[Muc]

Just curious. Why are the major religions of the world so anti-pig? The Koran forbids Muslims to eat pork and the Bible similarly forbids its adherents - Jews and Christians (though the latter disregard it).
 I suppose the prohibitions come from the one text or custom originally as these religions all originated in the same area. But it is bizarre, considering pigs are so valuable to people struggling to feed themselves, and such clean animals, regardless of what the holy books say.
Does anyone know if the religions of the east have similar problems with the pig?

[Hilarysmum]

I think it is because the pig in those days would have been scavengers (dont think shellfish is on the menu for same reason) whereas goats, cows etc graze.  Just a guess.  Then again they dont know what they are missing!!!  Although I have an e-friend who is muslim and breeds GOS pigs (Canada) and had a Jewish friend who loved my pigs. 

[Mr Pig]

The reasons are many and varied and we can only speculate several millennia on. The eating of pig's flesh is forbidden in Leviticus in the Old Testament which strongly influences Judaism but is much less important than the New Testament to Christian religions. The pig specifically is said to be unclean both in the Koran and the Bible. HM is quite right that it may be much to do with its scavenging nature, (pigs roaming the streets pre-sewage times would eat faeces etc as part of their rubbish clearing duties). However, chickens too are scavengers but are not outlawed and rabbits aren't but they are (outlawed).

Pigs were also believed in times past to be the cause of leprosy which made them untouchable to the ancient Egyptians. They were also the chosen stock of the settled farmer whereas most influence in biblical times seems to have been with the nomadic herdsmen who kept sheep, cattle and goats and who despised the setlled farmers as they interrupted their grazing habits.

All of these things served to mitigate against the pig. The ancient Chinese emporers rejected the Muslim faith becuase they could not concieve of keeping the huge population of China content without the ability to feed on pigs which were so much more efficient in producing meat then other species.

On a practical level, I was in Sharjah in the UAE on business in the late 1970s and my host thought it would be jolly clever to procure some roast pork for my Sunday lunch and we sat on the verandah of a Club eating this meal in 40 deg+ and it was quite revolting. How the pig had been raised I don't know but it was greasy and generally unpleasant and in that moment I could quite understand why they didn't eat pork in the Middle East!

[sellickbhoy]

taking a superficial look at the "rules" of most religions shows them up to be an utter nonsense. the cultists are best ignored! Let them get with their own lives and hopefully they'll let us get on with ours (though historic evidence suggests they won't)

[MrRee]

I was once arrested in Kuwait airport for bringing in 30lbs of smoked back bacon for the guys that I worked with in Iraq. They tried for over an hour to find a non-Muslim airport worker to take it away (they wouldn't touch it). In the end they made me put it into a bin,gutted!!!  Then,2 weeks later I went to dinner at the house of the ex-head of secret police for Basra,and was served trotters. This from a man who became a very close friend and tried his hardest to convert me to Islam.  Oh,and also,one can drink alcohol in Iraq,but not in Kuwait. Although I did hear whispers that the new king of Kuwait was thinking about licensing laws for hotels before I left in '06.
 I've worked for many an Arab,the head of finance for the Saudi govt  a Prince,the guy that built the only 7star hotel and many others,and when not in their own country will regulary gamble drink and allow their daughters to dress in Western (revealing) clothing,it's all hypocritical if ya ask me! .....Ree

[Bodger]

Some religious groups wont eat rabbit either because it too is classed as an unclean animal.

Rabbits actually eat their food twice. They digest, poop it and then eat it again.

[Hilarysmum]

Rabbits actually eat their food twice. They digest, poop it and then eat it again.

And not so long ago chickens were fed chicken faeces because chickens waste a lot of their food first time around!

[Muc]

Pigs surely don't eat their own faeces, do they?
I wonder what the DEFRA regs would say.

Mr Ree, that is interesting about no one handling the bacon, as the Bible (and I presume the Koran) also forbids touching the carcass. I found this while Googling:
 "The swine, as he divideth the hoof, and be cloven footed, yet he cheweth not the cud; he is unclean to you. Of their flesh shall ye not eat, and their carcass shall ye not touch, they are unclean to you.; Leviticus chapter 11 verse 7 and 8.

Lots of Christians going to Hell I reckon.

[Hilarysmum]

Lots of Christians going to Hell I reckon.

I hope they save room for me!!!

[Troubled Waters]

If anyone is interested these are the 'reasons' Christians eat pork (and other unclean foods), I don't know much about other reasons other than Jews believe Jesus was a prohet (as I understand it, I may be wrong) and therefore disregard the NT and that's why they live by the OT teachings.

 In the Old Testament God lists foods that are unclean and shouldn't been eaten and are unfit to sacrifice to him. 

Then in the New Testament Paul has a vision (Acts 11:4-10) that is it interpreted as meaning that because of Jesus' death on the cross (and resurrection), sacrifices were no longer needed as Jesus was the final sacrifice and faith in Him was the only way man could be pure before God.  It was no longer necessary for God's people to live by these strict rules. therefore that which was unclean is now clean. God says 'Do not call anything impure that God has made clean.'  This is further reiterated in And again in Matthew 15:16-20

"Don't you see that whatever enters the mouth goes into the stomach and then out of the body? But the things that come out of the mouth come from the heart, and these make a man 'unclean.' For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false testimony, slander. These are what make a man 'unclean'; but eating with unwashed hands does not make him 'unclean.' " "

However, this interpretation is open to some debate and some branches of Christianity, eg Seventh Day Aventists, still do not eat those foods originally deemed unclean.

I guess with everything you can view the bible as a moral code and it was written so long ago in terminology so alien to us npw that any interpretation is open to speculation.  I personally try to live a Christian life, and struggle and fail often, but that is my choice and I don't force it onto others. As has been said before on here, we are all just trying to live our lives as best we can and treat others with the respect we ourselves would want.  We have to be comfortable with our lifestyle choices or we won;t stick to them.

So anyway, I have yet again babbled on far longer than I was intending, sorry,
Helen

[Fluffywelshsheep]

i was on the understanding that it was
a ) the nearest to human flesh (if burnt humans smell of pork, apparently)
b) something to the point that the devil had cloven hoves like a pig  (but i have faige reasoning of goat legs )

just what i can remember which isn't a lot at the moment . back to my knitting

Linz

[Hilarysmum]

Old Nick has goats legs. 

Now I have never eaten goat, perhaps thats why  

[Fluffywelshsheep]

look what i found

List of Biblically Clean and Unclean Foods
   
Clean foods are those which in their natural state do not harm the human body and which man can use for his nourishment. Unclean foods are those which are unhealthy to consume and are poisonous to the body. The Bible discusses the topic of what foods are good and bad for Man to eat in Leviticus 11 and Deuteronomy 14.
 
Clean Land Animals
Antelope    Deer
(Venison)    Goat    Ox
Bison
(Buffalo)    Elk    Hart    Reindeer
Caribou    Gazelle    Ibex    Sheep
(Lamb, Mutton)
Cattle
(Beef, Veal)    Giraffe    Moose    
               
Clean Birds
Chicken    Grouse    Pigeon    Sparrow
(and other songbirds)
Dove    Guinea fowl    Prairie chicken    Swan *
Duck    Partridge    Ptarmigan    Teal
Goose    Peafowl    Quail    Turkey
     Pheasant    Sagehen    
               
* Please note that the word "Swan" listed in the King James Version Bible translation of Leviticus 11:18 is a mistranslation. Swans are clean birds. Translations such as The Jewish Publication Society version renders the word in question as "horned owl."
               
Clean Insects
Types of locusts that may include crickets and grasshoppers
Clean Fish
Albacore
(Crevalle, Horse Mackerel, Jack)    Hardtail
(Blue Runner)    Mullet    Shad
Alewives
(Branch / River Herring)    Herring
(Alewife, Branch / Glut / Lake / River / Sea Herrings)    Muskellunge
(Jacks)    Sheepshead
Anchovy    Kingfish    Orange Roughy    Silver Hake
(Whiting)
Barracuda    Long Nose Sucker
(Northern or
Red Striped Sucker)    Perch
(Bream)    Silversides
Bass    Common Sucker
(Fresh Water Mullet,
White Sucker)    Pike
(Pickerel, Jack)    Smelt
(Frost or Ice Fish)
Black Drum    Crappie
(Black / White Crappies)    Pig Fish    Snapper
(Ebu, Jobfish, Lehi,
Onaga, Opakapaka, Uku)
Black Pomfret
(Monchong)    Drum    Pollack
(Pollock,
Boston Bluefish)    Snook
(Gulf Pike)
Blue Runner
(Hardtail)    Flounder
(Dab, Gray / Lemon Sole,
Summer / Winter Flounder,
Yellow Tail)    Pompano    Sole
Bluebacks
(Glut Herrings)    Grouper
(Black / Nassau / Red /
Yellowfish Grouper, Gag)    Red Horse Sucker
(Redfin)    Spanish Mackerel
Bluebill Sunfish    Grunt
(White / Yellow Grunts)    Red Snapper    Steelhead
Bluefish    Gulf Pike
(Robalo, Snook, Sergeant)    Redfish    Striped Bass
Bluegill    Haddock    Robalo
(Gulf Pike)    Sucker
(Red Horse Sucker, Redfin)
Bonitos    Hake    Porgy
(Scup)    Sunfish
Bowfin    Halibut    Red Drum
(Redfish)    Tarpon
Buffalofish    Hardhead    Rockfish    Trout
(Gray Sea, Lake,
Sand Sea, White Sea,
Spotted Sea Trouts, Weakfish)
Butterfish    Mackerel
(Cobia)    Salmon
(Chum, Coho, King,
Pink or Red)    
Tuna
(Ahi, Aku, Albacore,
Bluefin, Bonito,
Shipjack,Tombo,
Yellowfin, Yellowtail)
Carp    Mahimahi
(Dorado, Dolphinfish
[not the mammal dolphin])    Sardine
(Pilchard)    Turbot
(except European turbot)
Chubs
(Bloater,
Longjaw, Blackfin)    Menhaden    Scup
(Porgy)    Whitefish
Cod    Minnow    Sea Bass    Whiting
(Silver Hake)
         
         
      Sergeant Fish
(Gulf Pike)    Yellow Perch
          

Unclean Land Animals
Swine
Boar, Peccary, Pig (hog, bacon, ham, lard, pork)
          
Canines    Equines    Felines
Coyote    Ass    Cat
Dog    Donkey    Cheetah
Fox    Mule    Leopard
Hyena    Horse    Lion
Jackal    Onager    Panther
Wolf    Zebra
(quagga)    Tiger
          
Other
Armadillo    Kangaroo    Rat
Badger    Llama
(alpaca, vicuña)    Rhinoceros
Bear    Mole    Skunk
Beaver    Monkey    Slug
Camel    Mouse    Snail
(escargot)
Elephant    Muskrat    Squirrel
Gorilla    Opossum    Wallaby
Groundhog    Porcupine    Weasel
Hare    Rabbit    Wolverine
Hippopotamus    Raccoon    Worm
          
Unclean Insects
All insects except some in the locust family.
 
Unclean Birds
Albatross    Eagle    Magpie    Roadrunner
Bat    Flamingo    Osprey    Sandpiper
Bittern    Grebe    Ostrich    Seagull
Buzzard    Grosbeak    Owl    Stork
Condor    Gull    Parrot    Swallow
Coot    Hawk    Pelican    Swift
Cormorant    Heron    Penguin    Vulture
Crane    Kite    Plover    Water Hen
Crow    Lapwing    Rail    Woodpecker
Cuckoo    Loon    Raven    
               
Unclean Reptiles and Amphibians
Reptiles    Amphibians
Alligator    Blindworm
Caiman    Frog
Crocodile    Newt
Lizard    Salamander
Snake    Toad
Turtle    
 
Unclean Fish and Marine Animals
               
Fish    Shellfish    Soft Body    Sea mammals
Bullhead    Abalone    Cuttlefish    Dolphin
Catfish    Clam    Jellyfish    Otter
Eel    Crab    Limpet    Porpoise
European turbot    Crayfish    Octopus    Seal
Marlin    Lobster    Squid
(calamari)    Walrus
Paddlefish    Mussel         Whale
Shark    Prawn         
Stickleback    Oyster         
Squid    Scallop         
Sturgeon
(includes most caviar)    Shrimp         
Swordfish


a list of what you can and can' t eat according to the bible

[sheila]

All a load of medieval superstition!

[Muc]

I'll have to stop surfing the net. Just found this gem:
"The pig is the most shameless animal on the face of the earth. It is the only animal that invites its friends to have sex with its mate. It feels no jealousy. And among people who consume pork, the practice of wife swapping and other forms of promiscuous behaviour is common."
(The auther is the president of Islamic Research Foundation, Mumbai. http://www.irf.net)
I better not show this to Mrs Muc.