[perkhar]

Right this question has been asked previously and I have read every post possible about it on the internet but there is no where that gives you a Definitive answer...

If you syringe out a bottle of heptavac p in to a clean sterile syringe and leave its contence in the fridge. Will it last as long as the sell by date or a long term of time??? Seen as it's had no access to air?

I have 7 sheep to do two sets of vaccines for and want to know the truth about the length of time it lasts. I know it says ten hours on the pack but there are some who say otherwise.

I really don't know what's right or wrong looking for a good answer either side of the argument.  If it's no good then I don't mind throwing it as the sheets health is more important but if there's nothing wrong with it then I have no problems in giving it to them

[Bionic]

I follow the instructions and don't use after the 10 hours. I only have 6 sheep, so unless I can share it does work out expensive.
Not everyone follows this rule though but I think what's the point of trying to prevent something and not following the instructions properly.


Those that do it differently are lucky and they could also not bother heptvac'ing at all and still be lucky but do you want to take the chance?

[Anke]

I use a vaccinator gun (my sheep are on Heptavac) and the bottle stays on and goes back in the fridge (with the needle left on and covered, then new needle for next time).

For goats (Lambivac) I use individual syringe, but leave 1st needle in the bottle to draw out, then fresh needle on the syringe for each goat. Then bottle gets taped up and goes back in the fridge.

To be honest, it is in the manufacturers interest to make the bottles really single use only, otherwise they are open to being sued... so it is up to you which advice you follow. This topic is discussed on every farm forum you can find...

If you were to draw out half the bottle of vaccine into a syringe, store in your fridge for the second dose and then use other half today I cannot see how that can destroy the vaccine... but  am sure others will come up with their own views...and the whole discussion will start again...

[perkhar]

Anke i don't know as you say it's talked about everywhere I'm no biologist so I don't know if or how the bacteria survive or not but if that syringe has taken out of a bottle that's never been exposed to air and kept in a syringe thTs air tight how is that any different from being in the original bottle.

But as I say I'm no expert in fact far from it but I'd like someone to explain why it won't work if that's the case because I really don't understand the science if that's the case.

Sorry to bring up old conversations I have read them just didn't get exactly what I wanted to know from them thanks for all the input on all my threads I'm sure they may seem obvious to most of you guys but they are really helping me understand everything a lot better ?

[Anke]

While the original research into the stability of the drug (and its carrier liquid etc etc) will have been done by the company, it is not in their (commercial) interest to publish it. The less stable they make it out the less likely they are to get sued (admittedly once the vaccine is out of their factory handling of it by individual farmers is beyond their control)...

Really no answer to your question....

[perkhar]

So what's the difference in the drug being stored in a syringe tube to the original bottle??

[harmony]

There are plenty of threads on here about this and plenty of opinions. Generally the only people qualified to give the answer are those who produce the product and the guidelines. I really can't understand why anyone questions that.


I have just injected my sheep after taking out the sponges. The advice on the bottle is once the product is mixed use by 24 hours.  Not ask around and see what everyone else says.

[mowhaugh]

I would say that if you think the product is worth using, it is worth following the instructions.  Yes, it is expensive, but so are lost sheep.

[perkhar]

When you think about it it's less than a quid a vaccine per dose so it's not that expensive at at well worth it for the cover I just hate wasting things for no reason... I'm like it with everything. Including things I use my self. Just the way I see things....

But your right if it's not live or working anymore your wasting your time giving it to them so it must get dumped. But I just wanted to know if it does go bad like they say...

[harmony]

Nobody likes waste but when you only have a small number of animals it is difficult  finding products in a small quantity.


Heptavac doesn't go bad after the 10 hours as in making your animals ill, it just wont do the job.


It must be the same for vaccines at the doctors and I'd guess we would want the best possible cover not a reduced cover because the doctor thought differently.

[Marches Farmer]

It would be fairly easy for the drug companies to test the efficacy of a vaccine after storage - inject stock then take blood tests.  I can quite understand that they can't guarantee that a refrigerated drug that's had only one clean needle used to draw off the vaccine won't be compromised in some way, but .....

[pharnorth]

The kind of study you suggest Marches Farmer cost hundreds of thousands of pounds to do due to the regulatory conditions and numbers of animals involved. Not opinion but fact as I have personally done this work. Instructions are based on actual conditions used in tests and while you or I could guess at what else might be ok the Companies can only label according to what has been proven not what we might guess.  So it is not done because of cost, and because those same resources can be spent on researching treatments for other diseases/ better treatments etc

You can guess and take the risk or follow the instructions

[perkhar]

Pharanorth are you saying you actually were involved. In the testing of heptavac p??? If so you would know exactly what the case is?

[Hellybee]

We wouldn't re use here.