[henchard]

The building of yet more wind farms in Carmarthenshire and the associated transmission lines is quite an issue in this part of Wales. Could any members (particularly locally) who are against the visual impact of the pylons consider signing this on line E Petition please

https://submissions.epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/53592


It would be good if you could also share the link on Social Media sites as well.

thanks

[john and helen]

signed, agree they should be buried

[Bionic]

Done

[Lesley Silvester]

Signed.

[Backinwellies]

Done

[Jamez99]

done





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[cloddopper]

signed, agree they should be buried

That would be hellishly expensive because of the insulation required on the wires  and duct work needed at 2 mrt or more of depth  especially if the area is shallow soil and subsoil .

Earlier this week I had a guy bending my ear about the wind farm turbines  I can see from my lounge yet when I asked him had he demanded that all the village's phone wires and overhead electricity line be dug under ground he told me not to be stupid it would be too expensive ,  make a mess of the roads & pavements.

[henchard]

signed, agree they should be buried

That would be hellishly expensive because of the insulation required on the wires  and duct work needed at 2 mrt or more of depth  especially if the area is shallow soil and subsoil .

Funny how most of the high voltage distribution is buried in tunnels in London but rural dwellers are expected to have the wind farms and the distribution networks imposed on their communities (to keep the lights on in London?). Meanwhile rural dwellers have no high speed internet and appalling phone connections because we're not the city elite and not worthy of the same services because of the cost.

When deciding to build them in the first place the full environmental cost should have been factored in; including the cost to the visual amenity and the costs of ameliorating this. If it's not acceptable to string high voltage lines across the back gardens of city dwellers it should not be acceptable to do the same in rural areas but hey those country bumpkins won't mind whilst the Windfarm developers and landowners 'clean up' financially.

[in the hills]

Done


We have heard today that they propose to underground an 8 mile stretch through the Meifod Valley if the planned development goes ahead in MidWales.

[mab]

signed, agree they should be buried

That would be hellishly expensive because of the insulation required on the wires  and duct work needed at 2 mrt or more of depth  especially if the area is shallow soil and subsoil .

Funny how most of the high voltage distribution is buried in tunnels in London but rural dwellers are expected to have the wind farms and the distribution networks imposed on their communities (to keep the lights on in London?). Meanwhile rural dwellers have no high speed internet and appalling phone connections because we're not the city elite and not worthy of the same services because of the cost.

When deciding to build them in the first place the full environmental cost should have been factored in; including the cost to the visual amenity and the costs of ameliorating this. If it's not acceptable to string high voltage lines across the back gardens of city dwellers it should not be acceptable to do the same in rural areas but hey those country bumpkins won't mind whilst the Windfarm developers and landowners 'clean up' financially.

It's not just a cost of installation issue - the problem is that underground/underwater  transmission of high voltage AC is inherently inefficent as the phase of the voltage and current drift apart over distance, which results in losses in the amount of useable electricity  (this is why the power interconnects between UK and the continent are all HV DC).

In town, with power distributed to a large number of points in a small area and HV transmission over short distances between nodes (substations) the losses are a small %age wise; whereas a rural supply with long lengths of HV distribution with substations supplying just a handful of properties, the transmission losses would be much more significant.

This could be overcome with an underground HVDC transmission line, but the ac/dc conversion technology is still expensive and not economic for this situation. I won't be signing as a few extra telegraph poles on the landscape doesn't justify the reduction in transmission efficiency of the grid IMHO, sorry.

marcus

[john and helen]

  its a case of doing what you feel is right, no one is wrong on this, it all depends on how you look at the landscape,

personally i hate pylons ...they look awful, i have no problem with posts , but there is no way you could carry that much power on a post.

maybe if we all cut down on things, or looked into other ways, we could keep our beautiful natural landscape from being ruined even more than it is already

[ZaktheLad]

Done

[henchard]

National grid have agreed now to put nearly a quarter of the mid Wales cables underground

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-mid-wales-24141013

so it can be done, despite, the technical issues if enough people put pressure on to save the visual environment.

[mab]

personally i hate pylons ...they look awful, i have no problem with posts , but there is no way you could carry that much power on a post.

well the e-petition talks about 'wooden pylons' - which to me means telegraph poles so I think you're OK with this one  .

National grid have agreed now to put nearly a quarter of the mid Wales cables underground

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-mid-wales-24141013

so it can be done, despite, the technical issues if enough people put pressure on to save the visual environment.

well, yes, it can be done over short distances (in the article you quote, 13km of the 53km route) - but at a cost, both in terms of installation cost and energy lost in transmission. The practical limit for underground AC transmission is 60km before the power losses make it uneconomic, so if they put the whole 53km underground a large proportion of the energy generated by the windfarm would be lost in transmission - or in the expensive and lossy phase-correction stations needed to get the energy to the other end of the line - making a farce of the whole project renewable energy windfarm project.

Of course if they do end up burying the whole 53km that would play into the hands of the NIMBYs who would then hold it up as an example of how wind farms don't produce useful amounts of energy  .

In the future, HVDC may become cheap enough for the cables to be buried, but for now I'd rather have the poles, and the renewable power rather than another array of nuclear power stations and a pole-free view - I care more for the global environment than the visual environment - but maybe that's just me  .

[cloddopper]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricy_Pylons  in the link you can see the new  " T " poles of Holland they are not 15 mtr tall wood poles but 15 mtr  steel ones  instead .

Anyone got a link to a picture of the wooden poles suggested in the BBC article???