[Penninehillbilly]

OK, Background.
2014 I borrowed a zwarble tup, served my black Swaley,  (i got her +pal as pet lambs off a farmer to use surplus goat milk, been assured she IS pure swaley).
2015 =black male lamb. Couldn't catch him within 7 days so remained entire.
2016 = white lamb, true swaley markings.
Question is, could black swaley x half zwarble produce white Swaley?
Or did she get close and personal with the Swaley Tup from next field, who were in our fields a couple of times, I was that worried about my boy getting to his females never thought of the other way round 

Been thinking white fella looked a bit 'tuppy',  now decided my banding didn't work (first attempt), he is fighting with his dad(?) and mating with his dam/Granddam(?), tried to separate them but he got through again.
How can i dispose of one tup?  The freezer is full!
Shame really, BigBlack is such a handsome boy,

[Marches Farmer]

Nearest cull market?

[Penninehillbilly]

Would one tup be worth anything?
Do butchers bother bidding on one animal?  Didn't think they'd bother so beast would be worthless.

But how do the colour genes add up ?

[Womble]

For one tup, I'd either do a home kill, or a private kill at the abbatoir, and eat the meat myself.

[Penninehillbilly]

For one tup, I'd either do a home kill, or a private kill at the abbatoir, and eat the meat myself.

,
Freezer full :-(. Mainly junk OH brings home, reduced stuff from S, markets

[Anke]

I have brought single  (suddenly turned very aggressive) tup to cull market - just because I couldn't do a homekill that quick (it was too warm already...) and also - as you - freezer was full. Didn't get much money, but enough to justify him going... (my local mart is less than 10 mins down the road though...)

[Womble]

That's a shocking admission PHB!!

At least our freezers are full of random junk we've grown ourselves (We actually have a small upright freezer filled entirely with diced courgettes!  )

[waterbuffalofarmer]

Could the answer be buy another freezer?   There is always the option of online advertising such as FB, twitter, preloved, uk freeads, friday ad, farming ads, gumtree. Hope you can get him a good home soon!

[pharnorth]

Treat OH to a full cost analysis of what your tup is worth at S market prices if chopped into their silly sized packs and compare with the savings made from the bulk cheap buys already stacked in there.  Hence you could work out a value per freezer full. It could become a new dark cold winter evening form of entertainment

[Penninehillbilly]

That's a shocking admission PHB!!
At least our freezers are full of random junk we've grown ourselves (We actually have a small upright freezer filled entirely with diced courgettes!  )

Not my choice    he does the shopping because he is out in the van everyday, seems to be a challenge to him to buy as much cheapie stuff as he can, wether we want it or not. In fact most of the time he hasn't got his glasses, so he doesn't know what he's buying !!
WBF - we bought another and that's full as well, I have worked out how much it costs to run a second freezer, he said something like 'gosh', and carried on bringing stuff home. (Looking for a shaking head in frustration emoty thing:-),)
Pharnorth - Tried something like that, but when he brings home packs of minced meat for about 30pence I can't argue ! Loaves of bread 10p good for geese etc in bad weather.

[Penninehillbilly]

OK, the main question was can photos a + b = C.
if there is a chance black tup is the sire, white fella goes, getting too inbred,
if there is no chance that black tup is the sire, ie neighbours Swaledale, unrelated, white fella stays with his mum, for a while anyway.
Black tup is a problem at times and I tend to take a stick with me, white one doesn't bother me.
But at the moment they stink, presume this would create the meat taint I've heard about?

[kanisha]

zwartbles are dominant black so a black lamb from this sire could "hide" a white lamb the lamb would be heterozygous ED . I don't believe the genetics of the swaledale colouration ( in standard colouration) has been confirmed, the likelihood of producing a "swaledale" marked lamb as a second generation would depend on the mechanism for this colouration  and the genetic explanation for  a "black" swaledale. In short not enough info. Several possible explanations but no definative answer...

[SallyintNorth]

Simplistically, if Mum is even half Swale, some of her Swaley genes will be in her Zwartbles cross offspring, so putting him back to her could match up the Swaley genes and produce something even more Swaley than the mum.  So yes, I would say, black boy could be father (as well as half brother) to the white boy.  But it sounds like so could next door's pukka Swale tup

[pharnorth]

Agree with above unless anyone knows more about Swale phenotype genetics we will never know. Intrigued as to what you do next.....

[Penninehillbilly]

Agree with above unless anyone knows more about Swale phenotype genetics we will never know. Intrigued as to what you do next.....

Hmmmm,    when she lambs both may go I think, i cant decide whether BigBlack is threatening or being friendly and playful, he will stand next to me and seems to like being close, sometimes pushes his head against me, occasionally lowers his head, but never actually come at me, except recently (and then not full on, more of a push), but his mum has been in season  so guessing that was the problem.
Shame, ime getting to like 'Swaleyboy'.
I know I need more sheep, breeding program went to pot when we lost other ewe and we just  keep getting males :-(.

What about this 'tup taint', Like billies, does it go off in Spring?