[GavCrawf]

Hi,

I'm doing some long term planning for a smallholding and a future consideration is to have a couple of hives maybe next year or the even the year after. But at this stage I just trying to get an idea of the costs involved to set this up from scratch. I'm not sure what equipment I would need along with the hives and bees, so any help for my financial planning would be gratefully received. I've budgeted in £200 for an initial training course / education, but hope other here may be able to give some guidance.

Gavin

[Victorian Farmer]

You're best bet is to make you're hives get second hand suit and go to the shows most times bees are sold about 80 pound .Get used to them all will be good I have 12 hives all made of plastic to natshnal frames .IHope this helps.

[Bionic]

If you can get bees at the price VF says then you will be doing very well.  There has been such a demand this year that nucs were selling at £150 and above.
Apart from the bees and hives you will need a suit, gloves of some sort, a smoker and hive tool. There are plenty of other bits and pieces you can buy too like a feeder, veroa treatment, queen cage etc but you shouldn't need these right at the start.

[Greenerlife]

You certainly don't need £200 for education though - just join a local bee keeping society - most don't charge a fortune, and some will allow you to keep bees at the apiary as you learn.  If you don't get your own swarm though, buying bees can be VERY expensive, and the cost of new hives is hugely expensive - down here even some of the second hand stuff is reaching ridiculous prices - some kit even making more money than new - totally ridiculous!

[HesterF]

Yep, initial course should be cheaper. I bought everything new from my teacher - who also supplied the nucs. The total was over £1000 for suit, smoker, two national hives with all the frames and foundation (assembled), entrance blocks, hive stand, bases, two supers per hive, one nuc box, hive tool, gloves, porter bee escapes, feeders, probably some other stuff plus two nucs of bees.

I also painted and varnished the hives (not necessary) and have since bought some smoker fuel (cheap but easier than my sawdust) and some inverted syrup feed (surprisingly expensive).

Trouble is that you need spare equipment too really - things like swarm control need you to be able to manipulate across to a nuc box or spare hive.

I'm sure you can do it a lot cheaper than I did - I really didn't shop around. I am also useless at woodwork things so apart from putting foundation in frames, I paid them to assemble everything - and to bring over the nucs and put them into the hives for me. My mentor was a carpenter by trade so he makes all his own hives and other stuff which I'm sure saves a ton. Even being happy to assemble everything will save you.

H

[darkbrowneggs]

Have a mooch through this


http://www.biobees.com/forum/


Keeping bees neednt be expensive.  My first swarm self installed in an old hive I was given, and I built up to 8 hives in less than 3 years. 

[Bionic]

I also painted and varnished the hives (not necessary) and have since bought some smoker fuel (cheap but easier than my sawdust) and some inverted syrup feed (surprisingly expensive).

Eggs boxes work very well as smoker fuel 

[cloddopper]

Gav decide from the start that you will only use a commercial hive or the rationalized one known as the British National hive developed  for bee keepers just before the war to use minimum materials and effort.
 It is imperative to use the one hive for that way you will have everything of the same standard sizes which makes for cheapness and ease of doing things .

 Some of the earlier designed hives are nothing but disease and pest traps that waste your time and money .  .
 A The Wilson and the Smiths hive fall into this category though they do look cute on chocolate box cottage type pictures.
 Like some have said see if you can get a decent bee keeper , ( I add , one with 20 or so hives )  to mentor you .. If they have the skill to run 20 hives they are usually far more effective at doing it than some one who has three hives made to different designs & sizes .

 My own observations from seeing hundreds and hundreds of different hives and bee keeping styles is that  some folk will need second mortgages to run tow hives . Others with a bit of carpentry skills can make hives for around £37 and when fitted out with self spacing frames  it comes in at around £100 . bee's can be had for free or purchased , it is essential to treat any feral or purchased  stock with anti Varroa as soon as you put them in a hive even if they are supposed to be Varroa free .. ( cost around £10 ?? per hive.
 

 Makingth foundation that the bees draw their cells on can be cheap or expensive .. cheap is running a 3 mm bead of molten bees wax along the underside if the top bar of a frame and down the legs and letting the bees draw out the wax , expensive is buying ready wired sheet wax . Mid way is casting your own wax sheet in plastic moulds .

 What ever route you finally choose do get some mentored experience handling several other people bees before you get your own set up going. It will save you money in the long run .
 Once you have the hives and bees there is not too much expense IF you have learnt the craft well and let the bees do the work instead of you doing it and spending large amounts of dosh.
 Any second hand equipment you get needs to be of a modern design not some old gear made of copper or lard boxes that's 80 yrs. old and only suitable as something in a museum.
 
Clothing : -
A boiler suit with a zip front and sown up pockets with a face veil over a brimmed hat tucked inside is usually far cheaper than a specially made jumper veil or a full bee suit . Black mesh for the veil is much easier to see out of than white mesh as it does not reflect light .
Wearing wellies with the boiler suit tucked inside and a small over hang over of the leg is useful for bees usually only climb upwards .

Gloves are optional though if you do use any see if you can get hold of a pack of the sort that are used by garage mechanics .. use a pair to each hive and burn them , that way you don't spread disease. No need for a bee brush use grass instead .
 A modern hive tool is useful , but if your on skinny money an old hoe blade or "London screwdriver that is 3/4 to 1" wide across the blade end can be useful so ling as the stems are cut off   


 I made most of my hives buying in cut and planed red cedar to size material from a big joinery & timber yard concern , I made it so that the crown boards were 3 " deep sealed seam feeders with a central tower that had a 3/4 " hole drilled through the tower to let the bees come up and feed. Around each tower I used stainless steel staples to staple a section of green scotchbrite pan scrubber so that the bees could walk up and down to the sugar syrup without drowning whilst the hive lids were securely in place .

 For smoker fuel I used corrugated cardboard in 3 inch strips rolled tight and water paste glued up ( fitted an elastic band on then till ready for use 0  , I also used well weathered well dried cow pats and weathered dried strips of hessian sack .

Best of all was "  Bee Wood " keep an eye out for well rotted logs and tree stumps for almost any tree but not from the elderberry shrub as it is a bugger to get going ( known as witches wood partly for this reason )
 Break any of this well rotted wood of and bring it home store in in hessian sacks or big strong cardboard boxes . Use slips of unpainted pine or any soft wood to get a fire in the smoker going a decent sized 2 litre or more smoker is better than a silly little one pint that soon burns all the smoker fuel  ( I used a plumbers electronic igniting  blow lamp to start the burn )
When it gets going and the e smoker is about 1/3 rd. full of hot burning wood add a decent plug of the dry bee wood  and give a few puffs to get it burning .
 A decent cork plug  to plug the smoker to stop you wasting fuel  is useful so are a couple of spares , champagne corks are reasonable plugs

 Perhaps think of making a light plywood tote with a central handle with  five to six inch tall sides and some compartments  one of which you 'll use to hold and secure the smoker and one at the opposite end to hold spare fuel the others an be for clean cloves  and a hive tool , wax scrapings , propolis  scrapings etc. .

 My most expensive item was scrap sugar to make sure the bees had sufficient stores to see then through bad weather and over winter. And an old tar burner gas ring to heat water to boiling in a 45 gallon cut out top steel drum  to make the syrup with  added thymol .

 I was fortunate my main mentor had some 120 hives , + neuc  and many years of experience.
Alvin was always on about making sure the bees had enough honey stored at any time in the year or needing to feed them  . I found a large food company that sold spilt sugar at pennies per KG had to buy 300 kg per time so I purchased several 330 litre  lidded food barrels to store it .

 It's reckoned more hives die in spring  because of not enough stocks from August into winter than needs to be .. as this will not give the bees enough stores or new bees to get them through a damp winter.
 Cold wet springs & summers will also see bees that came through winter healthy also starve if there is not enough forage present. 

When you get your two or three mentors setups in your brain you should have gathered enough info to start some basic calculations of your own .

If you must have a set of figure for a business plan go for all brand new costing's plus VAT and add 20 %  you'll be fairly close to a realistic figure .

[Olly398]

I started this year, here's my outlay:
20 - Join local club / district BKA
75 - Beginners course run by club (12 x evening classes)
50 - Bee suit
15 - Home build top bar hive (thread on here or link below)
10 - sugar for syrup
 
£170 for the lot, soon adds up eh.
 
Swarm caught for free.

[WillieBee]

Have a mooch through this

http://www.biobees.com/forum/

I think that forum is more for folk interested in keeping bees the 'natural way' using top bar hives.

For the more common hives (National etc) there are a couple of better forums ..

http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/index.php

http://www.beesource.com/forums/forum.php  although this is a USA site

[hughesy]

I also painted and varnished the hives (not necessary) and have since bought some smoker fuel (cheap but easier than my sawdust) and some inverted syrup feed (surprisingly expensive).

Eggs boxes work very well as smoker fuel 

We used to mess around with all sorts of stuff in the smoker. Hessian, dry rotten wood, you name it. A piece of corrugated cardboard rolled up to fit in the smoker wins hands down. It's easy to light and lasts ages.