[John Polak]

My wife and I are looking to rent some grazing land for a small herd of Alpacas (probably four to begin with - maybe rising to six or maximum eight eventually). We have found a suitable site, but not sure about how much we should be paying. The site is not great pasture and will need improving (it is currently unused). It is quite high up (over 1,000 ft in the Cairngorms) - so probably classes as hill grazing. There is however an outbuilding, part of which we can use as a shelter (the weather can be a bit rough in these parts to say the least!). The owner is talking about a ‘price per animal’ - at between £5- £10 per animal per week (rather than a straight price per acre). Our local research so far suggests this is on the high side - but we don’t want to get off on the wrong foot by making a silly offer. The site extends to about 2.5 acres in total - across two paddocks which he says we could rotate. Any thoughts from anyone?

[Steph Hen]

Dunno if it's any use, but my mum charges £10 horse, per week, grass only, field shelters in South Wales.
 I think we're something like 40p per week, per sheep, for our bit of grass in Angus.
 I'd try to get a flat rate and it's up to you how to stock/supliment with hay or whatever.

What do you do with your alpacas?  Here's a question for you; does anyone milk alpacas as they do camels in other countries?

[landroverroy]

It's exorbitant for poor quality hill land. Whatever you pay (in my opinion) does not want to amount to more than £100/acre, ie £250/year. I pay that sort of rent for decent lowland sheep/cattle grazing, but in the end basically it's worth but you are prepared to pay.

[Womble]

If I was getting exclusive rights to the whole site, I'd want to make that clear and pay a set price per month, rather than per animal. That then prevents the situation where you save good grazing for yourself in the rested paddock, only to find somebody else's sheep chomping away at it one morning (please don't ask me how I learned that lesson, but I'll refer you to my signature!  )


Round here, reasonable upland grazing rents for around 55p per sheep per week. It might be useful for you to think about that in terms of 'livestock units' (according to this Scottish Government table a single cow = 1 LSU, a single sheep = 0.15 LSU and an alpaca is 0.3).


That means an alpaca is worth roughly two sheep, i.e. £1.10 per week, so that's certainly nearer £5 than £10!


It's also worth thinking hard about stocking densities. This varies enormously depending on the situation, but I reckon our 5 acres can support roughly ten ewes (plus their lambs during summer only), so that would be equivalent to five alpaca.  Now, you're quite a bit further North than us, with half the land, and at higher altitude. Just beware that to support 4+ alpaca, you may need to secure additional grazing somewhere else, or buy in feed for them all year round.


I hope that helps! 

[John Polak]

Thanks everyone. Some good advice there. I think this one is probably a non starter - not sure where the guy has got his figures from. Back to the drawing board! Sorry if I'm doing anything wrong here anywhere, I'm not really a forum user, still trying to work out which buttons to press! 

[Womble]

Well, I don't know about non-starter, just perhaps not the be-all and end-all.

Can I ask a cheeky, but genuine question?  Why alpaca? 

From what I can see, their only product is fleece, and that fleece is not valuable enough to cover even their feed for a year. So, apart from just the simple joy of having them, what's the attraction? 

[landroverroy]

Well, I don't know about non-starter, just perhaps not the be-all and end-all.

Can I ask a cheeky, but genuine question?  Why alpaca? 

From what I can see, their only product is fleece, and that fleece is not valuable enough to cover even their feed for a year. So, apart from just the simple joy of having them, what's the attraction? 

Same old question Womble! And still not got a straight answer.

[Womble]

Who knows? Maybe this time?      It's not just me being antagonistic, honestly!  I'd genuinely like to know!

We just had lamb chops for dinner, and they were amazing!  Alpaca chops.... perhaps less common?

[Steph Hen]

That what I wondered, and milk. Camel milk is £25/litre! I wondered if alpaca milk is a thing?

[Part time dabbler]

Womble

I might attempt to answer your question on why alpacas. I am thinking of getting three to keep in a section of my garden which is about an acre in size. The reasons:

1. I am not a commercial operation, I do things that please me not to make money. I realise that may be a big differentiator with genuine smallholders on here and I fully understand the reasons why they would not agree with my approach.

2. The section of garden is on a slope and is too steep to keep mowed and under control so I have been looking at different options for this section which holds half my fruit trees.

3. I have chickens (another that costs me more than I make  )  and have recently lost one to a fox. It may be an urban myth but I understand foxes don't like alpacas and therefore the chickens would be able to free range every day rather than just while I am out in the garden (they have a big run that is safe but I like that they truly free range, especially the ex-bat hens that have had such a terrible life up to when we got them, even the foxes would have turned them down I recon).

4. They are cute looking, what can I say I am a softy lol

5. Important to SWMBO they poop in the same place

I am sure there would be other options but each with its own drawback

[harmony]

Thanks everyone. Some good advice there. I think this one is probably a non starter - not sure where the guy has got his figures from. Back to the drawing board! Sorry if I'm doing anything wrong here anywhere, I'm not really a forum user, still trying to work out which buttons to press!

He got his figures from what he'd like for his land and maybe what he thought he'd get.

[Womble]

Thanks for that, part time dabbler. I would never say that you're not a genuine smallholder just because you're not trying to make money from it. If you enjoy keeping your animals, all power to you, and thanks for your answers .

[Maysie]

I know I am too late to the party here ref land rental prices, but just thought I would add my thoughts anyway as they may be useful for others who find this thread in the future. 

We used to rent paddocks for horses (in rural Suffolk).  It was flat decent grazing land, but there was no running water or power, which was a total PITA. 
The number of horses varied from 2 to 4 over the years that we rented it. 

We rented it as 2 parcels:
1. Parcel A was 3 acres and included land and a stable block with 3 stables on it.  It was £1560/year (£130 per month)
2. Parcel B was a further 3.5 acres of grazing and was £720/year (£60 per month). 

The farmer installed the post and rail fencing free of charge for us, but thereafter we maintained everything and supplied the repair materials.  This was as cheap as we were going to find in the area. 

We now fortunately own our land for the horses, but if I had 2.5 acres of land available to rent to someone, I certainly would not want anyone on my land for £250/year, as it simply is not worth the (potential) hassle that they may generate, so cost of rental is a very hard one to compare, as it is not just about what you are willing to pay, it also needs to be worth the Landlords while too.  There are two sides to everything of course!