[Rosemary]

I agree that it was better to ask the question than go ahead and get a dog, then find that there are all sorts of problems.

I suspect that, in asking the question, Fieldfare may have known that it wasn't really a very good idea in the circumstances.

[deepinthewoods]

he went for the micro pig instead.

[Fieldfare]

Hi all- thanks for the responses. It was actually an honest question posted in good faith. I thought this actually might be a nicer way for a dog to spend its day on a *long and safe* tether with the chance to take in the elements and have a snug kennel and the company of other creatures (seeing these as his pack and hence less likely to exhibit separation anxiety from myself?) rather than be cooped up in a house as many are- or popped in a kennel with run as an alternative suggestion. I can't see why these would be deemed less cruel? Can someone explain? Also I really can't believe that all dogs in the UK are left alone for a max. of 4 hours? I know a few owned by working couples that are left for much longer and appear to be happy, well contented creatures which settle into their routine and seem to go against this 'best advice'. Because of this I am still confused- I really don't post this to ruffle anyones feathers- but just wanted to clear my confusion with some non-emotive, balanced responses.
Sadly, it probably is the case that I, like many, really do not have the facilities to keep complex creatures such as dogs. I might have to wait until I retire - only 20-odd years to go 

Thanks 

[doganjo]

Hi all- thanks for the responses. It was actually an honest question posted in good faith. I thought this actually might be a nicer way for a dog to spend its day on a *long and safe* tether with the chance to take in the elements Can someone explain? Also I really can't believe that all dogs in the UK are left alone for a max. of 4 hours? Because of this I am still confused- I really don't post this to ruffle anyones feathers- but just wanted to clear my confusion with some non-emotive, balanced responses.

Sorry to be blunt - didn't mean to offend you, but a long tether is neither safe nor appropriate. A dog I knew was left like that for an hour and it hung itself which is why I am ultra sensitive about it. It must have been the most awful death imaginable.  Perhaps I should have explained.  A comfortable kennel inside a large run with another dog for company would be far more appropriate and safe.  Yes, many dogs are left for more than four hours but that doesn't make it right does it?  As someone else said they are pack animals, and need company whether human or other dogs.
I have two of mine outside in a kennel - well actually my garage with inside runs and popholes to outside runs and wooden kennels inside so they are warm and cosy and have plenty of space.  The only reason they aren't in the house is my two boys have had fights so I swap them around, and they all have an equal share of my company.  They are also worked during season, and exercised every day in an open safe woodland, surrounded by deer fencing.  I must insist that tying a  dog up for long period of time is dangerous and not a pleasant environment for a dog.  Why do you want a dog anyway?

[Hazelwood Flock]

A kennel with run would be more acceptable, and why not have 2 dogs so they can keep each other company when you are not around. My 2 springers come to work with me, but spend most of their time in the back of the pick up with a lunch time walk to relieve themselves. It is all they have ever known and love the routine, they also live in the house, so flake out on the furniture every evening. When we have to go away for the day we can leave the back door open so the dogs have free run of the garden and can come into the utility room. This works well for us!

[Fieldfare]

Hi Annie- no worries- you didn't offend me- I can see how much you care for animal welfare and I respect you for being tough on me! My questioning welfare is why I don't have a dog even though I would dearly like one! (and I am a complete beginner other than looking after a friends dog occasionally). Anyway- I'll try to explain. I would like to get a dog for the main reasons people get a dog I guess (companionship, security- but not an aggressive dog, social, fun,health, walking etc.). The main problem is that I work 5-days a week (9-5) and I agree that this does not sound like the profile of an ideal dog keeper! However, I was trying to investigate a way around this as out of these times I can offer the dog a great life (I spend plenty of time out of doors tending my smallholding and heading to the hills!). He'd spend evenings, nights and weekends wherever I go. Also I have heard that if you get a pup and bring him up at the same time as young poultry he and they become part of a pack- when I amaway he still has his 'pack' so does not fret as much? (hence mitigating for the extra time I will be away). Also I am thinking that dogs do get used to this regular routine of coming and going (similar to when pack members go out to hunt in wild dog packs?). I would only like one dog unfortunately even though the 2-dog idea sounds good.

In terms of tethering I would be looking at something safe such as a 'trolley system'(?) where there is no chance of him getting caught up(?) and it would allow him plenty of space- and much more than a kennel with run could afford- I suppose the line could be 100 metres long if necessary! and he would always be in touch with his 'pack and be allowed to enter a warm kennel'. Am I really way off the mark in terms of animal welfare? Or in terms of what is deemed 'acceptible' in terms of treating pet animals? Maybe it does sound a bit cruel- but is it really? It would be great to hear what you and others think  I am prepared to shelve the idea but really feel I would like to explore all avenues before giving up the idea.

Thanks

[Black Raven]

Speaking from a rescuers point of view a tether is a no no. I totally agree with Doganjo, dogs get so easily tangled up in them. How would you truly feel if you came home and he had managed to strangle himself? As for leaving him 8ish hours a day, well how about a dog walker? I have clients and also people who have taken dogs from our rescue that employ a dog walker while they are out. Do you have close neighbours? What if the dog starts barking and is at it for most of the time you are out?
I'm sure there are ways around this, it's just working out what is workable for you and fair on the dog.

[mab]

At the risk of stiring things up, I can't help but contrast the views here with the ones posted just the other day in this thread:-

http://www.accidentalsmallholder.net/forum/index.php?topic=20211.0

seemed like tethering that dog up wasn't viewed as a problem.

Though for the record I'm not in favour of tethering, I have seen some perfectly happy dogs on tethers.

mab

[doganjo]

At the risk of stiring things up, I can't help but contrast the views here with the ones posted just the other day in this thread:-

http://www.accidentalsmallholder.net/forum/index.php?topic=20211.0

seemed like tethering that dog up wasn't viewed as a problem.

Though for the record I'm not in favour of tethering, I have seen some perfectly happy dogs on tethers.

mab

To be fair the question there was stealing - I wasn't happy about that dog being tethered either, but that wasn't the point in that thread.

FF, if you can show me a link to what you are thinking about I will give you my honest opinion, but I truly think your best option is a £100 shed from B & Q and a roll of double height pig wire made into a run, and two dogs.  A dog on it's own will find things to do and on one of those long lines you could come back to find dead sheep or hens, even if your dog was safe.

[robert waddell]

that link was about a dog who somebody thought they could give a better enviroment  to so they stole it could not cope with its problems real or other wise and returned it
my point of my previous post is farm dogs are tied up  a working dog has to do that work  and work constantly house dogs are not perceived as making good working dogs    you just connot let a working farm dog have free range as it will go and work on its own  and you don't want that

[cuckoo]

I have read this thread with interest.  I believe tethering to be a big no no - I too have seen dogs strangle themselves and die a horrible death.  Kennel and run is much prefereble.  I work part time and have a dog walker who comes in and let my dogs out for 1/2 hour (cant afford more as costs too much) - rest of the day they are in kennel / run and then out and in house with me the rest of the time.

In terms of the legalities - the animal welfare act requires owners to meet their animals needs - in terms of a suitable environment, suitable diet, express normal behaviour, social needs and protection from pain, injury, diesese and suffering.  The code of practice for dogs (http://www.defra.gov.uk/publications/files/pb13333-cop-dogs-091204.pdf) give more detailed information - enforcement of this is a problem though believe me!!

I would suggest that you read these and see whether what you are proposing meets these recomendations.  I would find it hard to believe that a puppy could adjust easily to being left 8 hours outside from the start so you would need to get it used to being left - in a run not tethered. An older dog may adjust better but depends on its previous history.  I agree it is unlikely a rescue will let a dog go to someone leaving it on its own for 8 hours a day.

Tricky situation for you but you have my respect for making the original post and thinking seriously - not all of us have the luxury of a dogwalker or only working part-time etc etc and you are as well to make these considerations before getting the dog.

[Old Shep]

Another reason to go for a kennel and run rather than a tether is to protect the dog. A tethered dog will not be able to get away from say another dog attacking it, but will be safe in a run.  They will need shelter from sun, rain and wind but also a sunny spot for cold winter mornings.  Many farmers do chain their dogs up and the dogs seem to be used to it but I personally don't like it.  I leave my dogs in a kennel during the day for 6 hours and they are absolutely fine - they just sleep!  They are all adults though I wouldn't leave a pup that long.  8 hours is a bit too long imho especially a single dog who would probably get stressed and bark.

[thenovice]

Thought the replies were a bit strong, an honest question deserves a civil reply. I do agree 100% that a lone dog tied up for hours is not right, but a pair of dogs kept for security is a different matter, if housed correctly. Working dogs are bred for specific jobs 

[hairy mary]

Anyone with intention of cruelty will not or would not post a question they would just go ahead and think they know best anyway!

A harsh reply has no effect other than to stop people asking questions. I would suspect most people on this site love thier animals and none would wish harm otherwise they would not be on the forum.

[knightquest]

Only just come to this thread but I have to say that I would try to secure the area that the dog can go into with the poultry etc. If this was done during a prolonged holiday time so that the pup could be observed but exposed to the final routine gradually, that would be the ideal situation. Perhaps some form of electric fence?
Dogs love routine and ours do in fact just chill whilst we are out.

I'm not a huge fan of runs and kennels personally and would worry about a tethered dog but as previously mentioned, working collies are tied up and so are Husky and Malamute dogs.

It is also true that destructive dogs are usually detructive in the 30 minutes after they have been left. If this is the case and you have a stressed out dog, then if you introduce a dog walker in the middle of the day, this increases the number of times of stressful exposure.

Full respect for asking the question. Just remember that the dog is a companion and a pack animal. It's pack mates don't have to be dogs or humans. You should also bear in mind that the temperament of the individual dog should be taken into account. If you took two dogs from the same litter, one could cope with a situation and the other would stress out.
Perhaps when the time comes, the right dog will come your way. lets hope so.

By the way, not all rescue centres are good at rehoming. The main one in Birmingham will let anyone have a dog, any dog!

Ian