[SallyintNorth]

Interesting, shep53... remind me where you are?  And is it now wall to wall Texels?

[Hellybee]

Pembrokeshire coast, we get told they re not hardy enough to live on the headlands.  Do love them though!

[Ladygrey]

Every farm locally had mules ,now you won't find a single one  , they don't like 80"+ of rain and cost far too much to feed

I know loads of people who have given up mules and gone to lleyns to improve hardiness

But then again I know of many flocks of lleyns that have gotten fed up of bunny sized lambs, flighty ewes and skinny sheep and actually gone back to mules 

I keep getting tempted by lleyns but then the farmer down the road from me has 150 of them, they lambed at 230% and weaned 200%, lambing in january but then every single lamb was only ready to go the following january  tiny bunny lambs

I am tempted to keep back some charollais lambs out of the mules to use as ewes but so far still thinking about it 

[sabrina]

I have had Scottish mules in the past and they are great mums. Produce strong meat lambs.

[SallyintNorth]

We've tried Lleyns but too many triplets and worse, and it's tough for any sheep to rear three on our ground.  Most years we can keep the mules' output reasonable by not flushing (the opposite of flushing, in fact) but this year everything's having nothing but triplets due to the extraordinarily good long summer.

The Swaley Mule can take any tup, lovely roomy ewe, mostly fairly placid to handle, fantastic mothers, usually plenty milk.  I can't imagine how they were found to be not hardy enough for South Wales - what mothers were they from?  For very hardy mules, you have to use a BFL with not the very finest of fleece and a mother from a tough location and a fleece to go with that   They will need feeding through pregnancy, mind, which some farms don't want to be doing.

[MrsJ]

We use our Wiltshire Horn ram on our North Country Mules - the lambs are great.  Very quick to get up and don't seem to suffer from the same foot problems that the mums do. 

[Womble]

they don't like 80"+ of rain and cost far too much to feed

That's why I thought a couple of them might run well alongside the zwartbles, and produce some interesting crosses using our zwartble tup.
 
Any thoughts on this, or any other ideas worth considering as a stop-gap until we can build up the Z numbers?

[SallyintNorth]

Some farms sell draft (usually 2- and 3-crop) North Country Mules; there are sales are at Carlisle, Cockermouth and Penrith in August.  We bought a pen (with lovely fleeces ) last year, after I saw their fleeces on sale at Woolfest!   

The other way you might be able to get hold of some is if anyone has any pet ewe lambs to sell. 

I'd be interested in how the Zwartbles on Mule comes out, if you do try it.  It'll mow you down for cake, that much I can predict!   

[shep53]

Interesting, shep53... remind me where you are?  And is it now wall to wall Texels?

   ARGYLL , no not quite       10yrs ago  5farms maybe  2500 mules plus SBF ewes as dams now more  blackies /  hill northies  / tx x bf and    some now trying aberfield (  tx  x bfl )    yes less lambs but easier kept  and  longer lasting  .