[chippy]

Hello everyone.

We have 3 ewes that we'd like to put to a tup. Unfortunately our shepherd, who was our contact for getting previous rams, has passed away. Since then we've struggled to find the right contacts to borrow a ram for a month or so.

How do other smallholders get hold of rams? And does anyone know of any rams available in the south Oxfordshire region?

[TheSmilingSheep]

you could look out for a local association - in Devon there's 'DASH' - Devon Association of SmallHolders - and maybe advertise/ enquire through there.....
we rent a ram each year from the person who sold us our flock (so she knows all their blood lines etc.) - and she happens to be the chairman of DASH...
not sure how other people arrange things, but good luck

[Dogwalker]

Is there an association for whatever breed they are who could give info on local breeders.
That's what I've done for an angora goat buck.

Or ask local farmers,  vets,  feed store staff, livestock market staff. 
Try 'preloved' even if there's not the right one the advertisers might have contacts.

[Fleecewife]

An alternative is to buy a tup lamb, let him do his job with the ewes then eat him, so you don't have a tup hanging around all winter.   We no longer borrow or lend out tups - too much risk of bringing on disease.  We keep several stock tups though, plus our overwintered meat hoggs, but it wouldn't be appropriate with just 3 ewes.

[Me]

Sold a couple of tidy butchers lambs for this purpose this autumn, probably the only economical way to do it

[Marches Farmer]

We're in Herefordshire and hire out Southdown rams - mostly to smallholders who've bought ewe lambs from us in the past, so we make sure they're unrelated.  Always worth checking the health status of the flock - ours is high health and closed, with no Johnes, Jaaksiekte, orf, abortion, scab,, Maedi Visna, Border Disease or footrot.  All our rams are quarantined after returning from hire,for six weeks if being kept or going straight to slaughter after the standstill period.  Four weeks should see all healthy ewes covered (we only leave our tups in for three).  Using ram lambs doesn't make them disease-free and if they're too young they simply may not be mature enough to work.

[Me]

How can they be MV accredited if they are hired to smallholders? Do you only hire to MV accredited flocks?

[Womble]

So say you used a tup lamb at the beginning of November, when would be an appropriate time to put him in the freezer? (I'm thinking of meat taste / taint rather than economical size).

[Me]

Not everyone can taste ram taint, a lot less than say they can, personally, I would put him in the freezer for xmas!

[Me]

(don't feed him fish meal!)

[Fleecewife]

So say you used a tup lamb at the beginning of November, when would be an appropriate time to put him in the freezer? (I'm thinking of meat taste / taint rather than economical size).

I think you'd be very unlucky to get ram taint from a tup lamb, even if he had been working.  Our tup lambs run together with the stock tups, and especially in the breeding season they spend half the day mounting eachother - from the point of view of taint, is that any different to actually being in with ewes.  Anyway, the only tup we've had which was tainted was a 7yo mature one.  I don't see taint being a problem.
When you put him in the freezer could vary with the breed, but for convenience, as soon as he's finished working send him off.

Fish meal?  Really, Me? Do people feed that to their sheep?  Half a century ago my Dad used fish meal in the mash mix for our pigs, as the protein content, but sheep?

[Me]

Yep fantastic apparently - possibly now banned!

[Marches Farmer]

How can they be MV accredited if they are hired to smallholders? Do you only hire to MV accredited flocks?

Didn't say the flock was MV accredited, just that we have never seen it in the flock and most of our ewes breed until they're 8-12 years old.  We meet other criteria like no direct contact with other sheep by the rest of the flock and quarantine/slaughter addresses the only weak point to some degree.  Don't see the point of paying out £168 plus £3.18 per blood test when we've never seen it in the stock and there would be no financial benefit.

[Me]

Thats a very impressive average breeding age MF, 10 years, why aren't the Southdowns used more widely? It halves replacement rate of mules etc

[Anke]

You don't say what breed you are looking for - but if breed doesn't matter, get a butcher's lamb from your nearest farmer, use him and then off to the abattoir or sell him in the ring as fat.

However if you are only breeding for meat yourself and no lambs are used for further breeding you could also leave one of your own lambs entire, use him (including on his dam) and then off to market.