[r+lchick]

Marigold, Did you know there was a magazine called "Permaculture".  I came across it by accident.  There is always one or two very good articles in it.  The rest is always worth reading but, to me, sometimes goes a bit to "hippyish".  (Sorry, if that offends anyone).  This month there is build your own beehive using the French method (which is more sustainable and less intrusive) and build a solar greenhouse.  There was also a small article on building a wormery on the cheap.  As I said, I only came across it by accident, so thought I better say. Ros
P.S.  What is the "Permaculture" method? Totally self sustained?  Sorry, bit thick on this one.

[marigold]

Hi Ros, Yes thanks
I enjoy reading Permaculture magasine but its not quite practical enough for me. As you say one or two articles are good, like the beehive one, but most of the articles are about how communities can organise themselves in a more sustainable and ecological way.
The permaculture way is about observing nature so closely and then using the what we know works in nature to work help us organise our immediate environment in a way that promotes health and growth. Whoops - its beginning to sound hippy dippy.
So for example observing that nothing grows under a tree and understanding that that is because of the leaves that the tree drop and the shade - we decide to use emulate that pattern to stop weeds growing in the garden. So a carpet or plastic mulch which is good for the soil can be used for weed control in place of chemicals, which we know harm the environment, or hoeing or digging which involves a great deal of person energy. My understanding is that this way of thinking can be applied to every aspect of living. So if you notice that something keeps acting in a particular way and it is difficult to change. Then you find the advantages in the pattern and learn to work with it.
In an permaculture world, hair staighteners would be recycled and people would learn to love wavy hair. We would all accept the idea that there is far too much energy spent in people buying whatever food they want whenever and instead of strawberries in December being a normal meal we would relearn to appreciate local food in season.  In the garden we wouldn't grow grass spend every weekend cutting it etc we would replace lawns with something slow growing that doesn't need cut and prefereably has an additional benefit or we would find a non person or fuel way of keeping it manageable - geese or sheep for example. That then gives you a meat and or egg crop.


Hope that makes sense. Its been a long day.

[r+lchick]

Gosh, everything has a label these days.  I think we all call this just plain old common sense.  It is a pity we can't dig up some of the old farmers and ask them how they use to live.  One of the reasons people love England (being a foreigner) is because of the seasons.  But as usual no one wants to wait for anything these days.  "I want strawberries now" is the attitude.  But they are so much nicer when you have to wait for them.  They become a special treat.  What happened to the time when you could only get creamed eggs at Easter?  Cadburys worked out that they could make more money selling them all year round.  No, like you, I love waiting for the seasons.  But I do cheat a little.  We are eating the plums I bottled over the summer now.  But, that is allowed.  Thanks for the explanation.  Any tips that you pick up, would be appreciated.  PS.  In the Permaculture magazine, (forget the page) there are a group of people talking.  They are sitting on the floor.  Do people with a "natural" attitude to life not own chairs?  They are always pictured sitting on the floor.  Personally, my bum goes numb after a few minutes and it seems to take me long to get back up!!!  Ros

[marigold]

Yep - I agree, I guess the depressing thing is that 150 years ago, there were so many knowledgeable people around, that information was easily absorbed. Now we have lost so much knowledge and those of us trying to be small holders, need to read books and have theories. And just to convince everyone we're serious we have to sit on the floor!!!!!!!!!!!!! mad times

[sausagesandcash]

150 years ago, there were so many knowledgeable people around,

My wife's still around, and shes knowledgeable about everything....like all women

[Muc]

There is a lot of hocus-pocus in this permaculture which owes more to religion than science. The basic premise is great - less messing about with nature and living lightly on the land.

 But you won't get far into a permaculture course before you come across blind faith and superstition.

For example 'rock dust' is more commonly known as sand and is made very effectively by rivers. Its benefit to veg beds depends on what you want to grow. Rock dust of limestone is called lime and is beneficial if an analysis of your soil shows it is needed. Planting by the moon in the middle of the night is called lunacy.

[Eagledance]

To be fair planting by the moon is BIodynamic theory not permaculture as far as I am aware

Ed