, her solution was to send him away but he's been with us since he was a kid and we're part of his 'herd' so I'm sure that will stress him out way more, and he's a very dominant wether so if he was put with a herd or another goat it would be tough on him to keep his position at his age. It's pretty much a no go, no matter how hard I try it would be the ideal solution to borrow an older one though.

Do you know who sells flaked bran? Also is there a quick soak option? I know it's 24 hours for horses but is there a quicker one - mainly for convenience and so it can still be warm when he has it?

Thanks for you help! It's very much appreciated!


Also does anyone know if Caprivite is still the best complete supplement -I've heard it's become outdated.

[Lesley Silvester]

I use sugar beet pellets as they take up less space for storage. I pour boiling water over them in the bucket and give it five minutes before adding the rest of the concentrates. It is pretty swollen by this time and it makes the food warm. They do like it a bit warmer in winter - don't blame them.

If he perked up in the summer after losing his brother then it's less likely to be the loneliness. Of course it could just be the miserable weather getting him down.

If your vets can't suggest anything, I don;t know what else you can do.

Caprivite is excellent. I had mine on another mineral mix but changed to Caprivite about a year ago and my milker's yield increased. They do revise what they put in at intervals to keep up with current needs. You could always ring them if you want to ask anything. I've always found them very helpful.

[amesy]

Thank you! Just ordered some caprivite so hopefully that will help and I'm seeing my feed man on Saturday to get some sugar beet.

I'm hoping it's just the weather that's got him down as the summer following us having Ben put down he was out all day, sunbathing, foraging and following us around. He was a lot happier than now but with this weather, I don't blame him!

Thanks again, fingers crossed we can just get him through to the warmer weather!

[Brucklay]

Just another wee thing, my pygmy's love Ready Grass, basically dried grass, I feed it as a treat through the winter when they are not grazing/browsing much.


I know where your coming from re his sociability - I have 13 goats, yet one keeps herself to herself for some unknown reason - I could never rehome her - I do think I am her herd.

[benkt]

Hi Amesy, Where abouts in Cambs are you? - might be able to suggest a goaty vet nearer to you.  I'm just north of Cambridge itself and we use Isle vets in Ely who do a good job with ours. But other folk in Cambs Goat Keepers Society might be able to suggest alternatives nearer you. Hope you get him cheered up - its miserable for all of  our lot whilst this rain keeps up!
Ben

[tizaala]

Have you drenched him with a vitamin /mineral drench, as a pick-me -up ? just 10ml once a month does wonders for them , goats need copper so get one with some included , sheep drenches won't have it.

[shygirl]

speedibeet is shreds of sugarbeet (aimed at horse market) which soaks in ten minutes. its low sugar though so may not suit you if he is slim.

[Penninehillbilly]

Hi
have to say the bloody mucus doesn't sound good.
I feed sugar beet nuts, soaked but not 24hrs, overnight at the most, but usually about half hour, then its absorbed but still warm, main thing is so it doesn't swell on it's way down, or fed too much and it swells too much in their stomachs. Don't feed it TOO soggy, mine don't like it like that.
If you know anyone with horses try and buy some off them to see if he likes it?
 
I think horses need it soaked 24 hrs because they have different digestive systems.

[clydesdaleclopper]

I would think about cutting out the molasses as it's empty calories.


Another thing to think about is sprouting the grain that you feed. It makes it much more digestible.

[little blue]

bless him, poor old chap!
Hope he "perks up" ... it sounds a good age

[MelRice]

Dont forget that animals pick up on your moods too....if you are down they will join in the herd feeling.