[Harripix]

Hi everyone, nice to make your aquantaince, I hope I'm posting this in the right section.

So I'll cut a long story short, after the death of my father a couple of years back my brothers and I have become true accidental smallholders in North Wales. The house is in the middle of farmland with just a narrow lane leading up to it, so parking space is at a premium, and my parents have always used space by a gateway just below the house as an additional parking spot. Recently the neighbour has become very hostile to us using this gateway as it gets in the way of moving sheep, which I completely understand. This might happen half a dozen times a year and unfortunately neither the land owner nor the farm hand that looks after the sheep feel that it's acceptable to occasionally have to ask or forewarn us to move the car, which we would have no problem in doing.

What are our rights in this situation? I truly want to open a positive dialogue with our neighbour but his threatening behaviour is worrying, so any advice would be very much appreciated. Cheers in advance!

[Anke]

I would have thought you have no right to park in front of a farm gate on someone else's land. If the field has livestock in it, there needs to be 24/7 access for emergencies etc, so I can understand that the farmer doesn't want to entertain it at all.


If you need additional car parking space any chance you can carve it out of your land or garden, if necessary creating a new access (with all the planning etc that this may involve)?


Around here lots of people in the (estate/farm) cottages which often are right next to the road just park in one lane of the road, or on the verge right close up to the house, so these problems are common - after all many of them were built before cars were common...


Sorry, probably not what you were hoping for.

[Fleecewife]

I think this is a situation where you will save time, money and aggro if you go directly to your solicitor, or whoever holds your land deeds, to find out what the law states in your particular position. I imagine your parents would have had 'grandfather rights' to park where they did, but I don't think those are heritable. With more cars on the go, the neighbour/landowner could have been ok with one car parked there, but not several. In all probability you will end up as Anke says, turning a piece of your own land into parking spaces. An unsatisfactory alternative could be to park by the road, unless you have a long driveway. You don't mention if the track to your house is tarmac or dirt, or who it belongs to.  Do you have only a right of access to get to your house?


By finding out the legal position specific to you, you will avoid an unpleasant situation where you feel bullied and your neighbour feels hard done by: whatever the law says, then both of you have to comply, and it becomes less personal.  Fights over land boundaries , rights and access date back into the mists of time 

[arobwk]

Yes, [member=212484]Harripix[/member] do find out what the deeds say about your rights of access over the lane. 
I have to say though that I have often been in the situation of your farming neighbour in not being able to access or sometimes exit unhindered from my fields due to horse-keepers across the road using my access lane to park their cars.  So I have some sympathy for your neighbour farmer if their field gate is now being blocked more frequently. 
What I have found most annoying is that I have had to go find the folk in their rented fields across the road (to get them to move their vehicles for my access or exit) and I cannot remember one of them ever apologising - instead they spoke and acted like I was the bad guy (when all I was asking for was unhindered access to my private lane and land whenever I needed!). 
After checking your deeds and rights of passage over the lane maybe, I would suggest you create more parking space at the small-holding whatever your rights!

[SallyintNorth]

Ask the farmer if you can buy a bit of land next to the house for additional parking. 

[chrismahon]

Creating a proper parking area is the way to go and it will improve the saleability of the property. I wouldn't bother with the legal aspect as the solicitor may not know and refer it to a barrister- all wasted money. You certainly won't be able to prove you have acquired parking rights in front of a farm gate and you could spend a fortune trying.

[arobwk]

[After-thought] Further to my last [member=212484]Harripix[/member]:  if one cannot create additional parking space at your small-holding why not negotiate with farmer neighbour agreement to park any additional vehicle/s inside their field, i.e. on the other side of their field gate in a way that does not obstruct the gate.)

[Harripix]

Thanks for the replies everyone. I see a little more of my neighbour's position from what you're saying, although he uses the gate very infrequently he sees it as his right to have access, and although we've been parking there for the past 40 years he has obviously started to worry more about it recently. To be frank I've been trying my upmost to not be drawn into an emotional conflict with this man as he isn't the most patient and is quick to throw the first stone, so I'm glad I've come to you guys that can see things from outside, I very much appreciate it.

[SallyintNorth]

A lot of farmers see themselves like this.  "A farmer : someone who is losing money working 100 hours a week to feed people who think you are trying to kill them." 

Everyone wants to tell us how to farm, how to look after the land and the livestock.  To get cross at us if we impede their journey as we move our sheep.  To think it their right to let their dog run free in our fields.  To expect us to drop everything and come and talk to them over the fence while the sheep and the dog wait (as the sun rises in the sky to make it too hot to work the sheep...)   And it is all so, so wearing. 

Most farmers start work before 7.30am and don't finish before 7pm.  7 days a week, although some may manage to have a bit of time to watch a football match on a Sunday afternoon in the season.  And that' just on ordinary days.  Lambing time it's 16 hours a day straight for 3 solid weeks - minimum.  The average wage - income over expenses - for a small family farm is £8,000 per annum.  The majority of small family farms need an off-farm income to keep afloat; the farmer may spend many days working on someone else's farm before coming home to work his own.  Farmers often don't take holidays at all; a day out at the local agricultural show may be the only family outing all year.

So yes, some of us can see why your neighbouring farmer "sees it as his right to have access" to his own fields.  However infrequently he may need that access.  And isn't willing to have to include asking you to move your car off land you don't own or pay for when making his plans for the next day.