[Wizard]

Just had a pal round and he pointed out to me a story in the Evening Telegraph which provoked a heated discussion.What do you think?
Drugs (The banned substances) should be supplied free on the NHS If you need them the GP writes you a prescription. Don't be bloody stupid every one would be on it.No I don't think so You can have them BUT there is no treatment This will save NHS millions The crime rate will drop because one don't need to go doing a burglary to finance the evil habit.The drug baron loses his grip and all are happy bar him After all its like drinking and smoking you cannot  advise some folk Judging by some( all female as well) attending The Hope Street Pulmonary Rehabilitation Center

[Hermit]

I totally agree, then they would keep it to themselves. There are a lot of drug users in Shetland especially heroin, it is so easy to be brought in with all those fishing boats and lobster pots around.Cigarettes also, then those who smoke still can do so but there would be no one to take their place and eventually the habit hopefully would die out. Hermit

[Wizard]

Did you see Hermit.Maybe not its a fair step to Shetland from Grimsby but customs pulled a truck last month with 6 million cigs on board.The story read it was evading £M2.8 now thats a nice slice o' bread in anyones language intit

[RUSTYME]

very difficult one this .... there will be many different views for and against . I have never touched any drugs apart from legal prescription painkillers etc , after accidents and  such . I  used to smoke tobacco , and I also used to drink . I stopped smoking when my nephew was diagnosed with asthma some 20 years ago , and I stopped drinking after my car smash (due to drink !!) 27 years ago .  But I have never once touched any type of recreational drug at all . I have 3 brothers who have though .
 One is still (as far as I know ? ) on anything he can get hold of , but mainly heroin , another who used to take most things , but now doesn't touch anything apart from cannabis , and then another one who only started taking drugs in prison , and as far as I know is still taking them . Drugs are easily available in the nick !!!
 So I know what misery drugs cause . The family breakups , arguments and fights over theft of things and money .
 I know that drugs cause the majority of house crime and robbery etc along with most car crime , but I am not sure that I would be happy with the NHS paying for druggies to get their fix for free... I am not and never have been a drug pusher and don't want to be forced into being one by having my taxes pay for their drugs ... full stop . Legalise them yes .... and then all the big pharma companies can make even more money than they are now , but I don't want to pay for my own brothers let alone anyone else , to get off their face because they can't cope 'man' . Thats their problem not mine and I won't pay for it . Making it legal will help toward bringing down crime , but it won't stop it though . Smoking is legal and there is a huge amount of crime committed buying and selling illicit tobacco , the same with alcohol , although most of the crime is tax evasion .
 I don't have all, if any ?, of the answers , but I wouldn't want to be paying for people to get free heroin etc .... if that were to happen , why not booze as well tobacco too ? .
 A huge can of worms this one ...lol....I just gotta go chill man  !!!!

cheers

Russ

[sellickbhoy]

FREE? whoa, stop the buses!!!

Yes, I agree that the government should licence and control (and TAX) the supply of currently illicit items - cannabis, speed, E, Herion, coke etc

I'd either simply tax it in the same way that alcohol and tobacco is taxed - and prohibit sales to anyone under a certain age - 18.

the tax revenue could then be used to fund treatment, councelling etc.

It would take the drug barons out of the supply and would also reduce the black market and interaction with organised crime etc. It could also reduce crime to pay for drugs - i.e. people who become a registered addict can get a government issued ration along with treatment to get them clean.

It would also control the quality of supply, leading to less deaths from people taking overdoses - usually cuased because people have no idea how much the drugs have been diluted each time they take them

Yup, i'm all for legalising it all, but sorry, can't do it for free - otherwise i want my alcohol for free too!

(I'd also legalise prostitution!)

[oink]

legalise it, tax it. 

I always feel sorry for the average citizens in countries like Columbia that have to live under the rule of these drug barons who are only there because of our prohibition.  Prohibition doesn't seem to work.

[bazzais]

I dont think legalisation should ever be considered just for the tax raising benefits and thus the return of those taxes to fund rehabilitation - consider alcohol, how much of the profits from that are actually are fed back to alcohol programs - its a tiny amount I imagine. I dont think that legalisation would allow society to spend more on the causes and reasons of people taking drugs to change their own state of mind.

What we need first are proper counselling and support service in place to even start to deal with the problems of why people abuse rather than use drugs to change their thinking.  I see no reason why the recreational use of drugs should be illegal - its when people run into the abuse of drugs, ie when they are controlled by drug use rather than using the drug that it becomes a problem.  The trouble is is that there is a very fine line that between the two and that line can only be recognised by the user themselves.

One of the troubles with legalisation is that you would have to make drugs easier and cheaper to acquire than the black market - otherwise people would go the black market route - like people buying duty free fags.  Plus making it cheaper would effectively make it more accessible to people who are not controlled by the need to have drugs but maybe making leisure users into addicts due to its easy accessibility.

One thing I feel for sure is that ready accessibility to drugs does make it easier for people to acquire and take them - but on the other hand if you are taking drugs then clean, pure and quantifiable administered amounts of that substance are less likely to lead to health defects and more likely for that said person to have to admit how much they are taking and get counselling from the person/state administering it.

Bottom line is - well there is no bottom line except that we need to develop a better support network such as counselling for all ages.

Make support readily available before drugs - dont use free drugs to drag people into counselling.

Ta

Baz

[Hermit]

Surely if it was only available on the NHS then the drug users would be known and councelled even weaned off and a few placebos thrown in.It may cost for a while but then costs all round would be dramatically reduced in the long run. Also why would people still want to get it from abroad when they can get it free here. Drug suppliers that try to get folk into drugs would be on a no winner as their customer woukld then go to the NHS.
 We might have to pay the NHS more but police and 'free legal advice',social workers and all the rest of the preferential treatment including clinics and free housing will be dramatically reduced.
Right back to the real world.    Hermit

[Wizard]

I agree hermit There is millions of pounds spent on councilling and advertising to what end? I like to think I was dragged up rate an proper wi me Dad an Mam.Taught right from wrong and always help if you can.Much of the modern people don't know right from wrong He does it so I can and don't tell me you have not seen on these "Police Promotional Programmes" where the girls are worse than the lads and some one is on the floor and they are trying to kick the crap out of their victim.I am not arguing for or against.The victim may have asked for it but the whole system is wrong The courts are bound by directives and the punishment a pleasure to receive according to some.Until there is a deterrent that means something things will not improve.Councilling is as much use as a chocolate fire guard to many.How much does a good or a bad talking to hurt you

[bazzais]

Yes I naively though for a second that everyone can be helped - its my utopian side. 

I do realize that not everyone can be helped, some people are hell bent on destruction not because they are products of their surrounding but they are just biologically and chemically made to react 'differently' from what society considers the norm. (I am just making a point and no justifying anything)

I think maybe decriminalisation is the way forward - at least then the state (or us(ideally)) will have some kind of control over it.  I think the word legal seems to promote its use

With decriminalisation, at least there is some threat to people seen to be abusing.

Ta

Baz

[sandy]

There are as many reasons for people taking drugs as there are different types of people and I met a wide range during my time as a drug counsellor and some other similar jobs, I spoke to many professionals with drug problems, after all, the only difference between a high profile well off person and a stereotypical idea of a drug user is ££££££'s, the more money you have the less lightly you will be a problem to society, although they may be a problem to your family and friends, anyway, many drug users "liked" their recreation as much as other people like a trip to the theatre, a meal, a drink at the pub, the only difference is using drugs can be illegal, not of course prescription drugs or anyone of the herbs, flowers, mushrooms etc etc that give some very strange effects and are completely legal. My point is, if drugs were sold or given on prescription there would still be drug related crime and drug dealers as in business terms, great profits can be made and like a lot of excitment seekers, some users will want that something different so not get prescriptions and some may also want privacy and not want the chemest etc to know. Some drugs should be legal while others available on prescription...to be honest, more problems are caused by drink and cigarettes and they are not illegal.

[Hermit]

But the NHS are giving help to nicotine abusers and it does seem to be working.As for alcohol that does need a massive stamp down,especially for the young,but everyone from shopkeepers to producers should be held more to account for that. Perhaps a ban on advertising and alcho pops to start with. Hermit

[sandy]

Totally agree, I love a drink but never really drank until fairly recently, in my 40's., If you go into a supermarket the range of nice looking alcoholic drinks is amazing and so cheap and tempting, drink is far bigger problem than drugs alone although I used to see many who used both to excess. It is also difficult to get into a rehab clinic for treatment although again, those who have strong wills can do it alone,  hard though!!!    The supermarkets and drink outlets, not so much pubs, must be making a killing...literally!

[Wizard]

Hello all I honestly think it is a will power problem with smoking and booze but drugs are a different matter alltogether as I see it The Telegraph every day has at least 1 story about drink and being up before the beak."I don't care how hard you say you are Sandy if you 'ent a ASBO you're not joining our gang No offence to you Sandy of course change it to George

[sandy]

I'm not hard, in fact I am a big soft lump