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Author Topic: Rewilding - am I wrong? If so explain why  (Read 1111 times)

Me

  • Joined Feb 2014
  • Wild West
Re: Rewilding - am I wrong? If so explain why
« Reply #15 on: May 15, 2019, 05:16:40 pm »
Thanks for your input  :thumbsup:
Voss Electric Fence

arobwk

  • Joined Nov 2015
  • Kernow - some say it's in England !
Re: Rewilding - am I wrong? If so explain why
« Reply #16 on: May 15, 2019, 09:59:08 pm »
I'm still wondering what prompted this thread Me - what are you (and posters) all reading, watching on TV, listening to on the radio or following on the web that I am not?  Concept of rewilding seems to have passed me by !
« Last Edit: May 15, 2019, 10:49:54 pm by arobwk »

Fleecewife

  • Joined May 2010
  • South Lanarkshire
    • Wester Gladstone Hebridean Sheep
Re: Rewilding - am I wrong? If so explain why
« Reply #17 on: May 15, 2019, 11:42:13 pm »
I'm still wondering what prompted this thread Me - what are you (and posters) all reading, watching on TV, listening to on the radio or following on the web that I am not?  Concept of rewilding seems to have passed me by !


Wilding, by Isabella Tree, The Return of Nature to a British Farm


I have found this a convincing and enjoyable read. There are plenty of other books on the subject and I think people's different reactions to the OP depend on which books they have read and their individual experiences of what is a fairly new concept.
I agree that it would be good if @Me could tell us the point of the question, after getting the discussion going.
www.scothebs.co.uk

Do something today that your future self will thank you for - plant a tree

Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus - let sleeping dragons lie

Me

  • Joined Feb 2014
  • Wild West
Re: Rewilding - am I wrong? If so explain why
« Reply #18 on: May 16, 2019, 07:19:22 am »
I am brought into contact with people who promote this agenda regularly and the blind anti farming ethos that accompanies it 

honeyend

  • Joined Oct 2011
Re: Rewilding - am I wrong? If so explain why
« Reply #19 on: May 16, 2019, 09:15:09 am »
My favourite Time team programme is an excavation of a farming community in Barra,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rkf0iAwByjA
it shows the marks from ploughing in what is virtually sand.
  So we have farmed for a long time, what seems to have changed is the amount of people, and the thought that we can have everything we want, any time, anywhere and is it doesn't matter we consume, because there is more of it somewhere.
 In the UK we waste land covering it with block paving and concrete, we think of rewilding as big projects but in pursuit of the tidy , the wild is being tidied out of every day life, so you pay to visit the wild. All a bit Joni Mitchell.

  We export our plastic waste abroad, we import food, so perhaps before we think about taking large areas of productive land out of production we should work out what land can be farmed most easily, with low inputs, even commercial farmers are looking at no till and muck. The big argument in the Fens is the using of maize to use in the  biogas production. Wind farms are controversial but we have renewable wind, huge areas are being used for fuel crops.
  I love mangetout, but every time I eat them I have a dilemma , they have air miles, but someone makes a living from picking them? The plastic water bottle which is so convenient, if it is recycled is less energy used than glass, and its heavier to transport.
  I watched a film last night which seems to have a message that we need balance and eating bugs is the way forward.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1706620/?ref_=ttfc_fc_tt

Anke

  • Joined Dec 2009
  • St Boswells, Scottish Borders
Re: Rewilding - am I wrong? If so explain why
« Reply #20 on: May 16, 2019, 11:37:01 am »
I can well and truly recommend Isabella Tree's book - it did blow my mind. Where I am not massively in favour of re-introducing wolves into Britain - they will eventually come by themselves or someone will bring them in. Now well spread over most of Europe, my dad has met one on the road near to where they live in Northeastern Germany, the wolves are swimming across the Oder river from Poland.  And farming practices are changing, as in free-range grazing for sheep (never widely practiced on the continent anyway) is now a thing of the past.




arobwk

  • Joined Nov 2015
  • Kernow - some say it's in England !
Re: Rewilding - am I wrong? If so explain why
« Reply #21 on: May 16, 2019, 04:20:24 pm »
Thanks @Fleecewife for post #18.  I'll try and catch up !!

Fleecewife

  • Joined May 2010
  • South Lanarkshire
    • Wester Gladstone Hebridean Sheep
Re: Rewilding - am I wrong? If so explain why
« Reply #22 on: May 16, 2019, 11:51:09 pm »
I am brought into contact with people who promote this agenda regularly and the blind anti farming ethos that accompanies it


I haven't come across anti farming propaganda, but then I don't get out much ;D  Apart of course from the anti cattle and sheep brigade, who accept some pretty shaky statistics about methane output, without knowing that ruminant methane production can only be accurately measured by keeping individual animals in an input/output chamber, eating grain which is not their natural diet, and without grass and trees to absorb the gasses.  Extrapolating results obtained in that way, however accurately measured, is dangerous when applied to sheep and cattle worldwide, under every management system, and is bound to give inaccurate results.


I'm wondering if there is a difference between 'wilding' and 'rewilding', with the former meaning to allow nature to reclaim sections of less useful agricultural land, and the latter meaning the introduction of animals currently extinct in Britain. It appears to be the reintroductions which inspire polarised views.
I'm glad beavers, boar, ospreys and white tailed eagles have been brought back, and I have a hankering for wolves (probably because they are a bit like my one-time German Shepherd Dog  ::) ), but realistically I can't see wolves, lynx, bears and so on being either happy or tolerated in our modern world.  I don't think the population of Scotland has changed all that much recently, but that of Britain as a whole certainly has. I think for the big predators to thrive, they need large areas of land, not isolated patches, with fencing around them, and an absence of humanity with guns and road vehicles.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2019, 12:01:45 am by Fleecewife »
www.scothebs.co.uk

Do something today that your future self will thank you for - plant a tree

Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus - let sleeping dragons lie

arobwk

  • Joined Nov 2015
  • Kernow - some say it's in England !
Re: Rewilding - am I wrong? If so explain why
« Reply #23 on: May 17, 2019, 09:19:43 pm »
...... I'm wondering if there is a difference between 'wilding' and 'rewilding', with the former meaning to allow nature to reclaim sections of less useful agricultural land, and the latter meaning the introduction of animals currently extinct in Britain. .... 
There I was grappling with rewilding and trying to catch up ... and then you introduce wilding versus rewilding !!  My head is spinning  :)

Fleecewife

  • Joined May 2010
  • South Lanarkshire
    • Wester Gladstone Hebridean Sheep
Re: Rewilding - am I wrong? If so explain why
« Reply #24 on: May 17, 2019, 11:55:49 pm »
...... I'm wondering if there is a difference between 'wilding' and 'rewilding', with the former meaning to allow nature to reclaim sections of less useful agricultural land, and the latter meaning the introduction of animals currently extinct in Britain. .... 
There I was grappling with rewilding and trying to catch up ... and then you introduce wilding versus rewilding !!  My head is spinning  :)


Always glad to help  :D .  Read Isabella Tree's Wilding book first, then delve into some of the reintroductions stuff, and you'll see the difference, I hope.
www.scothebs.co.uk

Do something today that your future self will thank you for - plant a tree

Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus - let sleeping dragons lie

Me

  • Joined Feb 2014
  • Wild West
Re: Rewilding - am I wrong? If so explain why
« Reply #25 on: May 18, 2019, 09:00:37 am »
I am brought into contact with people who promote this agenda regularly and the blind anti farming ethos that accompanies it
I have a hankering for wolves (probably because they are a bit like my one-time German Shepherd Dog  ::) )

Check out this go pro video of an old hunting dog who encounters two wolves when lost in a wood, young ones I think but I'm not sure, she is wearing a chainmail vest and is a tough old cookie, its hard to watch. I think our ancestors did us a solid getting rid of them personally! (ps. I love german shepherds, I have one by my side right now)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u1zCNH_oN2Q&t=134s

arobwk

  • Joined Nov 2015
  • Kernow - some say it's in England !
Re: Rewilding - am I wrong? If so explain why
« Reply #26 on: May 18, 2019, 01:42:02 pm »
....  Read Isabella Tree's Wilding book first, then delve into some of the reintroductions stuff, and you'll see the difference, I hope.
I found this very comprehensive newspaper article/summary instead   https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5640191/How-letting-Mother-Nature-reclaim-prime-farmland-produced-breathtaking-results.htm

Steph Hen

  • Joined Jul 2013
  • Angus Scotland.
Re: Rewilding - am I wrong? If so explain why
« Reply #27 on: May 18, 2019, 02:24:14 pm »
The way things are now there is little room for rewilding or reintroducing species. The only Scottish beavers I’ve seen around Kirriemuir have had a pretty big influence on the immediate area.  When I was a wildlife biology student I was told they wouldn’t build dams! Turns out they do build dams (which need regular clearing with a jcb and now managers have installed metal cages in the waterways to prevent beavers entering streams and blocking them). They fell quite a lot of trees and ring bark still more; land managers have wrapped trees in chicken wire in an effort to protect them. About every waterway in lowlands is mapped and managed, I consider it will become another burden to deal with which we could do without. Perhaps allowing all these to become half blocked and flood for the winter months will be great or, perhaps it’ll erode tons and tons of soil as well as take more ground out of production? As for the trees along the waterways forming wildlife corridors, not sure it’ll look the same once beavers have moved in, unless we cover them all in chicken wire!

I LOVE the idea of leaving our land to heal and regenerate for decades but it cannot be done.  And yes, it’s irresponsible because using other countries resources and then excess energy shipping food here cannot be ethical.

oor wullie

  • Joined Jun 2012
  • Strathnairn
Re: Rewilding - am I wrong? If so explain why
« Reply #28 on: May 18, 2019, 03:51:19 pm »
The way things are now there is little room for rewilding or reintroducing species.

But there is, just not everywhere.

Trying to rewild Holyrood Park in Edinburgh is clearly not going to work.  On the other hand, just south of where I live, you could draw a line on a map enclosing about 1500km2 (1/3 million acres).  That single area could be drawn without enclosing any roads or habited houses and that land currently supports next to no cattle or sheep (or any other agriculture).  There are several similar areas in Scotland.

You would need to spend 50 years allowing woodland to recover as the first stage of re-wilding but why not?

PS don't that the Highlands are a wild and natural landscape as they are now, they are managed and modified by people as much as any other landscape.

Me

  • Joined Feb 2014
  • Wild West
Re: Rewilding - am I wrong? If so explain why
« Reply #29 on: May 18, 2019, 07:10:40 pm »
I don't think that is quite right, I reckon if you want the landscape back to a certain way 50 years is not nearly long enough, it would be a doable timescale with active planting etc but not abandonment

 

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