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Author Topic: Wanted - Guernsey Bull to Hire - Devon/Somerset  (Read 5619 times)

LulaB

  • Joined Apr 2011
Wanted - Guernsey Bull to Hire - Devon/Somerset
« on: July 02, 2012, 04:37:26 pm »
Anyone have a randy Guernsey?  I have an idea to cross my highlands with one. 

Rosemary

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Barry, Angus, Scotland
    • The Accidental Smallholder
Re: Wanted - Guernsey Bull to Hire - Devon/Somerset
« Reply #1 on: July 02, 2012, 04:41:33 pm »
Sorry can't help with the randy Guernsey - but good luck with the search.

Interested in the cross though - the hardy house cow? Have you tried it before? Sounds interesting.

LulaB

  • Joined Apr 2011
Re: Wanted - Guernsey Bull to Hire - Devon/Somerset
« Reply #2 on: July 02, 2012, 04:49:21 pm »
Hi Rosemary


This is the point.  I think it would be a super mix.  Most people think Guernseys are delicate wee beasties, but Scott took them on his Polar expedition, so they can't be that feeble!  I know guernsey meat is good (have you tasted BRown Cow organics? - AMAZING!) and Highland is fantastic, so any steer would be a great beef cross.  Any heifer would make the prettiest house cow on the planet.

Factotum

  • Joined Jun 2012
Re: Wanted - Guernsey Bull to Hire - Devon/Somerset
« Reply #3 on: July 02, 2012, 09:12:07 pm »
Aren't they a dairy type? -you'd probably be better going for AI than thinking about having a dairy bull on your holding unless you've got the right facilities.

Sue


LulaB

  • Joined Apr 2011
Re: Wanted - Guernsey Bull to Hire - Devon/Somerset
« Reply #4 on: July 03, 2012, 09:22:17 am »
Yes.  They are a dairy type, but you don't need any special facilities for a dairy bull.  I only have a small fold of Highlands, and I just think it would be a good cross.


Guernsey produce fantastic beef.  Really, if you haven't tried it, you should.  Brown Cow Organics produce guernsey beef and have won every taste test going (including a Rick Stein one with Smithfield butchers who just about fell over when they found out the beef they had rated so highly came from a Dairy breed).


AI is slightly tricky for me as I borrow a crush for our TB test every year and I don't fancy chasing my girls around the field with a straw when they come into season.  You only have a short window.  If I have a bull in, he can take his own sweet time, give them a bit of romance and chances of conception are better.  It's like with pigs, AI is never quite the same...

Factotum

  • Joined Jun 2012
Re: Wanted - Guernsey Bull to Hire - Devon/Somerset
« Reply #5 on: July 03, 2012, 09:26:38 pm »
but you don't need any special facilities for a dairy bull

I think I have to disagree with that.

Farms with dairy bulls usually keep them in a bull pen. Dairy bulls are banned from being in fields with a public right of way or other permitted access. Have a read of the HSE booklet for England & Wales:

http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/ais17ew.pdf

Dairy breed bulls are notoriously unpredictable  and I think they should be left to the experts - dairy farmers.

We are familiar with handling of beef bulls as we bring a bull on to the holding every year for our Shetlands. The bull stays for at least 6 weeks and then goes onto his next 'job'. We take extra care when the bull is here, even though we are confident handlers of our breeding stock and their young.

As for the beef- I'll take your word for that, though perhaps you should try Shetland beef sometime :).

Sue

LulaB

  • Joined Apr 2011
Re: Wanted - Guernsey Bull to Hire - Devon/Somerset
« Reply #6 on: July 04, 2012, 11:12:18 am »
Appreciate what you're saying, Sue, but I wouldn't put ANY bull in a field with a public right of way whether dairy, beef or dual purpose. Just as I have never put newly calved cows anywhere with a public right of way. To me, that is common sense. Don't put animals where they feel threatened or under stress and don't put people in danger.

ALL bulls can get knacky. All bulls must be treated with respect and understanding. The gentlest of bullocks can turn into a right old bugger once he's mature and within scent of females. The one thing I would say as regards my choice is, unlike commercially bred Holsteins, Guernseys are renowned for their docility. Before I get messages saying "My Holstein's a pussycat" or "I knew a Guernsey who listened to Megadeath, smoked crack and held up my grandmother for her pension", let me just say that, yes, there are good'uns and bad'uns of every breed. This is, all of that being said, a cross I would like to try.

You have a short window of viability, especially in bad weather. A cow's fertile period can be as short a 4 hours in weather like this, and if that happens in the middle of the night, you've missed it. A bull is less likely to.

Factotum

  • Joined Jun 2012
Re: Wanted - Guernsey Bull to Hire - Devon/Somerset
« Reply #7 on: July 04, 2012, 12:09:06 pm »
Slightly off the wall thought - what about taking your cows to a bull - if you contact the English Guernsey Society or UK Guernsey Cattle they will probably have a list of bull keepers in your area.

Maybe the keeper could be persuaded to put your cows to his bull - for a fee?

We've never done AI (yet) but the visiting bulls have been very dedicated to their duties and have not failed us.

I was looking at the Brown Cow Organics site - nice presentation and it's good that they are doing well. Another thought - why not give them a ring & see what bulls they keep - they may be interested in your idea & give you some leads to a good bull.

Sue

LulaB

  • Joined Apr 2011
Re: Wanted - Guernsey Bull to Hire - Devon/Somerset
« Reply #8 on: July 04, 2012, 12:28:35 pm »
Hi again Sue

That's a great idea, but you do run into crush problems again. My girls have big horns that just won't go through a conventional crush. A guernsey bull can go through a highland crush for his pre movement test, but mine wouldn't go through a conventional for theirs on their return journey...

Logistics, logistics!

Factotum

  • Joined Jun 2012
Re: Wanted - Guernsey Bull to Hire - Devon/Somerset
« Reply #9 on: July 04, 2012, 01:00:44 pm »
Ah, sorry - forgot about testing - we don't have to do all that up here in Scotland if we're moving beasts from a Scottish holding, just turn up, load up and off you go. Well once you've persuaded the bull that he's going somewhere nice to find some new girlies.

Benefits of Scotland being declared a TB free zone. I'd give the societies and the Brown Cow people a try.

Sue


Blackmyre

  • Joined Oct 2011
  • Dallas, Moray
Re: Wanted - Guernsey Bull to Hire - Devon/Somerset
« Reply #10 on: July 06, 2012, 09:41:50 pm »
All bulls can get knacky.
Yes, but dairy bulls are so renowned for their nastiness that there are special rules for them.

Guernsey cows may be renowned for their docility, but are you sure that goes for the bulls too? Everything I've ever read about the bulls of dairy breeds suggests that they are probably best left to specialists...

LulaB

  • Joined Apr 2011
Re: Wanted - Guernsey Bull to Hire - Devon/Somerset
« Reply #11 on: July 09, 2012, 11:12:03 am »
Hi Blackmyre

Personally, I wouldn't trust any bull as far as I could take its appendix out. Beef or dairy.

Please, everyone, I appreciate your concern, but I have taken advice on this one, from people who have guernseys, (not someone called Dave down the pub).  The only reason for not using their bull is that they don't have one. They use AI, like most dairy herds do.

Holsteins - known for aggression. Limousin (beef) - also known for a nasty look in their eye. Dexters have a certain reputation too. I am NOT saying all dairy bulls are sweethearts. They aren't. I am not even saying all Guernsey bulls are sweethearts. That would be dumb, and while I may not be Stephen Hawking, I am not dumb.

I have a small fold of Highlands. I would like to run a good natured guernsey bull with them, if possible. Just as (if I were to go down that route) I would want a good natured Highland bull to run with them. It really is not in my interests to breed from ANYTHING with an unpleasant nature.

I breed for temperament, confirmation, hardiness and purpose. This isn't a game. I take these things seriously.

I thank you all for your concern. Really I do. This remains a cross I would like to try. I have explained my reasoning for wanting a bull, as opposed to AI. So I am asking again, can anyone help?

Blackmyre

  • Joined Oct 2011
  • Dallas, Moray
Re: Wanted - Guernsey Bull to Hire - Devon/Somerset
« Reply #12 on: July 09, 2012, 12:29:29 pm »

Hi Lula. I wasn't trying to talk you out of it or to suggest that you don't know what you're doing, I was just responding to the "all bulls can get knacky" comment. While that's no doubt true, bulls of dairy breeds are indeed considered particularly risky. This is not according to Some Bloke Down The Pub, it is according to Her Majety's Government: dairy bulls are subject to stricter rules than non-dairy breeds. Guernseys are explicitly mentioned in the law that Sue cited earlier.


Good luck with your search.

 

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