[domsmith]

Read an article on cleveland bays the other dya in the farmers guardian. now i cant stop myself from looking.

does anyone have one, being a rare breed there arent many about.

any infromation appreciated. think they look amazing but whats there tempramant like?

dominic

[Rosemary]

John and Eva Bennett who are members of RBST Caledonian breed CB. They are near Perth. The link takes you to more information and their web address.

Brackenbrae Field Marshall has been sold but they have other youngstock I think. Marshall came to oads of shows and was the star of the RBST display. His behaviour and temperament was second to none.

It would be wonderful if more folk bred them pure - so often they are crossed with TB.

http://www.caledonian-rbst.org.uk/marshall-impressed-with-his-award/

[mowhaugh]

My experiences with them were not good temperament wise, but I am not saying that 2 bad ones make a bad breed.  They certainly are lovely to look at, and both of mine were fab hunters, would jump anything, but just were not nice to handle.  Could well be that was nothing to do with their breed and more to do with their experiences before I got them.

[ellied]

I've come across a few pure and many crosses, mostly TBxCB hunters or TB x TB/CB quarterbreds that evented. 

The purebreds I've met were more native pony thrawn temperament than most horse size breeds, one or two were downright stroppy and pigheaded but part of that was partly handling, they're big and strong and can easily learn to get away with it and it's harder to deal with than in a wee stroppy pony! 

I see them as a giant Exmoor type personality, quite opinionated, can be fabulous to work with but it's hard work getting to that point!  Their real job that the bloodlines bred for is carriage work, pairs ideally, in that they excel, ridden not so much in their history, they're more draft than dressage and if pushed to be something they're not they can rebel by stubbornness what they can't persuade you against by lighter hints..

[jaykay]

I've seen them in Cleveland, when I lived there  One or two you understand and I'm sorry but I never did I how whose they were. Being driven.

 Interesting to hear they're like stroppy ponies but bigger 

[shygirl]

my friend had one called Nessa, she was a general plod, no trouble at all.

[sabrina]

Were they not carriage horses at one point. If so should be good natured enough. Judge used to breed them near Inverness back in the 80's a Alice Munro but I expect she has passed away by now.

[Rosemary]

Please do get in touch with Eva and John - I'm sure they will be able to give you first hand experience of this breed.

Slightly off topic, but I get a bit pissed at references to "stroppy, trawn native ponies" - very derogatory. Natives have their own charm and unique qualities - many are in danger and it's really not helpful for people - experienced people - to perpetrate the idea that they are stubborn and stroppy. Owners need educating not the pony breeds slagged off.

[lachlanandmarcus]

I love cleveland bays and native ponies so the combination of the two in one package sounds great to me. I think much is down to firm consistent handling from a young age - with that, partnerships of whatever breed succeed.

[ellied]

Please do get in touch with Eva and John - I'm sure they will be able to give you first hand experience of this breed.

Slightly off topic, but I get a bit pissed at references to "stroppy, trawn native ponies" - very derogatory. Natives have their own charm and unique qualities - many are in danger and it's really not helpful for people - experienced people - to perpetrate the idea that they are stubborn and stroppy. Owners need educating not the pony breeds slagged off.

Having been around natives my whole life, owned them by choice and bred them for a couple decades my comments are not derogatory in the slightest.  Take my comments how you want, but I'd rather not deal with potential buyers who think of natives as happy plods which is the other common misperception.  A ploddy native is quite often one that has given up under pressure and is far from happy.  Not all by any means, most are willing and cooperative IF handled with a view to the native temperament and needs, but they get dead to the leg, sour in the showring and stroppy under saddle most easily when expected to be a type of equine that they weren't bred and developed to be.  And then fed, rugged, trimmed, plaited, dressed up like My Little Pony and paraded round as if that were a good thing just because some supermodel had a designer make her pink rugs with her initials on and diamante browbands and pastel jodhs..  THAT upsets me more than letting someone know that a native has an instinct to survive and get by in the most challenging environments by being thrawn and stubborn and absolutely committed to do what it believes will keep it alive.  Work with that and you are a team, work against it you have a battle, ignore it and you have a disaster for both parties.  Thrawn isn't bad, it's good.

Anyway, this isn't a good week to have a go at me about how I describe ponies.  I have just spent a few days and nights failing to keep a homebred yearling alive, had to give up hope and live with that til the vet could get back to do the deed, with me holding her head in both hands and my forehead by hers as he struggled to find a vein and took so long to die.  Oh and then because I don't have a tractor and nobody I know could manage to help me in time, I had to break several ropes and finally use a rope halter to drag her by the heels off my landrover towhitch to the gate so the knacker could get the winch on, and help him lift/drag her on the main A road and up into a lorry full of meat bits and dead calves.  So I wanted her to be more thrawn than she was able to be and I wanted it of myself and I can't.  Please please don't take offence where I was honestly describing something I love and admire and live with by choice because I don't want any one of this type to be bought or land anywhere that they don't deserve, because we have to be politically correct and not call a spade a spade, a native a hardy breed that has a mind and an opinion and sod it a heart big enough to break you in bits when you lose one.

Enough, I've said more than enough, I know, apologise and have a very very nice day.

[Rosemary]

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/features/17-reasons-glad-native/#

[sabrina]

Having had Warmbloods and Natives over the years I would go for native every time. Cheaper to keep, less vet bills and if all you plan to do is Riding club level then a Native is more than capable of doing well at cross country, show jumping and dressage. As a breed they are not so forgiving if you upset them but I have found they will give you 100 per cent if you understand them. Losing any equine is heart breaking and terrible to loose one so young  Ellied. Very sad .

[domsmith]

Thanks for the replies, i will be making enquiries i have seen the brackenbrae website already. seems i might have a breeder on my doorstep.

i know nothing of native temprament so am keen to see them and hear first hand how they behave. i have a warmblood now who is calm and collected. That is until you really shake him then hes uncontrollable! and frightening. he will never show, hes too fragile mentally. he sat on a car at our local riding of the marches.

so a cb for me might do some showing or working hunter.

i thought i read that a cb was a native warmblood? dont know what that means but i was expecting a lively sporthorse type of character.

dominic

[Rosemary]

The Cleveland Bay was originally developed as a pack horse - in common with most of the British rare breeds it was developed for working rather than for sport - over the Penines. The breed was later used as a carriage horse.

Having spoken to Eva and John, CB are very hardy, living outside without rugs all year, with a forage diet. Fabulous photo of a CB in the RBST gallery below.


https://www.rbst.org.uk/horses-gallery

[Hevxxx99]

I am an owner and very passionate about the breed.

Here are the two I have had.  They are fantastic horses: as brave as anything and kind gentle and loyal.  BUT not if you are pushy and try to treat them like a TB.  They need firm, fair handling and they will be putty in your hands.  They take a while to trust a new person and will sometime simply not like some people for no obvious reason. 

They can be a bit bargy - I think they forget how big they are - but are fine if reminded to behave.  Harry, (Mosscarr Rhinehart) my gelding, had some Parelli training and will happily walk at my side on a loose rope and isn't ever much trouble.  Hanna, the mare, was trained for the showring from a yearling so was good to handle also, but she knew her strength and would chest her way through stable doors and gates!

They are excellent hunters and all rounders, they do well at dressage (Spring Pascal is CBx), being surprisingly light on their feet, and unsurprisingly, are excellent endurance horses as well as driving and agricultural work.

They can carry a lot of weight and are as solid as a rock: unspooky and sensible.  They are intellegent horses, so when they don't understand something, they'll stop and try to work it out, which sometimes leads to them being described as stubborn: not something I have ever found.  Trying to explain to seventeen hands of horse can be challenging, but if they don't understand what you're asking, find a way they do understand and they are very happy to oblige.

They are indeed hardy: Harry is out in a moorside field at the moment without a rug and will stay out all winter, only being rugged when it gets very rough.  They are usually good doers and have feet hard enough to not need shoes.  Having had Cleveland Bays, I'd never be satisfied with anything else  (except perhaps Fell ponies) which seems to be the case with most owners!

They are getting extremely rare: there are less than 300 breeding mares left WORLDWIDE which is a very sad state of affairs.  There's a couple of groups on Facebook that might be worth looking at: Cleveland Bay Wales (not limited to Wales) and Cleveland Bay Horses Buy or Sell.  I'm sure there are others, but I know both of those are good.