Smallholders Insurance from Greenlands

Author Topic: Our first brood of 12 Indian runners in Fife  (Read 17281 times)

robbiegrant

  • Joined Aug 2012
  • Cupar. North East Fife
  • The Mighty Kroshka!
    • Exclusive Luxury Holiday Villa for Rent in Goa
Our first brood of 12 Indian runners in Fife
« on: August 25, 2012, 12:22:20 am »
 :wave: All  This is our first time, so go easy on us....  ;D
We live in a converted stable that once was a mill on the river Eden in Cupar so not only does the river run right past the house but there is a mill lade 15meters from the house. It is a popular place for ducks, some years there are dozens of pairs raising their broods here.

We have 2 clutches.
The first clutch A1 to A6 are white pure breed IR's eggs. The second clutch B1 to B6 Are mixed colour IR's.
Clutch A is on day 7 and Clutch B was set 3 days later ( due to late arrival in post )

Both are Ebay purchases.

They are set in an secondhand, still air, auto turning Brinsea incubator, bought from a very nice man in Scone.

I have modified the Brinsea by fitting -

1. Two small 12v fans ( stolen from a PC power supply ) connected to a 240v/12v wall wart PSU. These are to aid an even air circulation/temperature through out the unit.
 
2. A digital brinsea spot test thermometer ( i'm convinced the standard mercury in glass is lying! ) Temperature set to 37.5C

3. A digital humidity meter.

4. Cut down layer of sponge to laid in one water resevoir to help wick water vapour into the incubator
( I luv sponge. cos i'm not allowed anything sharp! )

The system was run for a week bare to check stability of the environment.

The eggs where rested at room temp point down for 8 hours, cleaned, candled, number, weighed and marked with O's and X's to allow us to check they are all turning properly before setting. ( My first time but nothing untoward that my inexperienced eye can see at this point. more to the point no evidence of cracks! )

I am now a week into incubation for clutch A and tonight was my first candling.
A1 does not seem any different ( possibly sterile )
A2 shows strong signs of embryonic development. Blood vessels eminating from a dark spot. WOOOPEEE life!
A3 is similar but much darker than A2
A4, A5 = A2
A6 same but a larger air sac than i would have hoped at this stage.

Bearing in mind Clutch B is 3 days behind and got lost in the post for 4 days!
B1, B3, B4, B5 and B6 All look like stuff is happening a fine web of blood vessels is spreading from the center. There seems to be a light ring around all the development. I have checked as many photos online because I am concerned about bacterial ring infection so i will have to keep a close eye but development has started by the looks of it.
B2 Sadly has a hairline crack in it that seemed to get bigger within hours. In the interests of the other healthy eggs my wife an I agonised over what to do and have decided to remove it. A painful decision but for the best I think. So sadly we are down to 11.  It would be unrealistic to expect 12 out of 12 to do the term and ultimately we are after healthy happy ducks.

Anyway the project is moving forward and we look forward to clutch A hatching on the 14-15th sept and clutch B three days later. I know I have to stop the auto turner on the 25th day so Clutch A can get into position for pipping and have just resigned myself to having to turn clutch B by hand till they reach day 25.

Indian Runners should take 28.5 days to hatch but nature being what it is we will just have to see.

Until then I think i've gone broody, I'm clucking ( quacking ) around the incubator regularly through the day to check they are turning, and that temp and humidity are stable.

Will keep you all posted.

Robbie



Cupar weather http://www.wunderground.com/cgi-bin/findweather/hdfForecast?query=cupar
Goa weather http://www.wunderground.com/global/stations/43192.html
Escape to paradise - http://www.vaastuvillagoa.com

It might look like I'm doing nothing, but at the cellular level I'm actually quite busy ;)

robbiegrant

  • Joined Aug 2012
  • Cupar. North East Fife
  • The Mighty Kroshka!
    • Exclusive Luxury Holiday Villa for Rent in Goa
Re: Our first brood of 12 Indian runners in Fife
« Reply #1 on: August 26, 2012, 09:26:29 pm »
update....

On a sad note we have now removed A1 which has turned out to be sterile... So we are down to 10....

My wife and i plan to buy matching wellies and put a disinfected pair in the brooder so the ducks will imprint on them. it will make it easier to train them to go down to the lade, where to enter etc. I have an inflatable so we can play mummy duck with our flock . It will also help in training them to come home to bed before nightfall ( they will have a auto pop hole out of the yard. and for feeding etc.

We have also installed a INTERPLEX NITE EYE in various places. http://www.solarniteeyes.co.uk/
and we plan to play talk radio during the hours of darkness to discourage preditors

My last idea for now is a shallow paddling pool in their yard that is drilled to free drain to act as a shower tray. I plan to install a movement sensor that will switch a solenoid that will supply water to a shower head do they can have a play..... Anybody tried showering their ducks?

tomorrow we plan to photograph an developing egg whilst its being candled...

We can put the photos in the family albumen ( bad joke )

stay tuned...

Robbie
Cupar weather http://www.wunderground.com/cgi-bin/findweather/hdfForecast?query=cupar
Goa weather http://www.wunderground.com/global/stations/43192.html
Escape to paradise - http://www.vaastuvillagoa.com

It might look like I'm doing nothing, but at the cellular level I'm actually quite busy ;)

northfifeduckling

  • Joined Jan 2009
  • Fife
    • North Fife Blog
Re: Our first brood of 12 Indian runners in Fife
« Reply #2 on: August 27, 2012, 08:00:37 am »
Hey - you are so incredibly organised! Can't wait on a progress report and pics of any ducklings in the near future :)
I just wish I had any old incubator (on the shopping list for next year) to get the job done each time a broody gives up... :&>


robbiegrant

  • Joined Aug 2012
  • Cupar. North East Fife
  • The Mighty Kroshka!
    • Exclusive Luxury Holiday Villa for Rent in Goa
Re: Our first brood of 12 Indian runners in Fife
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2012, 01:05:44 am »
 :wave: Kerstin
Not as organised as I would like to have been.
We have had friends from Russia visiting for the last two weeks with 5 kids! They left today with smiles on their wee faces, so the house can go back to normal.... phew the kids where a handfull!!!!  My Russian is still at about 4 year old level so I was even having my grammar corrected by their 5 year old  :eyelashes:

Have not got around the photographing the candled embrios yet, maybe tomorrow when we have recovered a bit from our recent invasion. LOL.

Turns out the unfertilised egg ( A1 ) lost 6grams in the incubator in 10 days which was roughly equivalent to A5 which is developing well. so little difference. I conclude this is moisture lost through the shell through evaporation.

Anyhoo...
This morning when i did a quick candle one of the Clutch A embrios was moving around. cant really tell if its reacting to light of if its just having a wee party to the music being played constantly in the incubator.. mainly classical, but sometimes soft jazz  :innocent: Didn't log which one it was but by this evening ( day 11 ) They are all having a wee boogie about.

I have found i don't have to disturb them too much as I just place the candling torch at the blunt end where ever they rest in the incubator and as the embryos pretty much rise to the highest point within the egg it is enough to see if things are still healthy.

By contrast The B clutch ( day 8 ) are all uniformly developing. No Movement. but all healthly so far as we can see.... :excited: :fc:

Anyway tomorrow is another day.

Be well

Robbie

 
Cupar weather http://www.wunderground.com/cgi-bin/findweather/hdfForecast?query=cupar
Goa weather http://www.wunderground.com/global/stations/43192.html
Escape to paradise - http://www.vaastuvillagoa.com

It might look like I'm doing nothing, but at the cellular level I'm actually quite busy ;)

Brijjy

  • Joined Sep 2010
  • Mid Wales
Re: Our first brood of 12 Indian runners in Fife
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2012, 07:08:53 am »
You're way more organised than I am when hatching eggs. I did have a look at weighing but never got round to it. Definitely post some pictures on here. I like the shower idea for ducks, it sounds alot less messy. Luckily all mine have a stream to play in but I can remember how much mess the ducks made at my old house with their paddling pool.
Silly Spangled Appenzellers, Dutch bantams, Lavender Araucanas, a turkey called Alistair, Muscovy ducks and Jimmy the Fell pony. No pig left in the freezer, we ate him all!

robbiegrant

  • Joined Aug 2012
  • Cupar. North East Fife
  • The Mighty Kroshka!
    • Exclusive Luxury Holiday Villa for Rent in Goa
Re: Our first brood of 12 Indian runners in Fife
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2012, 04:41:53 pm »
We just want to do our best for the wee souls.
Its our first time hatching so we are probably clucking ( quacking ) around like broody hens.

I grew up on a 3 acre smallholding with 40-50 layers ( rhode island reds ) a few banties, cockrels, 6 aylesburys, 2 muskovys, 4 geese a couple of milk goats and three lambs a year in the spring etc etc etc so i'm not new to the way of life. But its all new for my wife.

We dont have that kind of space here so it could more be described as a microholding or nano even!

I unsuccessfully managed to film the moving embryos last night due to bad planning and not understanding how my phone does video. will try again tonight.. :fc: :fc: :fc: :fc: :fc: :fc: :fc: :fc: :fc: 

Its all good fun.

Cupar weather http://www.wunderground.com/cgi-bin/findweather/hdfForecast?query=cupar
Goa weather http://www.wunderground.com/global/stations/43192.html
Escape to paradise - http://www.vaastuvillagoa.com

It might look like I'm doing nothing, but at the cellular level I'm actually quite busy ;)

robbiegrant

  • Joined Aug 2012
  • Cupar. North East Fife
  • The Mighty Kroshka!
    • Exclusive Luxury Holiday Villa for Rent in Goa
Re: Our first brood of 12 Indian runners in Fife
« Reply #6 on: August 29, 2012, 01:38:23 am »
 :wave:
Hi All
Day 12 ( A team )
I'm proud of myself after shooting and uploading to youtube for the first time.
indian runner duck embryo fife day 12
I'm sure I can get better shots but i dont want to disturb them too much.....
This is a shot of A2.... somethings alive...

Had a wee candle at the B team (9 days) there is movement there too....

:)

Cupar weather http://www.wunderground.com/cgi-bin/findweather/hdfForecast?query=cupar
Goa weather http://www.wunderground.com/global/stations/43192.html
Escape to paradise - http://www.vaastuvillagoa.com

It might look like I'm doing nothing, but at the cellular level I'm actually quite busy ;)

the great composto

  • Guest
Re: Our first brood of 12 Indian runners in Fife
« Reply #7 on: August 29, 2012, 08:35:20 am »
Very interesting Robbie - i have a batch of 12 ebay light sussex in at the moment and i am at day 10 so I candled them last night & found possibly 8/12 fertile (but still with large air sacs).  I also put in 6 of own my buff orpingtons which all seem unfertile. Not had much luck with them at all.   I also put 2 from the other chickens that I know the buff cockerel is treading and it seems like 1/2 fertile.
I am interested in the weighing topic you had so did you decide not to weigh this batch?  I decided not to as I didnt have enough time ( or equipment) to do it properly this time.

Now just to sort out why my buffs arent succeeding. :thinking:

Good luck with the hatching 

robbiegrant

  • Joined Aug 2012
  • Cupar. North East Fife
  • The Mighty Kroshka!
    • Exclusive Luxury Holiday Villa for Rent in Goa
Re: Our first brood of 12 Indian runners in Fife
« Reply #8 on: August 29, 2012, 01:34:11 pm »
Hello again there Compo
I have weighed all the eggs as they have gone into incubator but i have not been weighing them so often to limit the disturbance. The 10 that are developing seem healthy.

It seems the infertile eggs lost pretty much as much as a fertile one developing away so i imaging the weight loss is mainly down to evaporation through the shell ( rather than weight loss through embryonic development.

I do spray my eggs daily with a light mist of warm water. ( sitting ducks must get off the nest once a day surely.

They have all developed good airsacs. I believe the young duckling internally pips into this and takes its first breath before tackling its shell break out.

but i aint no eggspert!

let me know how you get on...

and good luck  :fc: 
Cupar weather http://www.wunderground.com/cgi-bin/findweather/hdfForecast?query=cupar
Goa weather http://www.wunderground.com/global/stations/43192.html
Escape to paradise - http://www.vaastuvillagoa.com

It might look like I'm doing nothing, but at the cellular level I'm actually quite busy ;)

northfifeduckling

  • Joined Jan 2009
  • Fife
    • North Fife Blog
Re: Our first brood of 12 Indian runners in Fife
« Reply #9 on: August 29, 2012, 04:20:47 pm »



I do spray my eggs daily with a light mist of warm water. ( sitting ducks must get off the nest once a day surely.


Yes, they do! What I find interesting is comparing a sitting duck with the incubator experience of yourselves! A duck starts off slowly , increasing the sitting time the longer she sits. Does an incubator have the same temps all month round? The natural gaps don't seem to harm the embyos much in the begiining, even if left overnight. But as there a usually quite a number of eggs before the real sitting time, maybe it does... ??? :&>
 

robbiegrant

  • Joined Aug 2012
  • Cupar. North East Fife
  • The Mighty Kroshka!
    • Exclusive Luxury Holiday Villa for Rent in Goa
Re: Our first brood of 12 Indian runners in Fife
« Reply #10 on: August 29, 2012, 06:57:12 pm »
 :wave: Helllooooooo there over yonder hill.
 :gloomy: Its a nice day for  :&> :&> :&> :raining:

There does seem to be a large degree of opinion regarding the misting of duck eggs.

Thing is... When ah wiz a bairn the aylesbury and muscovy eggs didnae last long enough to hatch cos we gobbled them all up double quick   :innocent: I do remember hatching chicks, rhode island reds, but as i was probably about 9 years old don't remember the technicalitys   :eyelashes:

Ever since we recently started exhibiting the symptoms of Compulsive Duckling Disorder  :unwell: :love: :excited: We have given close attention to temperature and humidity.  :thinking: The temp in our incubator sits mostly at 37.5 but i have seen it 0.2 degrees plus/minus  . The incubator lives in our back kitchen ( translation - part time brewery ) which is an extremely stable/quiet environ night and day....  ( Bl**dy thick stane walls and wads o insulation helps! ).  So yes I would say the incubator has the potential for great stability throughout the month.

BUT a chicken is not a duck, so its a poor comparison in terms of damp bird / dry bird.. Though I know they are very good at sitting on duck eggs, however i never seen a happy chook in the rain... )  Anyway.......  :&> being water fowl their eggs are going to get damp. So i give them a wee bit o moisture. The air is well circulated within the unit, It doesnt upset the air temp for too long, certainly not enough to alter the internal eggs temp. ( which, I would imagine is what really matters ) and the humidity has a wee boost before falling again to around 45RH. There is an extra water tray in the bottom of the unit that I have been told to fill ( probably in a week or so. ) to raise the humidity higher towards the pipping stage.

So far things are moving on. They all seem happy jumping aboot in there shells to the tunes from the ipod!
When i check them tonight i plan to weigh them as a comparison to their original weights. If I get a better video i will post it to with the weight DATA.

We are looking forward to being Ducked Up Beyond All Recognition  :hug: :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&> :&>
« Last Edit: August 29, 2012, 08:52:39 pm by robbiegrant »
Cupar weather http://www.wunderground.com/cgi-bin/findweather/hdfForecast?query=cupar
Goa weather http://www.wunderground.com/global/stations/43192.html
Escape to paradise - http://www.vaastuvillagoa.com

It might look like I'm doing nothing, but at the cellular level I'm actually quite busy ;)

robbiegrant

  • Joined Aug 2012
  • Cupar. North East Fife
  • The Mighty Kroshka!
    • Exclusive Luxury Holiday Villa for Rent in Goa
Re: Our first brood of 12 Indian runners in Fife
« Reply #11 on: August 31, 2012, 01:02:23 am »
Hi Folx
Well.......... The A team are half way through now. They are still dancing aboot in their shells
The B team are a quiet tonight. Not much movement. Do they sleep in their shells?

Weights for the A team

A1 day 1 60.7g - @ 11 Day =  54.4grams ( Was removed a few days ago un_fertile ) loss 6.3g!!!
A2 day 1 59.3g - @ 14 Days = 52.2g  loss 7.1g
A3 day 1 62.0g - @ 14 Days = 55.9g  loss 6.1g
A4 day 1 57.0g - @ 14 Days = 50.6g  loss 6.4g
A5 day 1 60.3g - @ 14 Days = 53.3g  loss 7.0g
A6 day 1 58.8g - @ 14 Days = 51.9g  loss 6.9g

Target weight loss to pipping stage 8.33grams @14% of total egg weight
Average egg size 59.5 average loss 6.7g average loss per day 0.478g

Sooooooooo..... at 14 days the eggs average weight loss equals slightly over 11%
I hope weight loss is slowing or I will never reach my healthy 14% target!!!!
This revelation has got me a teensyweensy bit paranoid. Going to have to weigh them again tomorrow to see if they are still lossing by an average of 0.478grams per day.
Does anyone know if the weight loss is linear or..... well.... err...... curved?
I would imagine curved.  :fc: :fc: :fc:

Any ideas?

p.s. just candled the B team again and there seems more signs of life  :relief:








 
« Last Edit: August 31, 2012, 02:20:19 am by robbiegrant »
Cupar weather http://www.wunderground.com/cgi-bin/findweather/hdfForecast?query=cupar
Goa weather http://www.wunderground.com/global/stations/43192.html
Escape to paradise - http://www.vaastuvillagoa.com

It might look like I'm doing nothing, but at the cellular level I'm actually quite busy ;)

robbiegrant

  • Joined Aug 2012
  • Cupar. North East Fife
  • The Mighty Kroshka!
    • Exclusive Luxury Holiday Villa for Rent in Goa
Re: Our first brood of 12 Indian runners in Fife
« Reply #12 on: September 12, 2012, 02:50:42 am »
 :excited: ITS ALL VERY EXCITING....  :excited:

The A team are on lockdown. Candling reveals that egg A3 is internally pipping, lots of activity.
Activity in other "A" eggs ( not all ) but my money is on A3 to pip ( excuse the pun ) to the post.

Friday even is the big day.  :fc:

There Brooder is awaiting the little arrivals and will be transferred soon as they are fluffy.

B team still turning in the 'bator.

Sat very quiet last night and watched a couple of the eggs bopping aboot on their ain...



 
Cupar weather http://www.wunderground.com/cgi-bin/findweather/hdfForecast?query=cupar
Goa weather http://www.wunderground.com/global/stations/43192.html
Escape to paradise - http://www.vaastuvillagoa.com

It might look like I'm doing nothing, but at the cellular level I'm actually quite busy ;)

northfifeduckling

  • Joined Jan 2009
  • Fife
    • North Fife Blog
Re: Our first brood of 12 Indian runners in Fife
« Reply #13 on: September 12, 2012, 11:36:46 am »
Fingers crossed all goes well for you! There's not much more exciting than awaiting new lives  ;D .
Hope all (but 1) will be girls  ;D :&>

robbiegrant

  • Joined Aug 2012
  • Cupar. North East Fife
  • The Mighty Kroshka!
    • Exclusive Luxury Holiday Villa for Rent in Goa
Re: Our first brood of 12 Indian runners in Fife
« Reply #14 on: September 15, 2012, 11:31:23 am »
Thank you NFD :)
Right on que ( to the hour ) A6 has started implementing the escape plan. " escape from StalEGG 13!"
A wee chip has been knocked out  of the upper surface of the blunt end and its wobbling about........
Cupar weather http://www.wunderground.com/cgi-bin/findweather/hdfForecast?query=cupar
Goa weather http://www.wunderground.com/global/stations/43192.html
Escape to paradise - http://www.vaastuvillagoa.com

It might look like I'm doing nothing, but at the cellular level I'm actually quite busy ;)

 

Forum sponsors

FibreHut Energy Helpline Thomson & Morgan Time for Paws Scottish Smallholder & Grower Festival Ark Farm Livestock Movement Service

© The Accidental Smallholder Ltd 2003-2024. All rights reserved.

Design by Furness Internet

Site developed by Champion IS