Author Topic: Meat boxes (Read 4522 times)

cambee · « **on:** July 26, 2018, 02:12:55 pm »

Hi all. We are first timers as many of you know and this Autumn we are hoping to sell our 5 March born coloured Ryeland Tup lambs as half meat boxes. Having slaughtered one hogget already for our own table, we know that our abattoir will cut and butcher them (although the presentation was bad so I will have to do something about that as the meat just came back in a big bag!). We have interest from family and friends but want to be able to advertise at our farm gate as being close to the village we get lots of footfall, our eggs are very popular and it would make delivery more local. I’ve made a first contact with Environmental health as I think we have to register with them (?) but does anyone have any other advice or tips? I know it’s small scale at the moment but the plan is to increase our flock over the next year, subject to the grass ever growing, so we need to get it right. Thank you

twizzel · « **Reply #1 on:** July 26, 2018, 07:14:07 pm »

Best thing we ever did was buy a set of scales and started weighing lambs. People don’t want fatty lamb so if you can weigh as well as handle regularly it helps a lot.

cambee · « **Reply #2 on:** July 26, 2018, 07:35:43 pm »

Don’t want to sound stupid but how did you know what they should weigh? Also we don’t feed ours (other than the odd bucket for training) so if they’re fat it’s a bit of a problem.

twizzel · « **Reply #3 on:** July 26, 2018, 09:25:46 pm »

We draw ours at 42-44kg live, anything over that goes over fat, ours are Dorset cross Lleyn so naturally good doers. If they go fat then you’ve left them too long... I start weighing mine at their first heptavac jab about 6 weeks old then every fortnight thereafter and started drawing lambs this year at about 14 weeks. If you looked at them in the field you’d say they were nowhere near the right weights but put them over the scales and they were finished

Backinwellies · « **Reply #4 on:** July 26, 2018, 09:42:09 pm »

Rylands born early March will be ready earlier than you think … Rylands go to fat quickly.

honeyend · « **Reply #5 on:** July 27, 2018, 01:33:56 pm »

My advice is don't panic.
Get the EHO to send you a Safer Food Better Business pack which include a temperature log and paperwork for a cleaning schedule.
If you are thinking of repacking you need a clean area with facilities for washing.
https://www.nisbets.co.uk/consumables/food-labelling-and-wrapping/_/a33-2
If you storing, fridge or freezer and transporting it you should have a temperature log
https://www.nisbets.co.uk/hygiplas-digital-fridge-and-freezer-thermometer/f343
The ideal is its butchered and you drop it off at the customer but often people drop out so I would look for a second hand fridge freezer as a just in case. The first time I did it I completely under estimated how much freezer space it took.

SallyintNorth · « **Reply #6 on:** July 27, 2018, 03:47:34 pm »

Quote from: honeyend on July 27, 2018, 01:33:56 pm

My advice is don't panic.
Get the EHO to send you a Safer Food Better Business pack which include a temperature log and paperwork for a cleaning schedule.
If you are thinking of repacking you need a clean area with facilities for washing.
https://www.nisbets.co.uk/consumables/food-labelling-and-wrapping/_/a33-2
If you storing, fridge or freezer and transporting it you should have a temperature log
https://www.nisbets.co.uk/hygiplas-digital-fridge-and-freezer-thermometer/f343
The ideal is its butchered and you drop it off at the customer but often people drop out so I would look for a second hand fridge freezer as a just in case. The first time I did it I completely under estimated how much freezer space it took.

:bookmark: requirements for supplying meat

cambee · « **Reply #7 on:** July 27, 2018, 04:13:12 pm »

Sorry Sally I didn’t understand that? I’m still waiting for a call back from the EH officer but I’m thinking that possibly some of the stuff it goes through in the food safety pack is more for people prepping stuff at home rather than just collecting and delivering from the abattoir? I don’t think we will ever be in a position to do our own packaging etc, I was just thinking of asking the abattoir to package the lamb as boxed rather than in a big bag though that’ll probably add to the £20 fee. Also Wellies we were planning on slaughter at 6 months so hopefully not too fat by then. Thinking of £70 per half lamb? Any comments on that? Also has anyone ever got the skin back from the lambs and sent it off to be made into rugs? They have such beautiful coloured fleeces!

twizzel · « **Reply #8 on:** July 27, 2018, 04:48:38 pm »

Quote from: cambee on July 27, 2018, 04:13:12 pm

Sorry Sally I didn’t understand that? I’m still waiting for a call back from the EH officer but I’m thinking that possibly some of the stuff it goes through in the food safety pack is more for people prepping stuff at home rather than just collecting and delivering from the abattoir? I don’t think we will ever be in a position to do our own packaging etc, I was just thinking of asking the abattoir to package the lamb as boxed rather than in a big bag though that’ll probably add to the £20 fee. Also Wellies we were planning on slaughter at 6 months so hopefully not too fat by then. Thinking of £70 per half lamb? Any comments on that? Also has anyone ever got the skin back from the lambs and sent it off to be made into rugs? They have such beautiful coloured fleeces!

Don't plan on killing at a certain age- handle them regularly and you'll soon feel when they are fit. If I left my Dorset crosses to 6 months old the majority would be obese. It's also worth going along to your local livestock auction and seeing the lambs for sale there- that's what the commercial buyers want but it will give you an idea of fat cover and size. Even better, book onto a live to dead day run by AHDB, have a look on their events tab on the beef and lamb website and you'll see details. As to the price, you need to work out your cost of production, add on the kill and cut charge and your time in taking them to the abattoir and picking up the meat after. Don't under value yourself and your product.

The document below is a good read, there's lots about commercial lamb selling but a few pages on selection for slaughter and what to look/feel for.
http://beefandlamb.ahdb.org.uk/wp/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/BRP-Marketing-prime-lamb-manual-1-180116.pdf

SallyintNorth · « **Reply #9 on:** July 27, 2018, 05:16:57 pm »

Quote from: cambee on July 27, 2018, 04:13:12 pm

Sorry Sally I didn’t understand that? I’m still waiting for a call back from the EH officer but I’m thinking that possibly some of the stuff it goes through in the food safety pack is more for people prepping stuff at home rather than just collecting and delivering from the abattoir? I don’t think we will ever be in a position to do our own packaging etc, I was just thinking of asking the abattoir to package the lamb as boxed rather than in a big bag though that’ll probably add to the £20 fee. Also Wellies we were planning on slaughter at 6 months so hopefully not too fat by then. Thinking of £70 per half lamb? Any comments on that? Also has anyone ever got the skin back from the lambs and sent it off to be made into rugs? They have such beautiful coloured fleeces!

It was [member=23193]honeyend[/member] posted the links, I just bookmarked the post so I can find it again.

As to skins, we are just about to fetch the first batch of the coloured fleeces from 'my' sheep. It costs £27 in actual money plus time and fuel / courier. So to sell you'd want to be getting £50 a piece I think. It all depends on whether you have the outlets, I think. If you are in an affluent and or tourist area and have a farmers', craft or artisan market, you can probably charge more.

Our Zwartbles sheep have huge fleeces and hence also huge skins. Personally their fleece does nothing for me and I am not interested in spinning

it, although it's perfectly spinnable. But the skins are amazing! Massive, thick and luxurious, this lovely black fibre with brown tips - fabulous! They cost the same to produce as the much more modestly-sized but much finer-fibred Shetland-cross skins. It remains to be seen how the latter compare, and whether they will sell. (And of course I have friends queued up for all the pretty ones out of the first batch, so I won't really know until next year

)

SallyintNorth · « **Reply #10 on:** July 27, 2018, 05:19:08 pm »

I would think your Ryeland skins would be similar to the Zwartbles ones - colour similar, though more brown than black, lovely fibre to put your hands into, and a very good size. I'm sure you'd find a market for them - though others who've tried may say different :/

Buttermilk · « **Reply #11 on:** July 28, 2018, 06:58:25 am »

My butcher will box the meat as long as I take him the boxes for it.

honeyend · « **Reply #12 on:** July 28, 2018, 09:19:34 am »

Quote from: cambee on July 27, 2018, 04:13:12 pm

Sorry Sally I didn’t understand that? I’m still waiting for a call back from the EH officer but I’m thinking that possibly some of the stuff it goes through in the food safety pack is more for people prepping stuff at home rather than just collecting and delivering from the abattoir? I don’t think we will ever be in a position to do our own packaging etc, I was just thinking of asking the abattoir to package the lamb as boxed rather than in a big bag though that’ll probably add to the £20 fee. Also Wellies we were planning on slaughter at 6 months so hopefully not too fat by then. Thinking of £70 per half lamb? Any comments on that? Also has anyone ever got the skin back from the lambs and sent it off to be made into rugs? They have such beautiful coloured fleeces!

You are going to be a retailer.
https://www.food.gov.uk/business-guidance/safer-food-better-business-for-retailers
You are going to receive your product from the butcher and store it until you sell it.
If you can get people to take it on the same day you probably just need some large cool boxes,
https://www.campingworld.co.uk/en/gb/Igloo-Polar-120-Qt-Cooler-2018/m-22406.aspx?PartnerID=1631&utm_source=google&utm_medium=shopping&utm_campaign=UnitedKingdom&gclid=Cj0KCQjwqPDaBRC6ARIsACAf4hD35PcvDSz29YnRo0ql5qrweouUVPidOofgm6_oAhdlqdGWXxyvZXgaAobkEALw_wcB
thermometer and a paper log of temperatures
If you have to store until collection you can keep in the boxes, or transfer it to a fridge.
The last time I had a lambs butchered in came back in a box labelled and boxed and it fitted easily in the fridge. If you have to pay a little more for this service I would. I have a separate larder fridge and chest freezer that I use for raw meat. You do not have to spend a lot of money.
EHO are really helpful and they just want to make sure that you are aware of the risks and understand what you have to do to avoid potential hazards.

Womble · « **Reply #13 on:** July 28, 2018, 09:50:40 am »

Canbee, We shopped around until we found a butcher who would package and freeze the meat in boxes ready for us.
That way, we can pick it up from them and 'do the rounds' with it in monster coolboxes, and it stays frozen no problem. This means that we never actually handle the meat ourselves, and nor do we ever have it in an un-frozen state. That reduces / removes any food safety risks, and also cuts down the hassle for us considerably.

Backinwellies · « **Reply #14 on:** July 28, 2018, 10:09:11 am »

Guess it depends on who your customers are but we just collect in the plastic sack and deliver straight to customers … they put in freezer on delivery. (we do transport in large polystyrene boxes with freezer packs). We offer vacuum packaging at extra cost (butcher charges about £8 per sheep I think). There is no packing by us or storage.

Our customers are people who know us and how we produce our lamb and the cost, that is what is important not the box in comes in! However I can see that if selling to an unknown customer presentation would be more important.

£65 to £70 a half is a generally good guide ……….. but if you are going to add boxing and fancy packaging its going to add considerably to cost.