Agri Vehicles Insurance from Greenlands

Author Topic: Towing a 505 with a freelander?  (Read 29429 times)

robert waddell

  • Guest
Re: Towing a 505 with a freelander?
« Reply #15 on: August 21, 2012, 10:16:28 am »
small farmer    have you done any towing yet    i doubt it from your post early this morning     tandem axle trailers do snake and yaw and especially with livestock in them shifting the weight about     i tried a trailer once with just a small nose weight  and it was all over the road at less than 40 mph i had to hove the vehicle further forward to put more weight on rear (air suspension leveled the car out) and after it was drivable at up to 70 mph
 
go on copart UK and see the volume of trailers that are writeoffs all are tandem axle  and have had the load move to alter significantly the handling :farmer:

Small Farmer

  • Joined Jan 2012
  • Bedfordshire
Re: Towing a 505 with a freelander?
« Reply #16 on: August 21, 2012, 01:36:21 pm »
You can always rely on Robert to be rude.


The hideous consequences of semi-trailer and caravan jack-knifing has caused vast amounts of research to be carried out.  Unsurprisingly there are lots of factors involved, but it is a fact that a short trailer with a low centre of gravity and the load centred above the axle(s) is more stable than any other combination.  The longer the trailer and the further the load from the axles the worse the stability because of the pendulum effect.  So the basic design of the IWT horse trailers is very stable.


The double axle adds one advantage and one problem.  The advantage is that that when turning the axles follow slightly different radii which adds yaw resistance from the tyre walls and hence stability: anyone who has tried to manoeuvre one by hand will know this.  The problem is in the cart spring suspension which means that on uneven surfaces all the load can be taken on one axle while the other one lifts off the ground.  This would cause overloading of the tyres except when virtually unladen


Nose weight is another issue which can be difficult but I've never seen anyone measure it on a horse yard in the past couple of decades.  As Robert notes too little is by far the worst.   The generally recommended weight is 7% of the trailer weight subject to the restrictions on the towing vehicle.  My horses tend to stay put once loaded into the vehicle, but we always use the centre partition.


I've never seen a horse trailer with a stabiliser and rarely seen a caravan without, and round here horse trailers, particularly Ifor Williams trailers, outnumber caravans. 
Being certain just means you haven't got all the facts

robert waddell

  • Guest
Re: Towing a 505 with a freelander?
« Reply #17 on: August 21, 2012, 06:43:22 pm »
how is my contribution rude smallfarmer       the vast majority of towing vehicles do not have the tow ball set at the right height to enable safer towing and easier on the trailer
 
caravans are now fitted with a anti yaw system on the tow hitch which does away with the stabilisers
i have seen the result of the yaw on a horse box lying at the side of the motorway   and an iw builders trailer being towed by a land rover 110 spinning right round on the motorway  not very nice for both of them :farmer:

bigchicken

  • Joined Nov 2008
  • Fife Scotland
Re: Towing a 505 with a freelander?
« Reply #18 on: August 21, 2012, 08:23:37 pm »
I have a freeander biggest heap 0 rubbish ever
Shetland sheep, Castlemilk Moorits sheep, Hebridean sheep, Scots Grey Bantams, Scots Dumpy Bantams. Shetland Ducks.

Small Farmer

  • Joined Jan 2012
  • Bedfordshire
Re: Towing a 505 with a freelander?
« Reply #19 on: August 21, 2012, 09:13:53 pm »
they can all tow in excess of there limit   but plod take a dim view if you are caught  and if you are involved in a an accident (not your fault)  you will be held responsible and the insurance is invalid
but carry on it is not my licence or me that will be paying for the indiscretion :farmer:




A new member asked a simple but technical question.  Your answer was both wrong and rude, Robert, and you need to know that.
Being certain just means you haven't got all the facts

robert waddell

  • Guest
Re: Towing a 505 with a freelander?
« Reply #20 on: August 21, 2012, 09:44:48 pm »
small farmer first you say it is a simple situation  then you change it to a technical question    the reference to towing in excess of there limit was in reference to the previous poster     it is up to the driver if they comply with the law or they don't not you  unless you are involved with administering the law    and if my post of the 12 Aug was rude  why did you not say before    maybe you don't like being picked up on points you are incorrect with  that is my opinion just as you had an opinion :farmer:

lachlanandmarcus

  • Joined Aug 2010
  • Aberdeenshire
Re: Towing a 505 with a freelander?
« Reply #21 on: August 21, 2012, 09:54:07 pm »
can we cool this down??? :gloomy: , poor newbie OP will be running for the hills and cancelling their forum account..

robert waddell

  • Guest
Re: Towing a 505 with a freelander?
« Reply #22 on: August 21, 2012, 10:13:17 pm »
LM it has been Indian rain piss most of the day the fields are wetter than they were before :gloomy: :gloomy: :gloomy:
the hills will be equally :gloomy: :gloomy: :gloomy:    :farmer:

lachlanandmarcus

  • Joined Aug 2010
  • Aberdeenshire
Re: Towing a 505 with a freelander?
« Reply #23 on: August 22, 2012, 06:34:23 am »
better get this out I reckon  :raining: :raining: :raining:   :relief: ;D

ROG.

  • Joined Aug 2012
Re: Towing a 505 with a freelander?
« Reply #24 on: August 31, 2012, 07:17:37 pm »
Hi

I am looking to purchase an Ifor Williams 505, as my little 3.5 horsebox has pretty much on its last legs. I have been looking at towing vehicles and really like the freelander. I am looking at an 07 plate onwards. I am trying to work out if i can legally tow my 6.1hh warmblood in it. He weighs around 550-600kgs. I wouldn't be using it for 2 16.2 horses. I know that the max towing capacity of the freelander is 2000kgs. Although it would appear that the 505 max gross weight is more than this. Does the max gross weight only come into play when u actually are carrying that much? or are you meant to have a vehicle that can tow at least the max gross weight. I'm a bit confused.

Any advice welcomed

Cheers

Emily
Recommend strongly consulting Rog on the sticky Towing section of the HorseandHound forum. He is the absolute guru on all things to do with towing legals, understanding all the different terms and licence classes etc.
 
Heres the link
http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=490195&highlight=towing
I JOINED THIS SITE AS IT POPPED UP ON A GOOGLE SEARCH !!

Yes, I am the same ROG as on HHO

Firstly, you will need a B+E licence with a HB505 trailer and a horse that size

The MAM of a trailer can legally be more than the towing capacity which the vehicle manufacturer has set for their vehicle

The LOWER of the trailer MAM or the towing capacity is the max actual weight when the trailer is loaded

In this case it will be the 2000 towing capacity
Unladen weight of trailer plus the weight of the horse(s) and anything else put in the trailer must not all add up to more than 2000 kgs

Hope that helps   

lachlanandmarcus

  • Joined Aug 2010
  • Aberdeenshire
Re: Towing a 505 with a freelander?
« Reply #25 on: September 01, 2012, 11:41:59 am »
Thanks ROG :-)))) Hope you didnt blush too much to be described as 'guru'  :thumbsup: :trophy:

hughesy

  • Joined Feb 2010
  • Anglesey
Re: Towing a 505 with a freelander?
« Reply #26 on: September 01, 2012, 12:13:57 pm »
Aside from all the nitty gritty about the rules and regs, has anyone ever actually jacknifed a trailer? I have and it ain't funny. A bloody great 20 foot long site cabin behind a 110 I used to have. It's a bad time to find out that the trailer brakes don't work believe me. Luckily no one was hurt, didn't hit anything though you should have seen the faces of the drivers coming the other way, and managed to drive away afterwards before the plod arrived. ;D

robert waddell

  • Guest
Re: Towing a 505 with a freelander?
« Reply #27 on: September 01, 2012, 01:13:09 pm »
there is not that much difference betwean averting a disaster and one happening    just the reaction of the driver involved and the available correction space      but to learn you have to be in that situation    or feel through the seat of your pants      nearly seen one yesterday    a silage trailer  loaded with woodchip going round a mini roundabout      he just about tipped it over   on us  :farmer:

Small Farmer

  • Joined Jan 2012
  • Bedfordshire
Re: Towing a 505 with a freelander?
« Reply #28 on: September 01, 2012, 03:04:02 pm »
We have big farms round here with very big tractors and they've been hauling big fully laden grain trailers at well over the 20mph and damn close to 24t.  That's maybe fine on the main roads, but in the narrow lanes they don't have the brakes or the cornering to get out of trouble.   Last year one went straight on at a bend and took a lot of recovering.


One of our neighbour's boys got his tractor licence at 16 and now at 18 is a boy in a hell of a hurry.


On that downhill run on the M4 through Wiltshire I saw a caravan doing a two lane shimmy for half a mile.  Driver got it back though.  Bet he had to change his underwear.




Being certain just means you haven't got all the facts

minibn

  • Joined Jun 2012
Re: Towing a 505 with a freelander?
« Reply #29 on: September 09, 2012, 09:41:28 pm »
Hi

Thank you to all who took the time to read my post and reply. I am feeling much mre confident with this towing malarky.

I have a B+E, so i have that problem sorted.

Now its just a case of purchasing the car and trailer, exciting times.

Thank you

Emily

 

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