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Author Topic: Grassroots / Shetland Cattle Herd Book Society  (Read 5946 times)

Rosemary

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Barry, Angus, Scotland
    • The Accidental Smallholder
Grassroots / Shetland Cattle Herd Book Society
« on: October 29, 2015, 09:55:18 am »
A few months ago, I was delighted to read in "The Ark" (the RBST's magazine) that the Shetland Cattle Herd Book Society had applied for and been given a grant from RBST to purchase the "Grassroots" and "Pedeweb" systems.

At the moment, there are two datasets for Shetland Cattle (kind of surprising for a breed with around 550 breeding cows); one - the Herd Book - is held and administered by the Herd Book Society, while the other is managed by the Shetland Cattle Breeders Association.

The database held by SCBA has some distinct advantages over the Herd Book database - for example, I can search for breeders by name, are, prefix etc on SCBA; I can see the list of animals in my own herd (and others) which I can't do on the Herd Book database (which is why I didn't know that the two foundation cattle I bought back in 2010 had not been transferred to my ownership until a few months ago). Both systems do pedigrees and breeding compatibilty checks. My guess is that the SCBA database was set up to compensate for the limitations of the Herd Book database.

As a side issue, the last news item on the SCHBS was in September 2011 ::)

At the SCBA AGM at the weekend, I was very disappointed to learn that SCHBS in its wisdom has decided NOT to take the Grassroots system opting instead to propose a variation involving some upgrade of the current database. None of this - the application to RBST, the award of the grant and the decision to turn it down - has been communicated to members.

I have emailed the SCHBS to ask for copies of the constitution, the agenda / papers / minutes of the last three AGMs (2013, 2014 and 2015) and the agenda / papers / minutes of all committee meetings since the 2013 AGM (April 2013).

I will also be writing to the President of SCHBS (not sure who it is; the 2014 Herd Book says Eleanor Arthur, so I'll just go with that since the website information certainly predates 2014) asking for the reasons why the Society decided to reject Grassroots and how that rejection sits with the Society's aims.

Other members may wish to do similar.

daveh

  • Joined Nov 2008
  • South Northamptonshire
Re: Grassroots / Shetland Cattle Herd Book Society
« Reply #1 on: October 29, 2015, 10:06:27 am »
Rosemary wrote:

>I will also be writing to the President of SCHBS (not sure who it is; the 2014 Herd Book says Eleanor Arthur

The last communication I had from the SCHBS was the Jan 2015 newsletter. The letterhead states that the president is Eleanor Arthur. The newsletter says that the 2015 AGM is on 4th April. I have not had any communication since Jan of this year. Not exactly communicative, are they.

I wish you luck with your request for agendas/ minutes. I suspect you will be waiting for a long time.

Regards, David

Rosemary

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Barry, Angus, Scotland
    • The Accidental Smallholder
Re: Grassroots / Shetland Cattle Herd Book Society
« Reply #2 on: October 29, 2015, 10:29:53 am »
Any chance you could email me a copy of the 2015 newsletter, daveh. I never keep them because generally there's nothing in them, unlike the SCBA ones, which are good. If you have any copies from further back, can you send me them too?

Rosemary@tas.re

daveh

  • Joined Nov 2008
  • South Northamptonshire
Re: Grassroots / Shetland Cattle Herd Book Society
« Reply #3 on: October 29, 2015, 10:53:37 am »
Rosemary,

Should be in your inbox. I don't have any older copies.

Regards, David

Rosemary

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Barry, Angus, Scotland
    • The Accidental Smallholder
Re: Grassroots / Shetland Cattle Herd Book Society
« Reply #4 on: October 29, 2015, 02:21:07 pm »
Got it. Thank you.

Marches Farmer

  • Joined Dec 2012
  • Herefordshire
Re: Grassroots / Shetland Cattle Herd Book Society
« Reply #5 on: October 29, 2015, 03:40:03 pm »
A word of caution about the Grassroots system:  I went to register my Southdown lambs on the Society site the other day and discovered my account is showing 15 ewe and 4 ram lambs registered and that I owe them 92.  This is most certainly news to me and the Secretary has promised to sort it out ....

Rosemary

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Barry, Angus, Scotland
    • The Accidental Smallholder
Re: Grassroots / Shetland Cattle Herd Book Society
« Reply #6 on: October 29, 2015, 05:52:16 pm »
A word of caution about the Grassroots system:  I went to register my Southdown lambs on the Society site the other day and discovered my account is showing 15 ewe and 4 ram lambs registered and that I owe them 92.  This is most certainly news to me and the Secretary has promised to sort it out ....

I'm sure that was distressing for you personally but if I'm given it as a reason for not getting it, you'll hear me laughing in the Marches.

Rosemary

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Barry, Angus, Scotland
    • The Accidental Smallholder
Re: Grassroots / Shetland Cattle Herd Book Society
« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2015, 09:44:05 am »
[member=590]daveh[/member] I did get a response to my request for Committee papers. I was told that as per the Constitution, the committee minutes were available to view in the Minute Book. In Shetland.

Open and inclusive.

I have replied asking for them again, pointing out that, notwithstanding the Constitution, it seems unreasonable not to make papers available to members when thay almost certainly have been prepared electronically.

I'm waiting.

Anke

  • Joined Dec 2009
  • St Boswells, Scottish Borders
Re: Grassroots / Shetland Cattle Herd Book Society
« Reply #8 on: November 08, 2015, 01:52:30 pm »
The grassroots system is a fantastic resource for any breed society.

The British Goat Society "crowd-funded" the purchase a few years ago, got Libby Henson to sort out all sorts of add-ons that are peculiar to the dairy goat world (like milking competitions and milk recordings) - and it is one of the best decisions they have made. I can now do all my registrations, notify them of matings and ownership transfers on-line, also shows are recorded on-line and searching for pedigrees is a doodle... My goats have got all their show placings, and milk results (both from home recording and at show competitions) there, and it makes buying in new stock so much easier. Only problem is that the pedigrees do stop somewhere in the 1980s.... and then it is back to the old herdbooks if you want to trace your girls back as far as possible.

However the number of registered goats in the UK is probably high enough to justify the costs, as t is not a cheap system. Not sure if there are enough Shetland cattle about...

Rosemary

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Barry, Angus, Scotland
    • The Accidental Smallholder
Re: Grassroots / Shetland Cattle Herd Book Society
« Reply #9 on: November 08, 2015, 03:28:19 pm »
Our Herd Book had a grant from RBST to purchase the software [member=3211]Anke[/member]   ::)

Anke

  • Joined Dec 2009
  • St Boswells, Scottish Borders
Re: Grassroots / Shetland Cattle Herd Book Society
« Reply #10 on: November 08, 2015, 05:43:20 pm »
Our Herd Book had a grant from RBST to purchase the software [member=3211]Anke[/member]   ::)

Sorry I keep myself out of the discussion.... was trying to be helpful.

Fortunately I only have to deal with one breed society per animal/breed I am involved in. Your initial post was a bit confusing as to who is doing what.

Rosemary

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Barry, Angus, Scotland
    • The Accidental Smallholder
Re: Grassroots / Shetland Cattle Herd Book Society
« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2015, 08:09:23 pm »
[member=590]daveh[/member] I did get a response to my request for Committee papers. I was told that as per the Constitution, the committee minutes were available to view in the Minute Book. In Shetland.

Open and inclusive.

I have replied asking for them again, pointing out that, notwithstanding the Constitution, it seems unreasonable not to make papers available to members when thay almost certainly have been prepared electronically.

I'm waiting.

As an update, I requested the Committee minutes on 4th November. I chasedit on the 13th and noted this on the Shetland Cattle FB page; the next day I got a holding response saying the Secretary wasn't in the office every day.

Today (17th November) I received this in an email "The Society is having a meeting at the end of the month where your request will be discussed."

I assume by "Society" it means the "Management Council of the Society", since I, as a member of the Society havenot been invited to any meeting.

Is my request to see the Committee minutes of an organisation of which I am a paid up member unreasonable? Would it incur an unreasonable workload for the Secretary?

In my opinion, the answer to both questions is "No" - so what's the problem?
 

cans

  • Joined May 2013
Re: Grassroots / Shetland Cattle Herd Book Society
« Reply #12 on: November 17, 2015, 08:22:03 pm »
I may be wrong on this but . . . If you are a paid up member should you not automatically get minutes of previous AGM before current/next AGM takes place so that you as a member can read before you decide whether to attend or not.  Or are minutes just given to those who attend ?

You should have been given a copy of the constitution when you became a member?


Rosemary

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Barry, Angus, Scotland
    • The Accidental Smallholder
Re: Grassroots / Shetland Cattle Herd Book Society
« Reply #13 on: November 17, 2015, 08:31:51 pm »
Our Herd Book had a grant from RBST to purchase the software [member=3211]Anke[/member]   ::)

Sorry I keep myself out of the discussion.... was trying to be helpful.

Fortunately I only have to deal with one breed society per animal/breed I am involved in. Your initial post was a bit confusing as to who is doing what.

Just looked at my original post [member=3211]Anke[/member] - looked like I was rolling eyes at you - I was actually rolling then at the fact that the Siciety was GIVEN the money and refused it. Sorry  :hug:

 

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