[little blue]

I have  a goat with a ripped ear, will photo for you a.s.a.p ......
and happily add my support to a campaign for a better system, especially for the smaller goat herd

[Roxy]

I too have a little alpine female, whose ear has been ripped all the way down, and some of the large castrated boys have suffered less serious damage when their tag got caught up.   I am always reluctant to tag the goat kids until I have to ....usually when they are sold.  There is no way I can get another tag in the females ear, and I have no intention of doing so.

I have always thought that tags and goats do not mix - anyone with goats knows what they are like, and the places they stick their heads.

If the law on this can be changed I would be very happy indeed!!

[tizaala]

A vet friend once demonstrated to us with a couple of microchips and a reader, that if you place two chips side by side you get a different reading, turn one of them through 180 degs. and you get another reading, lay one at 90 degs across the other and you get a totaly different reading , also chips can be regected through the insertion hole before it heals properly , we had this happen with our dog. also chips can be snapped in two under the skin making them unreadable. so the whole issue is open to abuse.

[Antz]

Will take some pics for you, we have some quite badly damaged ears, do you want sheep as well or just goats.

[wytsend]

Just goats please.

Tizaala:  appreciate where you are coming from... chips have been used on horses for many years successfully and it is envisaged the success rate in goats will be as good,  the proposed area to insert is less likely to reject than others.

[wytsend]

Need more pics as soon as possible please..... there are hundreds of goats with ripped ears.

Come on guys... even healed up ears are good !!

[chickenfeed]

mum has been on a trading standards for years re tags only the other week at a show a kid got its tag caught in a hay rack all hell broke loose in the tent until it was sorted, the public were left quite upset.i now wish we had photo's or video of the trauma caused but in blind panic no one thought to do anything other than help the goat out.

the old ear tattoo system worked for years until the powers that be (and have no understanding of livestock) came up with this system. bring back the tattoo's easy to apply and read with no chance of ear damage.

[little blue]

I'm trying Wytsend - the bloomin' goat just won't stand still!!

[robert waddell]

if the public were to be informed of the potential dangers     and you had them on your side       the powers that be would have to take notice and change for the better

[Brucklay]

Wytsend Did you get my email, last friday? Coles ripped ear - thank you

[wytsend]

Brucklay:  yes I did thanks very much for that.

Robert:  Unfortunately sheep & goats have been lumped together & it is an EU directive to tag.  Defra fought about the ruling but had to back down.

Now apparently if sufficient evidence can show how detrimental tagging is to the Welfare of the animals concerned... there is a possibility of talks being started again.  I believe the intention is to harp on welfare because permanent ID can be done in alternative ways... certainly more 'permanent'  than the current system which is being abused right left and centre.

[woollyval]

Its funny eh that a person can be prosecuted and banned from keeping a dog for putting a stud in its ear (like an earing) but sheep and goats have to undergo this mutilation! Believe me sheep suffer just as much as goats in this situation, I have a lamb with its ear ripped in 2......

The old goat tattooing system was fail safe as the tat could never be changed or fiddled with, identities were for life and the tattoo caused little stress. The problem with chips apparently is that if inserted under the skin they 'could' migrate to other areas of the body and be eaten by someone .....however surely a scanner in every abattoir would mitigate this?
Of course we all know dont we that livestock have no feelings....unlike dogs

[Anke]

As far as I know the tattoo in one ear and tag in the other is legal for goats, the problem is that the higher cost of tattooing equipment is difficult to justify for the standard small-herd goat keeper. I am starting to look into this, as I am more worried that goat ID's can be changed to so easily with tags... If I had more local goatkeepers around it would be a good piece of kit to share (with proper disinfection obviously).

However mine have so far not ripped any of their tags out or damaged their ears (the ones I tagged with SET tags that is), even though their heads still go through the fence... all the sheep have theirs still too! But I don't tag my lambs until they are all at least 6 months old.

The problem with microchipping is that goats are classified as meat that is eaten, so I think that would make it quite difficult to argue that they are safe? (and it would also be another vet job that needs to be paid for). Microchip to go into the tail?

[little blue]

sent.

[colliewoman]

hey there! i'm a new member and joined so i could partake in this particular discussion (though i dare say i'll hang around!)
one of my goats ripped her tag lengthwise today in a fit of rage i phoned animal health and aske how the hell i was supposed to retag when there was nothing left to retag into.
was told not to worry, i asked if i could put the replacement tag on her collar and he said he didnt see why not as it was only for id purposes
then i asked if i could id chip instead of ear tagging as none of my goats will ever be going into the food chain, he looked on his pooter and he said he saw no reason why not. i asked how sure he was and he said sure enough that if anyone came round and said i was breaking the rules to give them his name!
will post pics tomorrow, let me know if i can do anything to help. i think it will only be a problem id chipping animals that could end up in the food chain.
either that or the animal health bloke i spoke to was rubbish!

cheers
donna