Author Topic: Schmallenberg virus detected in eastern England  (Read 31795 times)

SallyintNorth

  • Joined Feb 2011
  • Cornwall
  • Rarely short of an opinion but I mean well
    • Trelay Cohousing Community
Re: Schmallenberg virus detected in eastern England
« Reply #45 on: September 21, 2012, 05:15:43 pm »
I notice that there is a case reported in Leicestershire - so its coming northwards, and still a few weeks of midgy season to go.  I wonder if we should delay tupping this year?

All things being equal, it'd be better to let the midgie season finish, or be sure your sheep have had their dose of SMV, before tupping, I agree.
Don't listen to the money men - they know the price of everything and the value of nothing

Live in a cohousing community with small farm for our own use.  Dairy cows (rearing their own calves for beef), pigs, sheep for meat and fleece, ducks and hens for eggs, veg and fruit growing

Foobar

  • Joined Mar 2012
  • South Wales

SallyintNorth

  • Joined Feb 2011
  • Cornwall
  • Rarely short of an opinion but I mean well
    • Trelay Cohousing Community
Re: Schmallenberg virus detected in eastern England
« Reply #47 on: September 25, 2012, 02:18:22 pm »
I've been hearing stories about its being far more widespread earlier this year than was reported; farmers initially unsure about deformities and strange lambs, and then, once they realised what they had, deciding to keep mum...

If we'd had a better summer you could have felt confident all your sheep would have been infected and become immune by now.  As it is...  :-\

And I still worry enormously about cattle - the dairy fellas are saying 'oh well, a few dead calves, not the end of the world', but not realising that it could be far worse than just a dead calf getting dropped normally...
Don't listen to the money men - they know the price of everything and the value of nothing

Live in a cohousing community with small farm for our own use.  Dairy cows (rearing their own calves for beef), pigs, sheep for meat and fleece, ducks and hens for eggs, veg and fruit growing

Foobar

  • Joined Mar 2012
  • South Wales
Re: Schmallenberg virus detected in eastern England
« Reply #48 on: September 25, 2012, 02:35:30 pm »
Yeah I agree.  I bet deformed lambs were found in Wales this spring and folks have kept mum.


Midges are out in force here in south wales, and have been for several weeks now, at least when it's not raining anyway :).

earlybird

  • Joined Jun 2012
Re: Schmallenberg virus detected in eastern England
« Reply #49 on: September 25, 2012, 09:04:07 pm »
newbie sounding dumb here, but what is a dose of smv

Small Farmer

  • Joined Jan 2012
  • Bedfordshire
Re: Schmallenberg virus detected in eastern England
« Reply #50 on: September 25, 2012, 10:38:09 pm »
http://www.defra.gov.uk/animal-diseases/a-z/schmallenberg-virus/


virus first spotted in German town of the same name and carried by midges.  Came across autumn 2011 but nobody knew what it was and neither sheep nor cattle saw any actual illness until lambs with deformities started popping up first in places like fenland where the midges crossed.  Then appeared in lots of other counties with those affected losing up to 15%.  Most lambs could not be born naturally.  I think none survived.


No known cure or treatment yet, I think, but someone will correct me.


I'm tupping late, real late in case
Being certain just means you haven't got all the facts

Small Farmer

  • Joined Jan 2012
  • Bedfordshire
Re: Schmallenberg virus detected in eastern England
« Reply #51 on: November 03, 2012, 12:57:40 pm »
from the NSA


Schmallenberg found in Northern Ireland and Ireland.
[/size]A malformed calf born in County Down, Northern Ireland, was confirmed yesterday (1stNovember) as the first Schmallenberg case in Northern Ireland, just a day after confirmation of the virus in County Cork in the Republic of Ireland. This confirms very wide distribution of the disease-carrying midges, but the small number of clinical cases and birth deformities means Defra, Welsh Government, Scottish Government and DARD all still consider SBV to be a ‘low impact’ disease. We sincerely hope this lambing season continues to prove that to be the case, and in the meantime the advice continues to be to contact your vet if you have any concerns.[/color]
Being certain just means you haven't got all the facts

colliewoman

  • Joined Jul 2011
  • Pilton
  • Caution! May spontaneously talk rabbits!
Re: Schmallenberg virus detected in eastern England
« Reply #52 on: November 03, 2012, 03:22:22 pm »
How are the vets taking this I wonder?
Most people I have talked to tell me that when they queried odd lambs etc the vet said over the 'phone that is wasn't SBV??
I had a stillborn goat kid, ENORMOUS with long twisted teeth and my vet simply said it wasn't that (on the 'phone).
I would have prefered to have paid for a test to be sure.  ???
We'll turn the dust to soil,
Turn the rust of hate back into passion.
It's not water into wine
But it's here, and it's happening.
Massive,
but passive.


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kanisha

  • Joined Dec 2007
    • Spered Breizh Ouessants
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Re: Schmallenberg virus detected in eastern England
« Reply #53 on: November 03, 2012, 03:44:37 pm »
I would be interested to know what they are testing for when they test? active virus?  antibodies? Presumably if the foetus was infected in utero at an early stage of pregnancy then there is no active virus and the antibody level could be the same whether the foetus was affected or not? Ie is there a presumption that if antibodies are found this is indicative of SBV irrespective of  any other finding?

Having had SBV declared late last spring in this region what would testing achieve?


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colliewoman

  • Joined Jul 2011
  • Pilton
  • Caution! May spontaneously talk rabbits!
Re: Schmallenberg virus detected in eastern England
« Reply #54 on: November 03, 2012, 04:11:57 pm »
For me, If I could be sure that my guys were hit last breeding season then I would not need to worry this year as i have been led to believe once they have had it they are immune.
As it stands I am waiting to put the tup in and send the nannies away till the midgies have gone.
We'll turn the dust to soil,
Turn the rust of hate back into passion.
It's not water into wine
But it's here, and it's happening.
Massive,
but passive.


Bring the peace back

kanisha

  • Joined Dec 2007
    • Spered Breizh Ouessants
    • Facebook
Re: Schmallenberg virus detected in eastern England
« Reply #55 on: November 03, 2012, 04:35:22 pm »
hmmm I had one aborted foetus ( deformed) tested last year - the second with the same deformity the test result was negative all my vet said was depends what they were testing for...... I am none the wiser as to whether my flock has developed protection or not
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colliewoman

  • Joined Jul 2011
  • Pilton
  • Caution! May spontaneously talk rabbits!
Re: Schmallenberg virus detected in eastern England
« Reply #56 on: November 03, 2012, 04:41:02 pm »
 ??? ??? ???  oh thats horrible, I hate not knowing
That scuppers my idea then though if they cannot tell, if only there was a 100% reliable test.
But having said that, I would only find something else to worry over :-[
 
We'll turn the dust to soil,
Turn the rust of hate back into passion.
It's not water into wine
But it's here, and it's happening.
Massive,
but passive.


Bring the peace back

oaklandspigs

  • Joined Nov 2009
  • East Sussex
    • OaklandsPigs
Re: Schmallenberg virus detected in eastern England
« Reply #57 on: November 03, 2012, 05:40:34 pm »
We on the south east went through this last year, I have dug out my notes from the sessions we attended then.  We went to a further update for the South East a couple of months ago, and essdentially all that had changed was that they said that a ewe getting the viruis during the first half of pregnancy could risk her lambs being funny.
 
Otherwise this is last January's update in the South East:
 
"Key points from the meeting I went to run by Westpoint Vets with ADAS and the NFU
In the audience of 100 or so, of the 6 farmers that had started lambing 5 had deformed lambs. Rate was 5-15%.
There is a large amount of re-absorbsion from data from those that scanned – singles coming up empty, and twins only having singles – anything up to 10%
Lambs born can be stillborn, can be deformed with locked joints making it very hard for the sheep to lamb – one person said she was regularly breaking lamb legs inside the sheep to get out dead deformed lambs so as to save the sheep.
There are also what are called “silly lambs” – born live but with little brain development, so die quite quickly.
All you can do for this year’s lamb crop is cope.
As for future, all the following needs a big caveat – this is an early disease, with little history, however bluetongue spread (also by midges) gives us good data from past, and some of Europe is months ahead of us in lamb cycles so have been through it.  There is also excellent cross European co-operation and information sharing.
However the following is best guestimates from informed sources.  So likely to be true, but not guaranteed!
For sheep, once infected they show no signs of illness, but have it for a couple of weeks.  They then have developed strong immunity to it (potentially life long!).  So once a sheep has had it, it should be ok.
For cattle, they show lots of symptoms that are common with other diseases, but similarly they then have developed strong immunity to it, and should the  be ok.
The issue is IF they get infected or have the virus during the first trimester of pregnancy [now the first half].  Before mating or after the first trimester [now half] and the offspring is not affected. (don’t know whether the young inherit the immunity, but if meat doesn’t matter, and for future breeding as long as they get it before mating, then they’ll be ok.
Midges are the likely source of infection, and this is borne out by Defra’s modelling of midge vs. Wind and temperature that shows most danger area is where we are seeing the virus.  Midges are active only at certain temperatures, and the likely period when they can affect is march to October, although that doesn’t mean you can relax on November the 1st!! [wording for south east]
Parasite control of the flock/herd may reduce spread, but standard fly protection products don’t do midges, you need spot-on.  However you are too late to help this year and see below may positively want to welcome it now, so consider this before using spot-on.  If you use spot-on on a sheep, then it will kill the midge that bites it, but not before it has infected the sheep, and probably not before it has infected several others of your flock – the poison takes up to a hour or so to work,  so at best you might reduce, but would not protect.
A vaccine is 1-2 years away, and probably won’t be needed as by the time it gets here, all sheep and cattle should have got it (and got over it).
If you are in the south then your strategy is that for this seasons lambing, you will have what you have got now, so cannot do anything about it.  If it proves that once infected you get a long period of immunity, and for sheep there are no side effects, then maybe you should hope that all your sheep get infected during this summer, and then they’ll have protection and next year you’ll be ok, as protected sheep don’t produce deformed/stillborn/silly lambs.
For cattle in the south, the same strategy might apply, hope that they get it, that you don;t get too bad symptoms (eg milk reduction) which only lasts for two weeks in any case, and they get immunity for next year.
Those in the south will also need to consider whether they should buy in stock from the north, that will be naive to the disease (not have had it), and whether to do this earlier so that they might/should get the disease before going to ram/bull or AI.
For those outside the immediate area infected this year, it will depend on how quickly midges spread up north from infected south.  If slowly, then you might get several years of uncertainty (there is no live test at the moment to see if stock has had it) as to whether your particular area has got it/your farm has  got it.  I did ask about deliberately infecting stock so that they get it and get over it – and this might be a possibility  if vaccine doesn’t get here soon.
So that’s what I learnt.  In a way you should hope that all the UK gets it this summer, and then with a long immunity the worry will disappear, although we might be vaccinating future breeding stock in their first lambing/calving season to give their young protection.  "
 
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SallyintNorth

  • Joined Feb 2011
  • Cornwall
  • Rarely short of an opinion but I mean well
    • Trelay Cohousing Community
Re: Schmallenberg virus detected in eastern England
« Reply #58 on: November 04, 2012, 02:31:22 pm »
Oaklands, thanks so much for updating this for us.  Very little information is forthcoming up here, so it's really helpful to see so much detailed analysis from an area that's been through it once.

For the first time this year, I am maybe very pleased that we had such a cold, lousy, wet summer...  :cold: :gloomy: :raining:
Don't listen to the money men - they know the price of everything and the value of nothing

Live in a cohousing community with small farm for our own use.  Dairy cows (rearing their own calves for beef), pigs, sheep for meat and fleece, ducks and hens for eggs, veg and fruit growing

Small Farmer

  • Joined Jan 2012
  • Bedfordshire
Re: Schmallenberg virus detected in eastern England
« Reply #59 on: November 04, 2012, 03:12:10 pm »
I think the only person on the forum to have suffered from it is Tilly. 


I've a friend farming in Fakenham, also Norfolk, who reckons about 5% of his calves had it.  The affected calves were OK at birth but their legs folded up within 24 hours and they couldn't walk.  He's hoping that his cows have immunity this year.


We put our tup in last weekend so that we lamb late. 
Being certain just means you haven't got all the facts

 

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