Author Topic: Hello everyone - looking forward to sharing & learning (mostly learning!)  (Read 16723 times)

Pebbles

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Central Scotland
    • Ardunan Farm
    • Facebook
I'm so happy that you (Dan & Rosemary) have helped us all by starting this forum. I love your site and have been following it closely for nearly two years while 'MB' and I have been planning and looking forward to our own big adventure - you are inspiring. I started my own 'blog' back in February, but despite having loads to put on it, I just haven't had the time or applied myself the way you both have. I must start to record everything!

We are both miserable city dwellers who, for some time, have been looking forward to utilising the 22 acres of agricultural land we have in Stirlingshire. 'MB' has owned it for nearly 30 years and mostly rented it out to local farmers and stables, but now we're moving in (or on?) to it! We have spent the last year 'practicing' growing veggies, learning about the legislation, registering to keep animals and reading everything we can get our hands on to do with self sufficiency/ smallholdings/ farming/ +++

The land is surrounded by beautiful scenery, a stream runs down one length of it and we have 50% grazing and 50% woodland. Wild roe deer roam as do pheasants and hares. A static caravan has arrived; fencers have been working hard (now there is a job that makes money!); the old barn is being stripped down to 'rebuild' and we hope to have 30 ewes and a ram on part of it by........well, the end of this week actually!  :-\ After that will come the pigs - he wants Oxford Sandy and Blacks - I want Tamworths! Then the chickens, ducks, bees.......

We live in the west end of Glasgow, as although we have the caravan, we still need to sort it out with some water, power etc - anyone with knowledge or experience of wind turbines, please get in touch  :)

We spend as much time there as we can - which is going to increase drastically when the animals arrive! We were up there today planting fruit trees (the start of my orchard) and working out where we'll put the large wildlife pond.

The only downside to our master plan is that we may never get planning permission to build a home on it as the local council are extremely protective of their greenbelt land. Hopefully one day we will convince them that this is not just a bit of fun, but a real enterprise that we intend expand on and do full time. Hmmm? The thought of one day giving up the stressful job and long commute always puts a huge smile on my face ;D

So,"hello!" I am really looking forward to learning from all of your experiences and sharing my own.

Pebbles

Rosemary

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Barry, Angus, Scotland
    • The Accidental Smallholder
Hello, and welcome

The planning stuff is interesting and might be worth a topic on its own. We've considered trying to buy some agricultural land, working it then trying to make the case for building a house but I've spoken to our planners and they were less than supportive. And that's not a criticism of them as people - I know them as colleagues and have much respect for them. But the planning laws seem to make it very difficult to do this. One chap locally has recently had his application for a house turned down - he has 3.7 ha and has pigs - because the justification for house and the viability of the business is not clear.

I do have some sympathy with the planners insofar as I wouldn't want houses springing up all over the place either, so I can see the need for control but on the other hand...

Anyway, I hope you are successful - then you can tell us all how you did it!!

Rosemary

Fluffywelshsheep

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Near Stirling, Central Scotland
just a wee note have a look at the local freecycle group (yes am blowing my own trumpet). As you might find thing usefull or you might be able to move something you don't want.
Another note is has anyone consider planning permission for an eco-friendly house on the greenbelt? I not you have to pay more for eco-friendly material but if you can get them locally it might reduce the costs or you might be able to get free stuff from local builders that would otherwise be scrapped? (might be talking a load of rubbish. no pun intented , but might be something to be considered).
linz

jan

  • Joined Oct 2007
Re: Hello everyone - looking forward to sharing & learning (mostly learning!)
« Reply #3 on: November 06, 2007, 04:24:26 pm »
Hi pebbles, and a huge welcome.  Your plans sound fantastic, and I hope it works wonderfully for you both.  It is a shame about not being able to build?  Maybe dig under instead, then they cant complain!!!

Rosemary

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Barry, Angus, Scotland
    • The Accidental Smallholder
Re: Hello everyone - looking forward to sharing & learning (mostly learning!)
« Reply #4 on: November 06, 2007, 08:53:55 pm »
Like Bag End (sorry, big Lord of the Rings fan)

stephen

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Kent
Re: Hello everyone - looking forward to sharing & learning (mostly learning!)
« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2007, 10:07:01 am »
You could stay under planning permission! i know the apex of the roof if under 4 metres is under planning reg's but have forgotten about the total square footage! try the local councils website for the fottage, the way of getting around the building being classed as a permanant structure is to opt for something like a log cabin! they are naturally better insulated than a newly built house look nice and can be put up in weeks rather than months (sometimes days!) just a thought!

I dont know what the council is like where you are but i know that down here if we were going to live in a static (even for under a month) we would have to get some sort of planning permission to live in it! im soooo not a fan of red tape! i understand that there must be certain procedures and ways of doing things but im honestly getting really fed up with 'you have to fill this form out and send it back then wait for a year until we bother to look at it' or the normal one on the phone 'oh you've come through to the wrong person ill transfer you' and you get the same sentence over and over again!!! you have to do this do that and pay this and that grrrr i could go on for hours but ill resist the urge lol rant over!  ;D

Hilarysmum

  • Joined Oct 2007
Re: Hello everyone - looking forward to sharing & learning (mostly learning!)
« Reply #6 on: November 09, 2007, 11:49:00 am »
Sounds fantastic, good luck .  HM

Pebbles

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Central Scotland
    • Ardunan Farm
    • Facebook
Re: Hello everyone - looking forward to sharing & learning (mostly learning!)
« Reply #7 on: November 09, 2007, 03:58:53 pm »
Thanks everyone for the warm welcome.

The sheep have arrived (37 black faced ewes and 2 blue faced leicesters)! They have settled in very nicely. What a wonderful day and really interesting experience we had at Caledonia Auctions in Stirling. Having bought the sheep, I came away with a huge grin on my face that took a couple of days to shift  ;D

Thanks to one of Rosemary's diary entries we have also been to see (and reserve) two unregistered, but totally adorable, Oxford Sandy and Black gilts - they will be arriving around the 16th so we are busy building an ark and putting up some electric fencing.

We registered as a farm a few months ago and have all of our her/ flock numbers and paperwork. I am concentrating on staying very organised and hope I don't mess up on some simple, but important procedures.

We have started an orchard and planted a variety of apple, pear, cherry and plum trees - about twenty for the time being. I have a vision of it fenced of and in a couple of years surrounded by wild flowers and being a lovely location to site the bee hives.

As for the planning - we're in this for the long haul. I'm sure there will be many battles to be faught over the months and years, but I think we may just get there (got to be optimistic!). The static caravan isn't actually 'sited' as the Council keep telling us it is - it's just sort of parked and is predominately being used to keep equipment, tools and feed. We don't have it hooked up to electricity, water or a septic tank (yet!  ;))

I keep meaning to update our 'blog' but I have yet to figure out if I can 'backdate' some entries and therefore keep everything dated correctly.

I took some lovely photos of the sheep today and ended up with a great shot of them beside the caravan with a rainbows end touching it - maybe that's a good omen  :)

Pebbles

pattacat

  • Joined Nov 2007
Re: Hello everyone - looking forward to sharing & learning (mostly learning!)
« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2007, 12:01:05 pm »
Hi, I am in the process of moving to mid Wales to "live the dream" with a 7 acre smallholding. We live in a rural area now which we love but being home counties, no way can we afford land here!

We are looking forward to learning the language so we can understand what's being said about the England Rugby team and can't wait to make our home in such a beautiful and friendly area.

I have a question before we start though - I'd be really grateful if anyone in the same boat could advise..... My OH is retired and has a pension. We understand that by running the smallholding a a company, there may be some tax benefits. Does anyone have experience of this?

Thanks

field of dreams

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • strathaven
Re: Hello everyone - looking forward to sharing & learning (mostly learning!)
« Reply #9 on: November 14, 2007, 12:28:16 pm »
Hi

I was interested in reading about your intentions regarding building a house on your land we have similar hopes but also feel that it will be a long process. What is you blogg website address?

all the best

[email protected]

welshdragon

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Anglesey North Wales
Re: Hello everyone - looking forward to sharing & learning (mostly learning!)
« Reply #10 on: November 20, 2007, 09:30:48 pm »
Pattacat.
We are up at the north end of Wales on Anglesey so not a huge distance away. If you are a registered holding and have the appropriate number such as 65/109/0047 or something similar then it will stand you in good stead when applying for planning permission for buildings etc. As for making it into a company I am not sure of the benefits. However we run our place as a business and there are tax benefits in asmuch as any losses you make in setting the business up can be set against your tax liability on your private income. A local accountant will put you wise.
On that subject get local advice as to a good accountant as our first one skinned us and almost drove us to insolvency.Any other advice needed you are quite welcome to contact us.
Good luck.
WD

Rosemary

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Barry, Angus, Scotland
    • The Accidental Smallholder
Re: Hello everyone - looking forward to sharing & learning (mostly learning!)
« Reply #11 on: November 20, 2007, 10:01:41 pm »
There was an article in "Country Smallholding" a while back about maximising your income - well, really it was about making sure you pay the minimum tax possible. Things like - all expenses for your cats and dogs go against the business as your vermin control and security. If I can find it, I'll see what else was in it.

Pebbles

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Central Scotland
    • Ardunan Farm
    • Facebook
Re: Hello everyone - looking forward to sharing & learning (mostly learning!)
« Reply #12 on: September 23, 2010, 11:07:50 am »
Hi everyone,
It has been ages since I have posted anything on TAS as we have been so busy. Building our little farm from scratch has taken every bit of time we have but it's been worth it!
Here is an old post (my first on TAS) and quite a blast from the past. I hope it will give a little bit of hope to anyone who like us had a plan to get back to the land, be more self sufficient, rear animals and ultimately live on their land. We had that dream when we started....but we just had one tiny problem.....our land was clasified as greenbelt!! Let me tell you where we are now:
It has taken us nearly three years and we have come such a long way from our original 39 sheep and 2 pigs. We now have around 80 sheep, 6 sows (OSMs and Tamworths), 2 boars (1 of each!), currently 14 piglets with more on the way next week and then again next month, 30 meat birds, 35 turkeys, 25 ducks, 50 egg layers and a handful of silkies. We have built a huge polytunnel, are in the middle of rebuilding a big agricultural shed, we've got a large veg plot with 24 raised beds, a fruit cage containing another 12 raised beds, a small orchard and a couple of thousand potted Christmas trees....plus much more. We've built our own chicken houses and pig arks and have had a little bit of shelter from our now filthy static caravan. While continuing to live 8 miles from the farm we have travelled there every day in all weathers to help everything grow and develop little by little. We've often had to sleep in the caravan and even in our car when animals have been born. We've learned about best practices in animal husbandry and the treating of complications and ailments of all types of livestock. We've had the joy of seeing and assisting animals being born....and the sadness but satisfaction of seeing them off to market or slaughter. We've enjoyed the fruits of our labours and dispaired at our losses. We have developed a growing business selling our meat, eggs, livestock and veggies and after all of the money we have spent on this new venture we are at last starting to see some income. It has been hard hard work.
Now here is the BIG NEWS...after developing our business plan, three planning applications, four planning panels, two site visits and a hearing......we have been granted outline planning permission for an agricultural workers house on our farm  ;D it still hasn't sunk in!!!
We are now in the process of designing our farmhouse something that at times I thought we would never be able to do.
We couldn't have done this without the support of our family, work colleagues and friends (many of whom we've met here through TAS and Central Scotland Smallholders Association) and Robin and his team at Laurence Gould Partnership who have guided us through the minefield which is planning.
I was very naive three years ago presuming that there was no reason why we couldn't build a house on our own land. I am now extremely familiar with planning policies, government guildlines and the workings of the system (that doesn't equal "working the system")....even speaking at our hearing!
To anyone wanting similar success in order to get a fast buck......don't even consider it! The planners are sceptical of every case and have seen every trick in the book. If though you truly want to do as we have done - provide local food with zero food miles, promote high levels of animal welfare and allow people to know exactly where there food has come from, support local businesses and possibly employ local people then so long as you are willing to work very, very hard, put your life on hold, overcome many set backs, skeptasism and even some hostility anything is possible. :farmer:
I'd love to hear of other peoples success stories and I promise to now be more active here on TAS
Have a great day!
Pebbles














 

morri2

  • Joined Jun 2008
Re: Hello everyone - looking forward to sharing & learning (mostly learning!)
« Reply #13 on: September 23, 2010, 01:57:52 pm »
Pebbles, just read your posts.  I'm very, very impressed with what you've done.  Did you get your wind turbines, by any chance?  What are you doing for household/farm energy?  Look forward to hearing more...........

Rosemary

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Barry, Angus, Scotland
    • The Accidental Smallholder
Re: Hello everyone - looking forward to sharing & learning (mostly learning!)
« Reply #14 on: September 23, 2010, 02:46:39 pm »
Welcome back Pebbles. I really take my hat off to you and your OH - you're a great example.

 

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