[Justin]

So we've been smallholding for 3 years now, slowly finding out feet. We don't do it to make a living, we have the glamping site for that, but for our own fun and enjoyment. We started with chickens for eggs, building them a large fenced run and they free range up to the orchard every day. Although there are foxes around in the woods on the property, we've never had a problem so far. I think our dogs help with that.

The past 2 years we've raised weaners for pork and will continue doing so each year now we've tasted the result

Next year, we're going to increase the number of chickens for eggs, requiring a larger hen house so we'll have the smaller house (good for 10-12 full size birds) that won't be used. We'd like to start raising meat birds for the table and I have some questions I hope you can help with.

Do you raise young meat birds in the same enclosure as the hens?

If not, my thought was to fence off part of the orchard with electric chicken fence that we have already and put the current hen house in there for the meat birds. That way the chickens can free range somewhere natural and see the other birds through the fence.

Will the very young chickens be ok with a normal style hen house or do they need something more suited to their size. (ours is a large plastic one from Green Frog)

I'm reading through the forum but any suggestions of a good guide to read to start with would be welcome.

Any suggested breeds? We're looking for flavour above everything else I guess, along with raising them in a high living standard.

How many do you tend to raise at a time? I was thinking of doing perhaps two sets of a dozen each year.

Do you tend to buy eggs and hatch them or young chicks?

I'm sure there'll be more questions following on. Thanks.

[Womble]

Hi Justin,

We've raised Hubbards before, but had a batch of Sassos this year. They ate far less than the hubbards, grew a bit slower, and tasted fantastic. I also gave a couple away to friends, who said they'd never tasted better. They're easiest to buy as day-olds.

We just have a shed for housing, with perches just a few inches from the ground. The Sassos definitely  didn't like high perches, and the hubbards mostly preferred to sleep on the floor underneath them anyway. Obviously the house doesn't need nestboxes.

Apart from that, they didn't need any special care - just plenty of food and water. We do keep ours separate from the laying hens - far less politics that way.

[Justin]

Hi Womble, thanks for that, I'm sure we can provide suitable accomodation for them then. I'd probably raise them under heat in the barn where we have power then put them out into an open run in the orchard once they're feathered up.

Did you find the Sasso's walked about happily? I've been reading about them and hear that they put on weight so fast they can't often walk as they get older. Not something I'd be happy inflicting on a bird, would rather grow them on slowly while free ranging and give them a happy, if short, life.

[farmers wife]

I have Le Bresse which I hatched, 5 months to fatten slow and low but that's what I wanted.  They are on table bird feed (organic hipeak)  I keep them in an enclosure that I can drag around. Therefore I have them outside on fresh pasture every couple of day.  I don't want to mess with bedding etc.  Totally fox proof


The trouble with hatching is knowing where you get the stock from and success rates.  Day olds could be around 70p.  Sassos can be bought from Piggots.  Only makes economic sense if you buy a good load.  I hatched mine but low success and its a slow process.  I would work out the amount of chicken you want to eat.  If say you wanted chicken once a week then you can do the maths over what period of time before getting another batch.  Also if you batch you cant put new with old (pecking order) - also on the killing day better to do it all in one go than dragging it out over months.  Better do all over weekend.  I hang mine in walk in fridge.

[farmers wife]

https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=table+chicken+joel+salatin&FORM=HDRSC2


Look up enclosures.  You don't want to be having meat chickens running around nor do you want to be getting them in. 

[Justin]

Why wouldn't I want the chickens running around? I would much rather they free range otherwise why not just buy some factory farmed creature. Part of why we're smallholding is to raise animals with a better standard of living surely?

[farmers wife]

You wont fatten meat birds if they are burning calories.  Meat birds are usually contained (to a high standard per pic).  I'm sure some breeds might fatten better.  But hybrids no.  You are feeding them fatteners/growers over layers so be counterintuitive if they were running amok in say an orchard. There are plenty of people on here that do the meat birds know far more than I do.  Look over the pics that some have on this forum.

[farmers wife]

https://www.accidentalsmallholder.net/diary/new-pen-for-meat-birds/

[Justin]

thanks, I'll take a look at that and do some further reading.

[Womble]

Did you find the Sasso's walked about happily? I've been reading about them and hear that they put on weight so fast they can't often walk as they get older.

OK, we probably didn't do this in textbook style, but I'll be honest - I don't care!

To begin with, they had a 1.5m diameter brooder ring, and a heat pad. Then, once they got big enough not to get stuck in corners or whatever, we removed the ring and gave them the whole of a 6'x5' shed. This was then supplemented by a 6'x5' attached run, like a small version of the one Farmer's Wife posted above. Eventually, once they were fully feathered, we let them out into a pen created using a 50m electric poultry net. So yes, ours could definitely run around, especially once they got to that final stage. We also moved the net regularly to give them access to fresh grass.

We have never had problems with any meat birds walking awkwardly or growing too quickly. Yes, I can see how it could happen if they aren't able to build leg muscles, but I think maybe if you give them lots of space, it's less of an issue? 

Being honest, the birds we've raised are always a little bit 'chewier' than supermarket birds, and there's a much greater difference between the taste of the leg and breast meat than you get with a supermarket chicken. However, now we're accustomed to that, it doesn't worry us. Farmer's Wife is of course right that the feed to meat ratio will be worse if you let them run about..... but think, why are you doing this in the first place?  The answer to that then tells you the way that's right for you.

I'd say just give it a go and see, then adapt from there. Do have a plan in place for how and when you're going to kill and prepare them beforehand though, as that's really not something you should be making up as you go along! BTW, here's a link to an old blog post from the first batch we raised, which might be helpful  .

[SallyintNorth]

https://www.accidentalsmallholder.net/diary/new-pen-for-meat-birds/

It’d be good to know whether you are still using this system, [member=13]Rosemary[/member], and whether you have now answered some of the questions you asked yourself in the article.

We’re hoping to get some meat birds going next year, and it hadn’t crossed my mind to use our pasture for them - but it has now!

[Rosemary]

https://www.accidentalsmallholder.net/diary/new-pen-for-meat-birds/

Yep, still using the same system. The pen had a bit of a makeover last year as some of the wire was getting a bit shabby. It suits us. Our fields are dead flat and I move the pen once a day, then twice a day asthe birdds get bigger. Last couple of years we've done one batch of 20 chicks rather than two smaller batches. Never had aproblem with the fox although we're seen him walking round the pen.

[Justin]

Thanks Womble, I'll take a read through your blog. I'm more concerned with raising birds well than getting the very best result for the money. I'm not in this for profit

Also, yes been thinking about the end result and deeds to be done. I've killed a couple of our old chickens that were rescues and at a point where they needed to go. the broomstick was quick and efficient and I think I'd be fine despatching the chickens. The plucking and drawing was harder as I didn't really know what I was doing and probably didn't do it very well. They ended up as food for the dogs who weren't worried about the tidyness of it.

I tried to book on to the devon smallholders poultry despatch course this weekend but it's full so I'm putting down for the next one. The alternative is to pay someone to come and despatch, pluck and dress them for us, as there's someone local who does that. We'll see how things are next year.

[wayland]

We have been raising hens and eating them for years but never actual Broilers. Our current flock is a right mixed bunch so we do not expect a shop brought standard carcass.  Flavour has always been king with us. Early this year I was offered a doz broiler chicks!. Good Grief!. They ate till they were fit to burst and could not move. Once they digested a crop full they would fill it again, and again! They grew at an alarming rate. We did run them free range which was no problem as all they wanted to do was eat and lay down. The subject of leg problems was brought up in an earlier post. We did have one bird that had problems the rest were ok. I had planned to slaughter this batch at 12/14 weeks but it was decided to do a few at 10 weeks. The smallest bird weighed 8.5 lbs. The last three birds were processed at 12 weeks. The biggest bird got to 15 lbs!!. Amazing but I am not in too much of a hurry to raise broilers again. Fine looking birds when dressed out but lacking in flavour me thinks. I am getting a new incubator for xmas so looking forward to mix and match up some of my birds next year. Good luck with your birds Justin.

[Womble]

the broomstick was quick and efficient and I think I'd be fine despatching the chickens. The plucking and drawing was harder as I didn't really know what I was doing and probably didn't do it very well.

We use the broomstick method when we have to dispatch, and have never had any problems with it, although because it doesn't include a 'pre-stun', you should be aware that it doesn't actually comply with humane slaughter association guidelines. Others will differ in their views, but IMHO, unless you're going to invest in an electric stunner, it's hard do much better on a small scale.

As for plucking and drawing, I'm going to say who cares!? You'll find the right methods eventually, and once the bird is dead, you're causing it no further pain or suffering by doing a poor job.

Actually, unless we want a roast, we don't pluck OR draw!  If you cut the skin along the breastbone, you'll be able to open it up and peel it off like a glove, feathers and all. Then you can cut down along the ribcage to remove both breasts, before cutting close to the body to remove the legs at the hip joint.

It sounds as though there'll be a lot of wastage with this method, but actually that's not true. With a bit of practice, you'll find you can get all of the meat off except the 'oysters' and the bits below the elbow of the wings, which aren't that great anyway. Give it a try - you may be surprised.