[RUSTYME]

In light of recent events and the deepening economic collapse, and the complete worldwide inability to sort things out , is the end nigh ?
   Cheers Russ

[HappyHippy]

Oh, how I've missed you Russ 
Karen 

[deepinthewoods]

nah!! dont forget that its really only western capitalism thats in trouble, the eastern markets china for example are still growing. 
id still prime the mantraps tho russ

[Castle Farm]

So we are all feeling the pinch and I feel I need to know the answer to a  couple of question.

Since everything has gone up in price, mainly down to higher taxes including 20% VAT.

1.How much money has been knocked off 'our' dept?.
2 Are these higher taxes helping?

[deepinthewoods]

no money has been knocked off our debt, but the rate at which we are borrowing more than we pay back has slowed.  a bit.

[Berkshire Boy]

I think I heard the other day that the debt had risen by 5bn but as deepinthewoods said we are borrowing at a slower rate. This is a long term strategy and the debt will not vanish over night. 

[nihicib2]

Ha come to Ireland and feel our pain
Thankfully I wasn't one of the ones who thought the Celtic Tiger would last forever and built a big mansion and bought into the lifestyle that went with it.  A small two bed cottage for me, although there are people out there who are suffering and didn't deserve it, bloody politicians and w/bankers

 
Brid

[ellisr]

I think the politicians don't see the problems at normal level, we are still struggling as I was out of work for 3 months and OH for 7 months. We both have jobs now but have to try and catchup on bills etc so are actually worse off than ever before.

I am having to plan more business avenues for the holding as we need to double the income to stay afloat as the prices of things we have to buy in have increase so much in the past 2 years. Just now need to work out how to get a 36 hour day to fit everything in

[RUSTYME]

The end i refer to is the western monetary system. The growth they refer to is totally unsustainable . Our system has to crash, the.  only question is when? Greece will explode anytime soon, how far does the crap fly when it hits the banks fans ?

[ellisr]

A long way it was leoman brothers collapse that started all this and the US government refusing to help to stop the collapse

[SallyintNorth]

Perpetual growth on a finite planet always sounded improbable to me, too.

What's that thing about denial, anger, sadness, acceptance?  Seems to me the politicians and economists are still in denial, most of the populace has long moved on to anger.

[bazzais]

The end of what I ask myself sometimes? 

Do you ever wonder if the whole thing is manufactured?  Anybody with any sense knows you buy buy buy at a low and sell sell sell at a high.  There has to be lows in order for crazies in the city to buy? Frighten off the small guys, outlast them, coagulate your competitors and buy them out.

I just cant work anything out these days - 'I promise to pay the bearer' was once backed up with resources rather than the hollow promise of future work, as it seems these days.

Fair do's though - This is all what would ever result from our worldwide system - big boys getting bigger, richer getting richer and more powerful because the state has no power to interrupt.

Growth economies are made to make people with money - more money - there is no real reason why 'growth' is needed other than as a by product of an expanding and more productive workforce outweighing population increases.

leoman brothers - was a perfect example of why things are left to rot rather than save - it was not 'financially viable' (for anyone in the money markets to save)


In short, I dont think any more banks will be let to go to the dogs.  This is in a way unfortunate as its the public that pay for the mess and the money extracted. But in a sense its good cos it keeps the wolves from our door.

Baz

[DJ_Chook]

The end i refer to is the western monetary system...

Our system has to crash, the.  only question is when?... Greece will explode anytime soon, how far does the crap fly...

The petrodollar will eventually fall. Russia and china have allegedly stopped using the petrodollar. If the rest of the world follows.. Then hyper-inflation hits the USA as the dollar no longer has an international value. Anything the USA imports such as oil, food, products will need to be paid for with a currency other than American dollars. But the USA wont be able to use its American dollars to buy foreign currency.

Then the American dollar as the worlds reserve currency ceases to exist. Then other currencies follow suit. I don't think most people realise just how close the world came to this situation last month when the USA almost defaulted on its IMF debt. If Greece does default then Euro will be in way more trouble than the US dollar.

Take a look at the Zimbabwean dollar http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zimbabwean_dollar   we are quite possibly headed this way. We will start to trade in whatever currencies still have a face value. We will be back to bartering goods & services.

The world economy is in a very grave situation. On the plus side the British Pound is a safe, strong currency. We still have some actual gold reserves and assets to back up the £ in our economy. The US $ doesn't have such a back up. If we allow other economies to 'go under' the swirl will drag other economies under with it.

[bazzais]

Other economies wont see it as a civic responsibility to bail out - more as something that has to be done to save their own wealth.  This is the unfortunate thing with money.  It was once created to solve the problems of the workers in trading - now the whole system has been taken over.

Baz

[bazzais]

Tobin Tax - its one way forward.

Tax 'Gambling' (on profits)

Tax on investment gambling profits and tax at the investment risk too.

Thank god we kept the £ and we didnt enter the newest, biggest and most stable (even if its losing) currency system - only really made up for the oil industry.

Baz