[minibn]

Good evening

I have a shetland ram who horns have started to grow very close to his eyes. His left horn actually brushes his eye lashes. They are rather large horns and curl around. When i first got him over a year ago, his horns seemed to be growing correctly. He shares his field with his fellow freinds (5x other shetaland rams.) They all seem to get on pretty well, although they do have the odd disagreement, but nothing major. If they have a disagreement they will have a head butting match. I do think that this could have affected the direction of growth of his horns. Is this actaully possible?

Any advice as to help sort his horns out, please let me know. I know that they do have feeling and a good blood supply to there horns. Is this the case for the whole horn?

These are the first sheep which i have owned, so im a little unsure as to how to sort him out. I have attached some photos of him. They are a little blurey as he wouldn't keep still for long enough.


Thanks for reading

Emily

[bigchicken]

Yes a bit of a dilemma for you, I have a shetland ram who's horns were growing into his head and I cut them with a cheese wire saw not the most aesthetic result but practical. I have heard of people heating the horn and bending them. I have also heard of people constructing an adjustable brace to put tension on the horn to gradually force them out.What ever you do I wish you the best of luck, If he is a pet you will want it sorted, But I would advise not to use him as a breeding ram because of him malformed horns and the possibility of him passing it on.

[Slimjim]

Hi Minibn, this is a worry, and a problem I had with my Jacob ram.  As a complete novice I didn't fancy the heat and bend technique described in Tim Tyne's book, ( plus my ram is the size of a water buffalo) so I asked the vet to cut off the offending sections.  He whacked in 20ml of Valium type tranquilliser, Malcolm sat down after a few minutes, and the Vet used the braided cheese wire thingy. It was actually a calf embryotomy saw, but did the trick. The blood vessels and nerves don't go right to the end of the horn, so by removing about a third, there was only a drop of blood spilled. It cost the vet a lot of sweat and me £70!! very important to stabilise the ram's head against the pull of the wire. If I had enough help to keep the animal still, I would do it myself next time.
There has been some recent correspondence here under " Where can I get a saw to cut my ram's horns " or something like that. Other people have tackled it differently. Good luck!

[Foobar]

You could cut them, but if you are keeping him you might find that they keep growing in the same direction after the ends have been cut off, i.e. into his head.  So you might have more luck turning them.  There are instructions in Tim Tyne's book, or maybe you have a local farmer who is experienced in this ?

[Penninehillbilly]

Years ago I used to help a dairy farmer and always remembered him talking of using a cheese wire to cut horns, you have to work fast and not stop once started, the heat the cheese wire builds up cauterizes (sp?) any blood vesels that ARE caught. He did say it was hard work!

[feldar]

My BWM has a slightly bent horn and the guy i got him from said he can heat it and turn it outwards. What i'm not sure about is how far down the horn you can heat it before it starts to hurt the ram.
Your boy looks like its the thicker part of the horn that's the problem so you may have to remove it.
What you need is an old shepherd who has done all this before.
I will ask around and see if anyone knows

[minibn]

Thank you for all of the replies. I think I shall leave it for someone who knows what there doing. He is very strong considering his size. I shall ask around to see if anyone near by could cone and sort him out. Im a bit reluctant to get the vet, as one of you mentioned it being rather expensive. If any of you know someone in the Gloucestershire area, please let me know.

Regards

Emily

[Fleecewife]

Hi minibn>  You don't mention how old your ram is.  The older he is the less likely his horns are to grow much further.  If he's a shearling then they have a lot more growth to go.  I agree that he should not be used for breeding as horn shape is hereditary to some extent.  Horns can grow right into the bones of the head or face, or into the eyes if they are pointing that way, which is ultra gruesome
To work out how far the internal blood vessels reach, hold the horn in your hand - where it feels warm to the touch there is a blood supply present, where it's external temp then you are clear of the live part.
Very sensible to let someone else do it, but do make sure they know what they are on about.  If you decide to use the heat treatment, you must protect his face and eyes with an asbestos oven cloth or similar.
I think the stretcher bars would only work on a young animal.
 The cheese wire saw is readily obtainable at hardware stores and not as hard as all that to use.  The trick is to keep your hands wide apart, so the wire is almost straight.  Again, the eyes must be protected from the filings.  If you were to do that, this particular horn could be cut at an angle, so it sits further from the face and has a bit of a point towards the outer side.  It might be a temporary fix to file the inner surface of the horn to give it the same profile, again protecting the face.
On a non-sedated ram, just having one person to hold the head firmly is enough, without having to use sedation - it is only painful if the cut goes through the part with a blood supply.
 
Looking again at the photos, the deformity looks as if it may have been caused by someone dragging the ram along by the horns several times when he was young.

[uptheyard]

Hi,

I have recently have had to cut the end of a horn from a balwen. Quite easy to do. Get someone to hold as you will be pulling against them, using an embroyotmy wire - or you can get one used for cutting branches, you loop it round the horn and then you have the handle ends close together and cut, giving and take with each hand - you cannot use the wire held straight it is not cutting cheese, You use it as though you are cutting a branch. Whatever you do dont stop as it will get stuck.  If it bleeds , some antiseptic  powder bit of cotton wool and some duct tape, keeps the flies off and staunches any bleeding. 
All the best
Anne
www.bagsinheartoftheforest.co.uk   

[jaykay]

We used to have to cut horns regularly with our Rough Fell tups.

The 'cheesewire' (bought from the agri store for the purpose) is easier to use if you fasten each end round a thick dowel. Then someone holds the tup, check as described to see where the warm horn ends, and saw like crazy - it's physically hard work, but not too much trouble for the tup. From what I can see on your photo, I'd saw through above the eye if possible (if the nerves/blood finish above the eye) and then take the inside corner off what was left.

Get it done soon though, as the horn can thicken up by the eye as it grows, and then put pressure on the eye, which turns them blind - horrid.

Can I thread jack though and ask about horn braces - has anyone used them? I've heard of a wire bucket handle being used, but how do you fasten it etc? I have a Shetland lamb whose horns are aiming for the back of his head -  they need widening soon. If not a bucket handle, what else?

[Dougal]

With a Shetland tup they have fairly fine horns. Big set of lopers like you use to trim a hedge work a real treat. The cheese wire can be a bought in almost any agricultural store. Ebay will do some. A hacksaw will also work and may be the easiest option if you have to hold the tup yourself.
At that point on the head (close to the line with the eye) there will be no if any blood vessels. If there are then they will be real small ones so the bleeding will soon stop and at this time of year there will be no worries with the flies. If you are worried about bleeding you can tie a single piece of string right round the base of BOTH horns really tight and as close to the head as you can. Trim the horn, wait ten minutes and cut the string and the lose of blood will be next to nothing.