[Dianabooth]

I am feeling very despondent and sad.  This is our first time lambing and I feel like a failure.  All our 13 ewes are all first time Mums.  Of the 3 births we've had so far we have had 3 dead lambs.  The first ewe lambed on her own normally; I missed the 1st birth but we penned her and she gave birth to another (both are healthy and blossoming)  The 2nd ewe gave birth which again we missed and it was still in the membrane when we found it and the ewe was still lying down and had not moved to see it or lick it.  A little later she had a 2nd lamb and walked off and left it.  I managed to resuscitate the lamb but Mum was scared of it.  We managed to pen her and the lamb but she hates it and butts it really hard.  We have to hold the ewe in the pen every two hours so the lamb can suckle.  This is day 3 & the ewe is still showing no signs of letting her lamb feed without being held.  At 4am this morning I found one of our black welsh sheep with a lamb in the field shelter.  I didn't move them into a pen as when I approached she kept running away so I waited until daylight which is when I found another two lambs, both dead.  One was still in a thick membrane and the other had obviously been licked clean but was also dead. Both lambs looked healthy.  I'm beginning to think that I should have lambed indoors which was my preference at the get go but was persuaded by more experienced 'lambers' that it was better to lamb outdoors (less risk of infection).  Not only have we had the problem of dead lambs, we are also struggling to catch the new mums to pen them. I was told that a ewe will follow if you pick up the lamb - none of ours have and they had to be manhandled into pens to bond. I didn't have them scanned in the beginning so don't  know how many lambs each ewe was carrying.  I feel like a complete & utter failure. I probably should have been up all night watching the flock instead of every 2 or 3 hours.  If anyone has any suggestions as to what I should have done, however harsh, to prevent this I'd be most grateful.  At the moment my gut tells me to bring them in to our empty calf shed for the rest of the lambing. 

[fsmnutter]

This doesn't sound like your average lambing. With losses in the bag, especially if the membrane looks thick, it would suggest you may have an abortion agent at play, with normal looking lambs it may be enzootic abortion. I would speak to your vet. Best tests are on full, fresh foetuses with attached placenta, but you can blood sample ewes to check for exposure to enzootic abortion or toxoplasma.
if they are native types like your welsh mountains, they often do lamb without assistance in the field, but first time mothers can sometimes be confused, but usually if left alone will settle and nurse lambs.
Sorry to hear its been such a hard start for you, it gets better

[FiB]

    Ahh what a rubbish start.  I'm a novice so can't add much insight, but others will help soon, you are not alone and you sound like you are doing everything you can. What breed are your sheep and the ram?.  I don't check through the night outdoors as mine usually drop first thing or last thing. Penning can be a nightmare and I also have a few who are rubbish at following lambs (I leave them 24 hrs to bond before trying).  Have you had any of the lambs post mortemed? Sending you lots of hugs and wishes for a swift change in luck. Fi xx

[jaykay]

Firstly, many 

I have mine inside a shed, with pens made up, for just the reason you've described - it's easier to catch them and put them into mothering pens, to bond with their lambs.

Every 2-3 hours during the night is absolutely normal - better than normal in fact.

Many ewes lamb at daybreak, so a 4.30-5am check is a good idea.

I hate that 'lamb still in a membrane thing' - I suspect we've all had them die like that.

You've had a run of bad luck, and I really hope (and expect) that it'll improve.

But yes, if they were mine, I'd bring them in given that you've got a shed anyway, they'll be easier to manage, which takes some of the stress off.

[Brucklay]

I'm the same as you - lambing in the filed and bringing down once lambed - luckily mine do follow, even the Castlemilks who can be a little skittish about being handled but will follow their lambs - saying that my first timers last year required a lot of patience!!


I would have liked mine in this year but shed not up yet!! It would make is miles easier on you. Rally sorry about your losses, it's very hard when your trying your utmost, just so unfair. 


Hope things pick up for you 

[Rosemary]

  from me too. You've been really unlucky and I know it's hard not feel responsible but basicallt, sh1t happens but it will get better.

We, like others here, lamb indoors - ewes come in a few days before the first lambs are due - because it makes them easier to check and easier to catch if anything goes amiss. Yes, infection could be a problem - but with small numbers and care with iodine application and making sure the lambs suckle properly, it's not like you're lambing 1000 ewes and each pen is being used dozens of times.

My advice would be go with your gut feeling. If you feel more in control, you'll feel better.

Please don't beat yourself up - you're learning and no matter how much thought and planning you do, it's not until the event that you see how things will work in practice.

[Bionic]

Diana,
I can feel your pain. Our first lambing was last year. We only had 4 pregnant ewes and the first lamb (had to be pulled out by the vet) was dead. I was gutted. The other 3 went on to lamb fairly normally though. This year, with 5 pregnant ewes, the first had twins of which the second was born dead. We haven't had anything as bad as yours though.
A few days before each of ours is due they come into the stable/stable yard so that we can keep a close eye on them.(probably more for our own peace of mind than their need)  We do get up during the night, every 2/3 hours to check that everything is ok and of course its easier to check on them there than in the field. We put them into a seperate pen in the stable as soon as one is born. I have been lucky there though as mums have always been great. If anything, a bit over enthusiastic with the licking.

[SallyintNorth]

First off, you may very well have done nothing wrong at all.  We all get dead lambs, we all get first-time mothers who hate their lamb(s).  So take heart from that. 

Undertaking your first ever lambing with first-time ewes, and a hill breed to boot, was never going to be easy.  Such a shame you couldn't have experienced a lambing with someone else beforehand.  Tricks such as how to carry a newborn lamb to get the mother to follow it would then have been in your arsenal. 

Your ewe who still hates her lamb - this happens with Swales too, I had one took a week.  So keep at it.  If the lamb is now 3 days old I would be holding mum for it only 3 times a day now.  In between supported feeds it should get hungry enough to try to get a slurp on its own.  It will soon work out how and when to dive in - you see a lot of gimmers with lambie drinking through the back legs   Keep an ear out in case the ewe really beats it up, but otherwise leave them alone between feeds.  One day you'll come in and they'll be curled up together

With your last night's ewe A, you did the right thing, you can't risk scaring a first-time ewe off her lamb outside in the dark; B, it's harsh but she'll be better off making a good job of rearing one than trying to manage three.  BH always says as long as every ewe rears a good lamb, he's happy.  So learn from your experiences but don't dwell on the dead lambs, focus on - and enjoy! - the ones that are alive.

When lambing outdoors most of us do not check the sheep in darkness - it's likely to cause more problems than it solves.  With experience, one knows when and which sheep should be brought in - if a filthy night is forecast you might bring in first-timers who look as if they are likely to lamb that night, or bring them all in for the night if it's less stressful on the sheep, turn them out again in the morning if the weather's ok.  Mostly lambs are not born in the dead of night, but more likely in the hour before dawn.  So unless the weather's dreadful, most lambs will still be alive by first check at first light.  You can't help the ones still in the membrane unless you are there at the point of birth, wherever the mother lambs.  I agree that if you have them indoors and check throughout the night you will then know if someone is on lambing and will be there at the point of birth.  It's a double-edged sword, however - an inexperienced shepherd handling newborns to a first-time ewe of a hill breed can cause rejection very easily, especially when the ewe is forced to lamb in a place not of her own choosing and alien to her.

I will bookmark your post and this thread, and direct other new-to-sheep people to it to make the point very forcibly how important it is to have some experience of lambing before being in charge of one's own.  Thank you for having the guts to be honest about how it has been for you  - hopefully your experience can prevent others having the same baptism of fire.

Edited to make it clear that any one of us may have had exactly the same results with your sheep this year - there may have been nothing different any of us could have done to get a different outcome.  But things like not being able to get first-time ewes to follow their lambs are techniques that one develops (although there *will* always be *one*  ).  Plus, the more experienced the shepherd is, the more confident they are, and that confidence helps calm the ewes.  Conversely, a tense and worried inexperienced shepherd will stress the ewes.

As to the rest of the sheep - how many are left to lamb?  Would you be happier with them inside overnight and outside again during the day? 

[Bramblecot]

As always, great advice on here. 
Nothing to add except, for me, lambing is always a roller-coaster and every year I learn more.   
I can remember trying to carry twins across a field with my first lambing.  Took me 1 1/2 hours to get her into the barn and I was in tears. 
I just wish I had started 30 years earlier and I'm really sorry your start has been miserable .  Go with your gut feeling and bring the others in overnight if you have room.  It will get better

[trish.farm]

I have been there before with the "how do i get 2 new born twins and a first time lamber across this huge paddock and into the barn"??  P'ing with rain, pitch black, no-one to help, all the other ewes crowding round and lambs all getting mixed up, mother ewe totally distraught and running in the wrong direction.  Total tears of frustration!  Now learnt you grab the twins, put them safe in the barn in a pen, then catch the ewe and take her in.  Then grab an oxygen mask for recovery!  Really hard when you face a new problem which you havent had to deal with before.  Never beat yourself up for dead lambs, even the long time, experienced shepherds lose lambs, its life unfortunately. 

If you want/have to lamb outside as i do (unless i know a birth is imenent then i pen up in the evening) its worth getting the ewes used to you walking round them in the dark at night with a torch.  I check my ewes throughout the night and they are all so used to me, my dogs and a torch walking around them and giving them a cuddle. 

Hope your lambing gets easier. 

[Foobar]

Ditto what everyone else has said.  Sounds like you've just had some bad luck.  Keep your chin up, I'm sure it'll improve .


Mine lamb outside and then I bring each one into the stables as they lamb, where they stay for 24-48 hours to bond, then they get put back out.  I have had some ewes that wouldn't follow, usually first timers.  These are some tips that I can offer:
- Keep the lambs low to the ground, near her nose and move slowly.  Baby steps is fine.
- If you are finding that the ewe isn't going to follow easily then stop, put the lamb(s) down and take a step back and plan out how you are going to get them where you need them to go.  If you need another pair of hands or extra bodies, then go get them now.  Try to not stress the ewe out initially.
- Often the ewe will call to the other flock members and run back to them instead of following the lamb, probably cos she is frightened.  If you can distract the other ewes with some food or something to help them not call back to the ewe then that might help.
- Getting some physical barriers between the newly lambed ewe and the rest of the flock helps.  I have a small enclosure at the corner of my lambing field, and I sometimes use this as a "staging post" ... get the new ewe as far as the enclosure and shut the gate on the field and the rest of the flock, then at least I have her separated.  She can chill there for as long as is needed.
- I'll call on another body to help me herd her into the enclosure if need be, or if that isn't working (and I'll give up trying to herd her quite soon if it's just not working, again as to minimise stress) then I'll get ALL the sheep into the enclosure.  Then I'll filter off the ones that I don't want, letting them back into the main field.  Hopefully leaving me with the ewe and her lamb(s).
- Once I have the ewe and lamb(s) separated, I find I can move them much easier.  I move them out of the other end of the enclosure and again another gate is shut behind her so she can't run back.  Now I just need to get her across the courtyard into the stable ... it can take a little time but they get there in the end, especially when they can't see the rest of the flock.


Don't bother trying to walk the ewe on a halter, I've tried it and it just doesn't work for me, even if the ewe is halter trained.


This is just what I do, so hopefully you can glean some useful bits from that which you can apply to your own setup.


You will find that the next year the ewe will have a better idea of what you want her to do and she'll know where you want her to go.

[Treud na Mara]

 
It does just feel like you can't do anything right sometimes and dead lambs are such a sad sight. OH got to the stage of wondering if we were doing anything right. We inherited our flock from the previous croft owners and didn't even have a date when tupping started. We have had our very sad losses but at least we are better than the previous owners who last year had thirteen lambs and lost twelve. Our first are now a month old and, out of twelve we are only waiting on one and have one empty. One, mostly Soay, with twins, we never manage to catch. Luckily when they were a few hours old we managed to catch the lambs to iodine the cords and then at 5 days catch the little tup lamb to ring. Don't worry, things will get better and I hope you post us some pictures of cute lambs soon.
Everyone here is so supportive and we all send you 

[ZaktheLad]

Really sorry to hear you haven't had the easiest of introductions to lambing sheep.  First time Mums can always be a bit of a problem and take that little bit extra attention to ensure things go smoothly.  Like others have said, there may have been nothing at all you could have done to save those lambs you have lost, but I do think that it would have helped you to lamb indoors as this greatly reduces any issues you would have had with catching the ewes and you can be more hands on in the event of a problem.  Personally, I think it is a lot less stressful to be able to wander around a barn knowing that everything is in sight and to hand.   I tend to bring mine in a week before lambing date is due.  They all stay in for a couple of days once lambed and then go out in the field if all seems well. 

Please try not to feel too despondent - there is so much to learn with lambing sheep - as may say, the easy part is getting them in lamb in the first place!  It can be a stressful and at times very sad time, but you need to accept that you will most likely have losses and over time, you will learn about your individual sheep in a small flock and their individual traits and this will greatly help you when it comes to lambing time! 

Good luck with the rest of your flock - personally, I would get those still to lamb indoors.

[kanisha]

Re moving a ewe indoors or to another area once lambed. I do lamb outside but will bring a ewe in if the weather is very inclement and the lamb is freshly delivered or if born late in the afternoon and still a bit slow off the mark. 

Ewes are more likely to follow when they don't feel they are being taken away from the rest of the flock particularly if it is to an area when they are not usually used to going ie into a stall or yard.  I have setup at a gateway between two paddocks a second gateway to form a  small corral between the two. Usually one end is open and the sheep wander in and out at will. If needed this doubles up as maternity pen - there is a small permanent shelter in there also. A ewe will generally follow into the corral as she is used to going in there. 

a lassoo type  lead on a ewe at the begining  is safety against the ewe backing off at the last minute. I don't use it to lead the ewe she will follow her lamb on a loose lead but if for any reason she refuses to go in the required direction I am not back to trying to entice her from the far end of the paddock.

Try not be too downhearted it sounds as if you have had a run of bad luck.

[Fleecewife]

Sallyintnorth has posted a particularly helpful message - as always   

For you, starting with first time lambers is where you are, no going back, but for others reading this I would reinforce Sally's advice not to start with first timers, and to have some lambing experience yourself first (ours was a training day at the local agricultural college). Do you have a good lambing manual?

 I feel that it's a good idea to buy in your new ewes well before you breed them, and if they're lambs then at 4 months, so they have plenty of time to get to know their surroundings, and you have the opportunity to learn about how to handle your flock.  A relaxed ewe will usually lamb better/more calmly.
It can also be a great idea to keep your shearling ie one year old, ewes with their dams throughout lambing, so when they see their own first lamb born it's not the first one they've ever seen. Keep this in mind for when these lambs are grown.

We now lamb all our ewes outside - we don't have anywhere to house the whole lot.  Our first lambing ever was indoors with first timer Jacobs - bit of a disaster with fat ewes, an incipient prolapse followed by her failure to show any signs of being in labour, a born dead lamb, and twins trampled to death by a panicking ewe - all from three ewes  .  Meantime we had left our small flock of Hebs outside and had not a single problem.  I guess we were lucky with that, as over the years we have had a couple of minor Heb lambing problems, so they're not perfect and they can be sheer hell to catch in a hurry.

You will have read that we have all had problem lambings, so please please don't be glum about what's happened with yours.  If there's another dead lamb, then seek your vets advice, get a PM and find out if there's a flock problem or it was the individual ewes.

I agree that for you bringing the rest of your flock in is the thing to do.  Make sure they keep calm as they come in.  If they are likely to lamb in a communal area, then watch out for lamb stealing by another ewe.
Have you thought about CCTV in your lambing shed?  It must be great to be able to lie in bed to do your lamb checks, and the ewes are not disturbed.  I used to go round my outdoor flock every two hours through the night, but then I realised that they were being disturbed by me and my torch, so they were getting up from their chosen night spot and scattering, losing their lambs in the melee and so on.  Now I check last thing at night and Mr Fleecewife checks at dawn.  If you try to do the night time checks and stay up all day you will soon be exhausted and ineffectual.

Look forward to having some healthy lambs from the rest of your ewes, and try not to panic