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Author Topic: Building a Wooden Barn  (Read 17615 times)

henchard

  • Joined Dec 2010
  • Carmarthenshire
    • Two Retirees Start a New Life in Wales
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Building a Wooden Barn
« on: April 06, 2012, 07:02:36 pm »
Having started off thinking about a Pole Barn I've decided to try and build something that looks a tad better. So having roughed something out on 'the back of an envelope'. I've posted the first stage of construction on our blog (this weekend) as we start the foundations.

http://lizburton.co.uk/wordpress/work-on-the-smallholding/building-a-pole-barn-part-1/

I hope to post more details as we go along and some more detailed plans once I know that it is working out ok! Hopefully, it may eventually prove useful to someone.

Over a year later the project is finished and we ended up with this barn which we built completely by ourselves for around £2000. It changed from a Pole Barn to a cut frame as we went along and it's all detailed in the blog.

« Last Edit: September 04, 2013, 07:17:16 pm by henchard »
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robert waddell

  • Guest
Re: Building a Wooden Barn
« Reply #1 on: April 06, 2012, 08:05:09 pm »
your concrete piers or columns would be better with re bar in them or wire cages made from sheets of wire mesh the proper stuff for concrete slabs the concrete has to be pokered in to max the strength of the concrete
the contact point betwean the concrete and timber is going to rot or be the weak point
did you concider  a steel structure :farmer:

henchard

  • Joined Dec 2010
  • Carmarthenshire
    • Two Retirees Start a New Life in Wales
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Re: Building a Wooden Barn
« Reply #2 on: April 06, 2012, 08:41:04 pm »
I do mention in the blog that if I was using a steel frame I'd put some steel reinforcement in the concrete. However, I decided against a steel frame for DIY construction.

These foundations will be more than adequate for what is in effect a glorified garden shed!

The timber will be tanalised (in fact I may even let the ends soak in creosote) and will sit on a dpm.
« Last Edit: April 06, 2012, 08:43:22 pm by henchard »

robert waddell

  • Guest
Re: Building a Wooden Barn
« Reply #3 on: April 06, 2012, 10:11:19 pm »
it will be surprising what weight is in your shed then the addition of snow as well    building regs are changing for agri sheds more stringent as a result of sheds collapsing because of the snow loading
better over enginered before the build than trying to modify after
pokering the concrete does improve the strength and durability of the base even a slab floor is far better pokered in than just poured and screed ed
steel is better than wood for diy
your plans are a bit more than a garden shed :farmer:

Bangbang

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Re: Building a Wooden Barn
« Reply #4 on: April 06, 2012, 10:16:14 pm »
Maybe deserves a spot on Grand Shed Designs!  ;)

deepinthewoods

  • Guest
Re: Building a Wooden Barn
« Reply #5 on: April 06, 2012, 10:28:25 pm »
in the blog it says 150mm, did you mean 1500mm? 

deepinthewoods

  • Guest
Re: Building a Wooden Barn
« Reply #6 on: April 06, 2012, 10:37:19 pm »
sorry, take that back , reread and reread, 150mm pad for the concrete pillar with 150mm showing above ground. bloody hell, that is some shed. i would agree with robert, the contact point between timber and concrete will (eventually) rot. might be worth further investigation

robert waddell

  • Guest
Re: Building a Wooden Barn
« Reply #7 on: April 06, 2012, 10:40:21 pm »
that is the depth of the blinding to give a solid even surface to stike the columns from
another quire what is the wind loading going to be it will have to be anchored some way not just placed there on the stilts :farmer:

henchard

  • Joined Dec 2010
  • Carmarthenshire
    • Two Retirees Start a New Life in Wales
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Re: Building a Wooden Barn
« Reply #8 on: April 06, 2012, 11:34:54 pm »
  building regs are changing for agri sheds more stringent

Agricultural sheds are generally exempt from building regs.

Simple Simon

  • Guest
Re: Building a Wooden Barn
« Reply #9 on: April 06, 2012, 11:57:49 pm »
Under certain circs they are exempt, but not from public liability.  If it falls on someone it's your neck.  If you build it to regs you have a good defence.

Womble

  • Joined Mar 2009
  • Stirlingshire, Central Scotland
Re: Building a Wooden Barn
« Reply #10 on: April 07, 2012, 08:21:12 am »
the contact point betwean the concrete and timber is going to rot or be the weak point

Yes, that's what happened to ours, and that was with old telegraph poles being used as the uprights (i.e. WELL treated wood). That said, it had probably been standing for 30 years, and it was a relatively easy job to jack up the roof and replace the poles with new ones when we did it this summer.
"All fungi are edible. Some fungi are only edible once." -Terry Pratchett

henchard

  • Joined Dec 2010
  • Carmarthenshire
    • Two Retirees Start a New Life in Wales
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Re: Building a Wooden Barn
« Reply #11 on: April 07, 2012, 09:09:22 am »
Under certain circs they are exempt, but not from public liability.  If it falls on someone it's your neck.  If you build it to regs you have a good defence.

Not quite sure what to make of this statement. If Building Regs don't apply; they don't apply end of story. Most peoples' houses here don't comply with current Building Regs and they seem quite happy to live in them despite the fact that timbers may be well under spec to current regs.; so I'm not exactly too concerned about my own barn, in my own field miles from my nearest neighbour!

The reason for the post was to show people a diary of construction. In particular building a useful barn that will be fairly inexpensive and that doesn't look like something from a third world refugee camp. In the blog I have stated that there are a few things I'm making up as I go along.

As for construction (I'm fairly knowledgeable about things) the project is 'belt and braces' construction. In the main fairly over engineered.

As I look around the countryside I see all sorts of shambolic constructions from traditional pole barns with sagging roofs to the horsey encampments that seem to spring up in some areas. Most of these now look like refugee camps, with pallets everywhere, visqueen hay stores, old baths and sinks strewn everywhere, and ramshackle huts and old lorry bodies as stables and electric fence tape tied everywhere.

I'm building on concrete foundations that go down in places to nearly 2m and will be using substantial timbers for columns etc.. and all people can do is mutter about Building Regulations and public liability. I suggest that perhaps those people may wish to get a structural engineer in to calculate that every aspect of their life is meeting earthquake proof standards; has everyone calculated the wind loading on their garden fence to obviate risk to passing pedestrians?

Have you seen what some of the timber stables and field shelters being sold on the internet are made of (not much more than matchwood in some cases)? Most of these are just plonked at best on a 4-6" concrete slab (not 2m deep foundations with nearly a meter square footprint at the bottom!) and at worst just put on bare soil or paving slabs.

So if anyone is interested in seeing progress I'll add to the blog as we go along. If anyone has useful suggestions I'm happy to receive them but please don't start bleating on about public liability, elf and safety and 'what if we have a a once in 500 year weather event' as this type of negativity really bugs the hell out of me.

That said, it had probably been standing for 30 years, and it was a relatively easy job to jack up the roof and replace the poles with new ones when we did it this summer.

In 30 years I'll probably be dead but if I have to arrange to replace a couple of timber columns so be it!

robert waddell

  • Guest
Re: Building a Wooden Barn
« Reply #12 on: April 07, 2012, 10:54:10 am »
this posting has the makings of another good ding dong
i built two pole barns almost 30 years ago did  not involve planning or structural engineers all the work was done with myself and Lillian it was electric poles i used they are still standing today even with the snow loading that we had two winters ago when steel structures buckled under the loading
it is your shed you build it the way you want to but why ask for comments  or post what you are doing and then deride those perfectly valid comments
henchard is wrong in his statement building regs do apply to agric sheds try claiming insurance for a shed that does not comply with building regulations  they are changing shortly to industrial spec if having them erected or supplying a kit
and it was not a once in 500 year weather event
water supplies have to be a certain depth to prevent freezing that only changed in the early sixty's because whole community's were without water now it is accepted practise
wind loading is another aspect that instead of being rare is now more commonplace
your timber uprights are they down the 2 meters and encased in concrete or just sitting  on the concrete plinth above ground  :farmer:

old ploughman

  • Joined Jun 2010
Re: Building a Wooden Barn
« Reply #13 on: April 09, 2012, 08:51:02 am »
Henchard - good telegraph poles take some beating for what you require - and about the best source of good long timber to give you plenty of height. Are you cladding it around - it is amazing how much strength (bracing) the sheeting has when screwed on. Best of luck - crack on, use your loaf and you will have the shed up whilst those around are still debating whether it complies with the latest reg on heat loss or whatever - probably still be standing long after we are all gone! Cant count he number of sheds over 100 years old I have seen where steel bracing or a concrete surround has been built around the bottom of a wooden post that has rotted through but shed still perfectly serviceable.

old ploughman

  • Joined Jun 2010
Re: Building a Wooden Barn
« Reply #14 on: April 09, 2012, 09:19:15 am »
Have just taken time to look at your blog and now realise that your timber pillars are resting on concrete plinths so cant see an issue - yearly coat of bitumen around the bottom? (the timber pillar not yours).

I like the blog - lovely area - used to spend far too much time in the White Hart at Llandeilo when Fred was in charge and the rest of my time next door with Ieuan Evans and his family (farm machinery dealers).

Having read some of your posts (especially B&Q), I think they may have picked on the wrong bloke to be pedantic about your design - had a good laugh  ;D

 

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