[happygolucky]

I have been thinking a long time about all the health and safety....I know its for everyones good but is it?
We have so many inspections it Peees me off....we do well but are selling up, maybe to have some other business, we will see BUT, all the rules and reg and planning cost too much and eat into any meagre profit.
I got to thinking, farmers used to feed their hens and pigs waste from shops, cafes etc, that's not allowed so not the farmer has to pay for expensive feed and the waste,....well goes to waste.
I heard something today that made me so angry and it actually had nothing to do with me, it was about my local planning....they tend to object to everything so put anyone off who wants to give being self employed a go.......
We also, being a business, cannot get any form of grant, and they even went funny about out garage being converted, we are not doing that now but after talking to the person today, we should have done it and got retrospective planning,,,,,,
So, shops are going down due to the internet but I suspect a lot of small businesses and smallholders are going down due to H&S
What so other think??

[smiley bucket]

I agree the planners are not helping things, i recently read in a council document that their target for refusal of any new proposed sustainable/rural business was 100% refusal.
This stinks.  If we own it and want to make a pi$$ poor wage but have total job and life satisfaction who the hell are they to refuse us before we even get our suggestions down on paper.  I would never advise anyone to meet and discuss anything with planners. You have to build a solid case for acceptance, study and pry till you know all about the NIMBYs in the neighbourhood and what they do at parish council meetings, then with all guns blazing fire in your seamless application.  If they do find something to winge about (and they will    ) just work on an answer till there are no more winges, bingo, live, work, enjoy and sod off ElfinSafety!
 

[happygolucky]

  We had plans passed but with loads of conditions, but the person I spoke to didn't, they moved their now successful business to another county where there were no Dinosaurs, that maddened me, I have no spare money to do what they wanted to do but it was one of my dreams too so now that ones shattered.....
Smallbuisness and smallholdings need a lot more help, the bigger businesses do too but lets start like it all started before the net, I think used clothing is doing very well, infact they have become very expensive.
I know a local councillor that moans about every thing, they do not want change, even for the better and that's very sad   I could explaine but not on here!!

[RUSTYME]

The main reason shops are going under is the massive amount they have to pay in rates etc . The internet doesn't help but it isn't the cause .
Huge rates bills and massive tax hikes are killing the uk .
The insane borrowing that has gone on in the past is now playing a big part too .
It is the same with eu membership as well .
All the smaller countries who got all the 'free' money from the dictatorship that is the eu  , are now up that creek without a boat let alone a paddle , and they turn to the corrupt bankers that are now running these countries for even more money .
Bailouts they call them , extorsion by any other name though .
The system is corrupt , those that are running it are corrupt , those that are providing the worthless money that is keeping it going are corrupt .
The system is , however , a dead man walking . There is no way it can survive much longer .
It does all boil down to corruption , and the rot has now spread as far as it can .
The hmrc is one of the flailing limbs of a government that is in a death throw , and is , in desperation , trying to grab anything to sustain their corrupt system .
In doing so though , they are like a drowning man who grabs at anyone who attempts to help him , and he clings so tight that he ends up drowning the very people that could save him .
He , the drowning man , like the government , doesn't care who he kills or how many , he just grabs the next in line  , till they succumb to his vice like grip .
He is so desperate to survive , nobody can help him . The only way the people near him can survive , is to keep away from his grip .
The same applies to the flailing corrupt government . Starve the bastards of their life blood , money , and they will drown in their own shite . Then and only then can we get out of the shite they have pulled us into .
How to do this though is the hard part .
As the system continues in it's death spiral , more and more of what people pay taxes for , will be taken away , although the taxes/rates will continue to increase .

[deepinthewoods]

there is also a school of thought which says that the councils and government dont want peole who are self sufficient, the economy needs people to be dependent upon the likes of supermarkets and energy suppliers, so the bias in government and councils is to supress those people who are trying to get ahead, thats why they sold debt so easily, debt is slavery. basically.

[happygolucky]

I do not understand why they cannot reduce rates in towns to help the towns survive, most towns now are dying and that's sad

The system is corrupt , those that are running it are corrupt , those that are providing the worthless money that is keeping it going are corrupt .

I trust the criminals rather than the politicians, bankers and councillors, at least you know you will get knee capped if money is not paid back, its the others who are the liars!!
Guess I could become a gangster 

[doganjo]

Can't quite see you as thug, somehow    Although you have conditions on your garage plans it is still an asset to whoever buys your house.  I think it's a great buy for the price to be honest.

A lot more of the big companies are going to go bust so i reckon planners are going to have to back off soon!

[pheonix]

we are moving soon and have looked a a few small hotel and small shops to buy.  some had rates for about £14k pa, others £4kpa and others nil as remote area. i dont understand rates at all but its enough to put you off buying alot of businesses.

[MAK]

there is also a school of thought which says that the councils and government dont want peole who are self sufficient, the economy needs people to be dependent upon the likes of supermarkets and energy suppliers, so the bias in government and councils is to supress those people who are trying to get ahead, thats why they sold debt so easily, debt is slavery. basically.

Really ! I wonder if they have people watching this site to gain information about us and draft new ways to stop people being self sufficient.

[Alistair]

Rusty, I normally agree with you, I don't this time!

I'm negotiating on a shop at the moment, not paying any rates for year 1, that's in merseyside, my other shops rates are about £1500 a year. It's only in the town centres that rates are high and there's small business relief on those, in the town centres they're giving units away, I looked in Kendal, 1month leases, most seem to be 6 month leases, so if your willing to take a long lease, the worlds yours...
There are no grants (unless you fit in the criteria of being 12 yrs old) to start up these days, but that is in my opinion a good thing, if you can't stack your business plan you shouldn't be starting out in this market.

The problems the Internet shopping, society being more interested in convenience and the mob mentality, so if everyone thinks something's good and rates it high on the Internet, then everyone buys it, so one one goes to jessops to buy a camera, they don't need the advice, they've already got it and the internees cheaper because they're not on he high street etc etc

[Alistair]

I've just invented the 'internees', it's an advice free version of he Internet, it's just basically TAS and a picture of rustyme's knees, it's conceptual at the moment...

Interestingly I also invented a flag on a stick that you put on the back of your westie when it snows so you can see it, and mittens for kittens oh and don't forget the clogs, for dogs that is...

I dd drink far to much port last night, it's a recession don't you know, clearing the booze cupboard can't afford wine at the moment

[plumseverywhere]

I don't think its really down to health and safety - more the extortionate rates and rents that the high street charges. A tiny kiosk type shop in our local town is £10,000 a year PLUS really high rates which are about another 50% on top.
THe more small businesses that can't afford this reduces how many interesting shops are in the town, this in turn reduces how many people visit the town to do their shopping.
Obviously I am guilty of being an online shop - my business has never been more brisk

My husband is a very senior health and safety expert and his take on 'elf and safety bashing is that most of the so called legislation isn't actually set out by the HSE rather people who misinterpret or make up their own guidelines and then install them in settings. Eg. the no conkers at school was ONE headteacher who made that one up and it became an object of ridicule for all H&S professionals.
All the malarkey about don't put grit down because if someone falls over, you will be sued wasn't HSE recommendation either! 

[RUSTYME]

No probs Alistair , you usually agree with me ? Do they let you out then ? I escaped !
Your last sentance ; "it's cheaper on the internet because they aren't on the high st etc etc " erm isn't that what i am saying , roflmfao !
Yes there are 'new deals' to be had , but even charity shops are now closing because they aren't all getting their 80%+ rates discount now .
Good luck on your venture though mate , hope it goes well for you .
My knobbly knees are not a pretty sight though mate , best give them a miss !
Take care , 'they' are out there !

[the great composto]

In most cases if you factor in labour costs, hardly any smallholder is really viable as a money making business that would earn a decent standard of living in its own right.

Nobody is killing it off - its just not viable in the modern environment of supply and demand as a money making venture.

Therefore it becomes a lifestyle choice & nobody will ever kill that off as long as people value the lifestyle more than money ( or health as we have seen on here this last week).

[sabrina]

A friend of mine told me this story, he was painting and finishing off at a new house. Owner had a right carry on with the council over planning but got it in the end. They wanted trees planted around the plot which is often the case up here AND roses up his driveway. When work was finished they came to inspect everything and asked about the roses. They are there said the owner and right enough plants could be seen BUT he planted them upside down saying he was not a gardener and he had put in roses. He did it to get his own back I suppose. Supermarkets have ruined the high street as just about everything is now sold in them. I did a good bit of my Christmas shopping on line as it works out cheaper than the cost of fuel getting to the shops. Being on a limited budget means doing what you can to save money. I never go into Aberdeen but shop in Turriff or Banff which are about 9 miles from where we live. So I feel I am supporting my local shops when able to.