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Author Topic: Domestic wind turbine planning permission Wales?  (Read 7080 times)

suziequeue

  • Joined Feb 2010
  • Llanidloes; Powys
Domestic wind turbine planning permission Wales?
« on: April 16, 2012, 05:24:47 pm »
As the title suggests - has anybody applied for planning permission for a domestic wind turbine in Wales?

Success/failure stories, tips, advice all appreciated :-)
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chrismahon

  • Joined Dec 2011
  • Gascony, France
Re: Domestic wind turbine planning permission Wales?
« Reply #1 on: May 03, 2012, 09:45:26 am »
Tried it in Staffordshire Suziequeue. Stuck their noses in the air and went on about my garden (which was a brewery with 5 cottages) being EN2 greenbelt! Just up the A£* in Derbyshire two have gone up, about 5KW units. I was looking at an Evance9000 turbine. Best you can get at 5KW as far as I could make out -if you are going to get one, get a good one. Theirs is 30% efficient, the worst on the market is 6%. Of course its not cheap.

Contact the Company and they will give you advice. They are dealing with Planning Authorities all over the place. They will also predict the energy output based on your intended location.

suziequeue

  • Joined Feb 2010
  • Llanidloes; Powys
Re: Domestic wind turbine planning permission Wales?
« Reply #2 on: May 03, 2012, 10:55:41 am »
Thanks Chris

I have built one (so highly unlikely to be 30% efficient  ;D ;D ;D) and hope to make the tower out of angle iron. Failing that we'll probably get a tower from Kingspan.
We do the best we can with the information we have

When we know better we do better

chrismahon

  • Joined Dec 2011
  • Gascony, France
Re: Domestic wind turbine planning permission Wales?
« Reply #3 on: May 03, 2012, 11:20:09 am »
I'm impressed with that Suziequeue. As you may not be a Structural Engineer I would suggest you study the design of electricity pylons for your tower. They are made of angle iron with the essential cross bracing to remove the twist which occurs between the 4 main uprights when they are loaded.

suziequeue

  • Joined Feb 2010
  • Llanidloes; Powys
Re: Domestic wind turbine planning permission Wales?
« Reply #4 on: May 03, 2012, 01:09:51 pm »
Yes - I will be seeking advice from V3 power in Nottingham and they have plans and are very helpful.

In all honesty I expect I will chicken out as my welding skills are pretty rubbish (but I expect it will all be bolts anyway which won't be so bad......) I can't belive that I wil be chiecking out electricity ;ylons this weekend  ::) ::)

The blades are carved with a drawknife from cedarwood

It's a Hugh Piggott design
We do the best we can with the information we have

When we know better we do better

mab

  • Joined Mar 2009
  • carmarthenshire
Re: Domestic wind turbine planning permission Wales?
« Reply #5 on: May 03, 2012, 05:43:04 pm »
Quote
I have built one (so highly unlikely to be 30% efficient    )

Don't know if you've tried yours in a breeze yet - you'll be surprised at how well hand carved blades work; and the Hugh Piggot design is very efficient.

I'm impressed too BTW - I'm planning one of his for the near future; I was going to go for a small one (1800mm) on a relatively low tower to use the southerly winds when they blow up the valley (wasn't going to worry about planning until they make an issue of it).

My site is not very good for wind power though, so I'm looking into exploiting a possible hydro source first (should be able to provide 0.5 - 2kw over winter), but the cost of the plumbing and ready-made Pelton wheels is putting me off for the moment (might try making on out of spoons first  ;D ).

good luck with your tower

mab


FiB

  • Joined Sep 2011
  • Bala, North Wales
    • Facebook
Re: Domestic wind turbine planning permission Wales?
« Reply #6 on: May 04, 2012, 10:15:39 am »
Hey suzie - loved your pics from turbine course - wher did you do that?  Your turbine looks a thing of beauty, Id like to do one to provide for our static (recharge battery).  Not enough scope for more as our valley is too tubulant (too many hedges and trees)... but hydro is another matter - MAB would be interested in your journey how can I best learn about DIY pico hydro?  I dont want to fo an aqueduct + water wheel like Dick strawbridge - and have very limeted funds, but lots of time to play around...

suziequeue

  • Joined Feb 2010
  • Llanidloes; Powys
Re: Domestic wind turbine planning permission Wales?
« Reply #7 on: May 04, 2012, 01:28:01 pm »
We did the turbine kit thing through V3 Power in Nottingham. Great bunch  :D :D

The course ( convened to  build the kit) was held at a housing co-operative in Lientwardine in Herefordshire. There was a girl teaching on the course who was involved in pico hydro projects in Exeter and we chatted briefly about domestic hydro stuff as we have a stream/brook on part of our land.

http://www.v3power.co.uk/
We do the best we can with the information we have

When we know better we do better

chrismahon

  • Joined Dec 2011
  • Gascony, France
Re: Domestic wind turbine planning permission Wales?
« Reply #8 on: May 04, 2012, 01:56:22 pm »
Think bolts will be better Suziequeue. Welded joints can split when the structure flexes, as there will always be some movement. Perhaps a combination of the two to assist assembly and erection.

suziequeue

  • Joined Feb 2010
  • Llanidloes; Powys
Re: Domestic wind turbine planning permission Wales?
« Reply #9 on: May 04, 2012, 02:17:00 pm »
I think I would be happier with bolts. We have local metal place and he seems very amenable to wild ideas as I have just been to see him about my chicken plucker11
We do the best we can with the information we have

When we know better we do better

mab

  • Joined Mar 2009
  • carmarthenshire
Re: Domestic wind turbine planning permission Wales?
« Reply #10 on: May 04, 2012, 06:07:47 pm »

Apologies to SuzieQ for temporarily hi-jacking her wind thread...

Quote
but hydro is another matter - MAB would be interested in your journey how can I best learn about DIY pico hydro?

Hmmm... it's not much of a journey yet - mostly a though experiment and a costing exercise.

the first link gives a simple calculator that shows the power you might be able to extract from your water:-
http://www.reuk.co.uk/Calculation-of-Hydro-Power.htm

you also need to determine what type of wheel / turbine you need. If you have a lot of head (pressure) and low flow (like me) then you probably want a pelton or turgo turbine; if you have a lot of flow but a low head then a wheel of some sort may be the way to go. this website might give you some ideas:-
http://www.navitron.org.uk/page.php?id=58&catId=70

the good thing about turbines is you don't need huge aqueducts but the turbines are difficult to diy build and expensive to buy.

The good thing about waterwheels is that they are easy to homebuild, but you may need to do a lot of digging to get the water to them.

if you're using a turbine and can pipe the water to it, then this calculator works out what size of pipe you need to keep your frictional losses below 10% and what size of cable you need (for their genny) to carry the power to the house:-
http://www.powerspout.com/advanced-calculator/

I've worked out I need about £500 worth of pipe to get the water to where my turbine will be  :( then I ned to buy (£1000?)/make the turbine and genny; then I need about £100 worth oc cable to get the power home.

that's as far as I've got.  :D

Oh, I've just found this site as a possible source of affordable turgo 'spoons' and wheels:
http://h-hydro.com/

If Dan will forgive a link to another forum, the following is a good place to discuss all things renewable energy/off grid:-
http://www.fieldlines.com/

Hugh Piggot has a website for his wind stuff (and I note he now supplies the powerspout turbines) and you can order a copy of his book on how to build a windgenny (genny doesn't HAVE to be used on a windmill).
http://scoraigwind.co.uk/

OK we can go back to wind now  ;D

M

jaykay

  • Joined Aug 2012
  • Cumbria/N Yorks border
Re: Domestic wind turbine planning permission Wales?
« Reply #11 on: May 04, 2012, 06:43:47 pm »
Thank you very much for the hydro stuff, that's what I want to explore  :thumbsup:

OK, I can guesstimate the head, from the map, but how on earth do I calculate the flow rate, in litres per minute, of a stony beck.
« Last Edit: May 04, 2012, 06:46:02 pm by jaykay »

mab

  • Joined Mar 2009
  • carmarthenshire
Re: Domestic wind turbine planning permission Wales?
« Reply #12 on: May 04, 2012, 08:19:40 pm »
Quote
OK, I can guesstimate the head, from the map, but how on earth do I calculate the flow rate, in litres per minute, of a stony beck.

Yeah I was wondering that myself  ;D ;D The best I've managed is to stick a 3 gallon bucket in a narrow waterfall bit and see how long it takes to fill (about a second at the mo') and estimate how much of the water I missed. Although I've only been here a month so I don't know how much of the year I'll have a useful flow for. For my battery based off grid system, I think a small 200-500watt system that works for 6-8 months is better than a 2kwatt system that only works for 2 months.

Oh, having just re-read your post - please note that in metric you probably want litres/second (as opposed to imperial units - usually gallons/minute) or you'll get a massive overestimate of power.  ;)

Oh, and if you use 'imperial' units on the powerspout website, remember you'll need US gallons.

m

chrismahon

  • Joined Dec 2011
  • Gascony, France
Re: Domestic wind turbine planning permission Wales?
« Reply #13 on: May 04, 2012, 08:39:57 pm »
Calculate the flow rate by measuring the maximum velocity x the cross sectional area x 2/3 I seem to remember. Because the flow is slower at the edges due to drag.

suziequeue

  • Joined Feb 2010
  • Llanidloes; Powys
Re: Domestic wind turbine planning permission Wales?
« Reply #14 on: May 04, 2012, 09:20:18 pm »
What about an Archimedes screw?
We do the best we can with the information we have

When we know better we do better

 

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