[benkt]

I don't think you do have to be well off to get started. We had an old ex-council place with a long garden which got us started on chickens, ducks and veg. For our first lot of pigs we 'squated' an unused and very overgrown paddock and set up a 'pig club'. We had six families sharing three pigs, everyone paid £20 a month so we didn't need any capital to get going at all.
Our new place we got for less than half the £300k mentioned earlier and that's got 4 bed+6 acres and within an hour of London on the train. Of course, its got its share of problems but you've got to compromise on some things. We just about broke even in our first year and this year I get paid from the farm (just!).


Having a husband in IT sounds ideal - I still do some computer work part time and over half our members are in IT in one way or another. I'm thing we'd have struggled to run our community farm if we'd bought somewhere cheap in Wales or Scotland although I'd love to hear otherwise. In order to make money on selling the premium produce from a smallholding you need a good 'middle class' market who are willing to pay a premium as you're never going to compete on price.

[HappyHippy]

Noo,you do not have to be wealthy,just a bit insane

I'd agree with that 

We are lucky that we live on the redundant 'family' farm so don't have rent or a mortgage to pay - if we did we definately would have a smaller house and less land (and be on an island somewhere waaaay north  )

We have 4 kids, the last 2 born while we were actively smallholding - I chased pigs in pitch black, lashing rain and howling winds while 7 months pregnant (and OH was working) I've farrowed pigs while waiting to go into labour myself, the kids have (at times) had to delay their new boots/clothes while we buy x, y or z for the holding.

It's hard, it's dirty, smelly, cold and 'orrible at times but you know what...... seeing your kids running through long grassy fields, climbing trees, smiling with glee when they hold a piglet/chick, knowing you're feeding them with good quality food and giving them a freedom so many kids just don't get - that is what makes it worthwhile for me. Wouldn't change it for the world 

If you both want it bad enough (because with a young family it will take both of you) you'll find a way 
Good luck and keep us all posted
Karen

[Canadian Sheepfarmer]

Here's my opinion for what it's worth.
The main thing is not to give up and settle for a compromise.
If you do that it will most likely never happen for you in this lifetime, and chances are you will not be fit for it anyway. The spirit of the times is against smallfarming, as it so often has been throughout history.
The System wants consumers, TV watchers, 'stuff' buying workers, not self sufficient, frugal, thrifty types who don't want to join in and fuel the consumer economy.
 
I notice this in Canadian farming. The govt has no time for small players. Farmers are encouraged to think of themselves as Commodity Producers, to get bigger or get out. To farm more and more land in order to justify purchasing bigger and more expensive machinery.
 
Let's be honest, self sufficiency is selfish. A farmer who is feeding 800 people a year with his wheat crop is far more valuable to the system and humanity? than a smallholder who is just feeding himself and being smug when the power goes off!
 
In my own case I bought a 4 acre smallholding in Ireland for very little money, about the cost of a new car at the time, cash only, no one would have given a mortgage on it, at a time when being English was not a cool thing to be in that location. Worked it up, made a business selling herbs and vegetables, rode the Celtic Tiger, and sold it for 5 times what I paid for it.
 
Wishing to own more land I moved to Canada, did exactly the same thing again. Bought 22 acres in BC from a bank, it was a bankruptcy sale and I had to go to court to buy it. Again, after working and building, sold it for 3 times what I paid for it and moved to the prairies, just before prices started going crazy here too.
 The Chinese are buying up Saskatchewan farmland for gawds sakes! What does that tell us?
 
So now I own outright about 200 acres, no debt. As a smallholder out of debt is out of danger, debt just sucks you back into the system. This is considered a very small holding here, just shows the meaning of relativity!
 
Several times along the way I was tempted to give up and get a job. This might have been a wise thing to do in hindsight, who knows? I have worked part time jobs along the way, but only in order to fuel my main project. But as I say, you have to fix your mind on your goal and just keep on.
Not easy, but then it never was...
 

[bigchicken]

yes you need to be rich in spirit and self belief, the very best of luck to you and your family.

[pollytunnel]

It's worth updating this thread rather than start agin - there's no avoiding the property value differences and fluctuations - so if anyone wants to make this compromise more bearable by some visiting/when available help, I can pass on some useful experience/knowledge while slowly and progressively making it viable.  http://gvproperties.com/houses/muckinish1903/muckinish1903.html

[honeyend]

After 30 years we finally have our own land. I have ponies and I have rented land in patches which is not cheap but it has allowed me to make mistakes in private, I have watched others make expensive mistakes.
 If you children of school age I would look for an ex council house in a decent area with a large garden and work up. Never underestimate the amount of time and money it takes getting to and from the shops and school, if your kids are miserable because they can not easily get out they will make your life hells so I think semi rural is better than isolated . I have seen retired couples with a descent amount of money buy the Good Life only to find out it takes a lot more time and money than they thought.If are  you are used to the convenience of town finding out that your local surgery is miles away is a shock and forget choice. I have had someone with me over the summer who thought it was all lovely but I dread to think how she would have coped with 3ft of mud and driving rain over the winter.
 So my advice is dip your toe, you can not live in a field and being miserable and cold at home is awful. Do not take on anything you can not manage on your own as you will soon get fed up when nobody wants to help and you are struggling and be patient.

[AndynJ]

yes but then again what is well off, see I have kids and 3 grandchildren so even if we had 5 million we wouldn't feel well off, if you live in Wales or Scotland you can buy somewhere for 100k in Devon same thing would cost 400. at least whilst your trying your working harder like another said get an allotment make things, grow things, collect things, have working holidays, cover for others so they can go on holiday, cover for us, you can stay in a oak log cabin with log burner & hot tub, down in sunny Devon. (not this week its  it down)
In fact if you want to cut trees down, plant trees, cut up trees  your welcome to come to us mid November as that's what we will be doing.

[lachlanandmarcus]

The other thing is that if you are prepared to slog it for a while you can achieve the dream without having huge resources. People from our village come to our house on the hill and say they are really jealous and they would love something like this but could never afford it.


I then point out to them that their ordinary house in the village cost MORE than our derelict house and land and the work we had done to make it habitable, the difference being I had to live in a static caravan for a year and the place (the land and animals)eats income to keep it up) so we don't have sky and new cars And street lights and bin collection that isn't a mile down the track - so it isn't that we are lucky, it's that we made a choice and were prepared to slog through it.


So more things are possible than you imagine, but it will take sacrifice, compromise and Vision, but you sound like you just might have it!

[Clarebelle]

We are in a similar situation to you, I am a housewife (although, trying to start up a very small home business) and my husband works, we have three young children. We live in the midlands at the moment. We are in a situation where, ideally we would live to get a place in Anglesey but we are also considering Orkney, we can get so much more for our money there as well as it being a hard but rewarding place.

At the moment we live in rented military accomodation with a really small backgarden but we still managed to keep quail and breed rabbits for meat, not on any great scale but enough for us to get a little bit of experience in animal husbandry and the different aspects of raising food!

I grow a little bit of produce but don't really have room for much and as it isn't our house, everything I grow is in pots. I have a blueberry bush in one big plant which does really well, you can also grow apples in large pots. Herbs are also a good investment, there are many which will come back year after year and it is much cheaper than buying from the supermarket. I've also grown tomatoes, cucmbers, beans, beetroot, radishes and loads of other things successfully in pots. If you wanted to over winter something, maybe broad beans? Or if think you can get lettuce to overwinter? Use plastic bottles cut in half to place over small plants to protect from frost.

Lastly, i guess, don't give up! We found a house in anglesey in may last year which had kept being reduced in price over the previous 6 months and we finally decided to go for it. We thought we were in a good position financially as we had only one financial commitment which was a bank loan, unfortunately when we got to the bank we were told that as first time buyers, with one income and that darn bank loan theres no way we could borrow what we needed. So, since May we have been saving every penny so that we can pay the loan off early, now we should be debt free by Jan. It, may seem like a long way off, but save all you can to get yourself in a good finanicial position.

[mowhaugh]

We were just about to buy a small farm in Orkney (house, steading and 28 acres with a agreement to contract farm 150 acres) when I found I was pregnant with our first son, and I wimped out of being that far from family. My observations from our visits, made autumn/winter were that yes, it is very windy, but the services are amazing - everything within 45 minutes on mainland, where we would have to make a 2 hour trip to Newcastle or Edinburgh from where we are now, so excellent value property, isolated in some ways, but not in others. There is no way we could have afforded any thing similar in the borders, so we keep on renting, and hoping our tenancy will be renewed!

[john and helen]

  miss NV

you need to ask yourself and OH what you want out of life... i once thought my job was all and end all,  it wasn't.
its just a job that brings in the money... so you end up working just to exist... thats a waste of life ..

there are bargains still to be had, me and my dear wife are just about to give up a 3 bedroom house to go and live in a static caravan for a couple of years , we will build our little barn up and start living the life we have dreamt about..

we know its not going to be easy, we will expect problems, and we will have problems..but we will be living our dream, as said above..you only have one life......live it...

How much...well we fell in love with a few, but couldn't get a mortgage, but they would give us a mortgage once we bought  we managed to find our place for less than £85K , we will spend in the region of £60K on doing the barn up.. so a total cost in the region of £145K  the price of a Ex council house down here ..

to get property in this price range, you will need to sacrifice a few luxuries ...a small price to pay for the end result


john


PS....Never give up on a dream

[sorchajayne]

WOW! I am SO happy to find this thread. It shows I'm not as crazy as I thought. As the OP said, we're not very well off, I'm a stay at home mum on a break from the paid working world, and my husband earns well under the national average, but we would love to have a smallholding.

I'm looking for courses that will give me some idea of how to look after livestock and make a business thrive. I'm accumulating secondhand books or reading from the library to learn more, and reading articles and websites like this. We have an allotment we've just rented from the council and are clearing it for spring planting.

I can only say what everyone else has, do whatever you possibly can and don't give up! I don't care that it seems impossible, I have no intention of folding.

[Clarebelle]

I'm glad someone resurected this thread as I have an update!

We still only have one income but now, rather than put money in saving we used it to pay off all our debt. We cancelled any contracts we didn't need, prime example being my phone contract, I was paying £20 a month but since cancelling it I still have the original £10 top up on pay as you go, this was 3 months ago!

So, with no debt, the last coupldeof months we have been able to put in the bank the evquilvalent of a monthly mortgage payment and yesterday the nice people at halifax gave us an offer in principle on the new help to buy scheme for 130k.

I know this still isn't very much but we have seen a place in Orkney which I am flying over to view next week. We are sacrificing location (in some ways, not in others!) for the opportunity to buy somewhere we can start living our dream.

If you focus your efforts, it can be done!

[Dan]

I know this still isn't very much but we have seen a place in Orkney which I am flying over to view next week. We are sacrificing location (in some ways, not in others!) for the opportunity to buy somewhere we can start living our dream.

That's brilliant, I hope it goes well and it's just what you want. 

[Rosemary]

I know this still isn't very much but we have seen a place in Orkney which I am flying over to view next week. We are sacrificing location (in some ways, not in others!) for the opportunity to buy somewhere we can start living our dream.

If you focus your efforts, it can be done!

Wow, well done you and OH -  .  that it all works out