Author Topic: What to fertilize grass with?  (Read 7807 times)

artscott

  • Joined Nov 2011
  • Methlick, Aberdeenshire
What to fertilize grass with?
« on: March 27, 2014, 09:10:04 am »
We are still in the process of renovating the grass at our croft, first year we just continually cut the weeds, last year our black welsh mountain sheep did an excellent job of eating everything down.  There are still a few bare(ish)patches and I have knocked up a harrow type thing to rake over the grass and I will then broadcast some seed with added clover to try and increase the coverage.

On thing I haven’t done is look at fertilizer.  The sheep would have spread some via their dung last summer but this will not be any addition of nutrients as they were eating the grass in the first place.  Parts of our field are where our septic tank soaks away and these are obviously much more green and lush compared with the rest of the field.  What sort of fertilizing do you all use and is it cost effective in both money, time and the environment.

Just to clarify, our grass is for grazing my small number of sheep and we don’t have any agricultural machinery other than a lawn tractor .

midtown

  • Joined Oct 2013
  • English Lake District
Re: What to fertilize grass with?
« Reply #1 on: March 27, 2014, 10:14:46 am »
First stage would be to do a soil test in order to establish where the deficiencies lie, and subsequently what  is required.
A good interim measure would be to see if there is a local farmer who could apply a liberal application of slurry when conditions are right.
Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so.  ~Douglas Adams

FiB

  • Joined Sep 2011
  • Bala, North Wales
    • Facebook
Re: What to fertilize grass with?
« Reply #2 on: March 27, 2014, 11:31:15 am »
And from what I have been learning in the last 3 years, it depends what your goals are......  I felt pressured by neighbours advice to artificially fertilise for the first year, but have since come to think that the advice came from a modern commercial farming perspective ( of sucking the maximum ££££££ you can off every acre, so max heads of sheep, max hay/forage).  But it cost a fortune and certainly didn't repay for us.... AND it encouraged the coarse rye grasses.  So last year we didn't, and the hay crop was thinner but more diverse and sweet smelling (I know there were other variables...).  I am also now actively managing to encourage wildflowers and diversity, which means allowing the soil fertility to dip.  A permaculture friend has suggested it is not necessary to fertilise at all if you are just low density grazing sheep (not taking off hay crop)and have enough land to rotate and rest...  We are planning to trade a middle ground and rotate the fields in terms of taking of a hay crop, and have some muck spread every few years.  We also are liming  a bit.  We havnt had our soil tested, but surrounding farmers have and they lime.  We have a pretty good covering of white clover so if we can look after that (by not over fertilising) that should help with the nitrogen.  It's a big subject and the above could be quite wrong, but it's my current 'understanding' and plan!

Rosemary

  • Joined Oct 2007
  • Barry, Angus, Scotland
    • The Accidental Smallholder
Re: What to fertilize grass with?
« Reply #3 on: March 27, 2014, 04:29:34 pm »
I'd say soil test first - for pH, phosphate (P) and potassium (K) levels.

Grass needs pH 6.5 ideally to grow - if it's way lower than that (acidic), an application of lime will help to recitfy that. The soil test will tell you how much is required and generally, you can get a local contractor to apply it - it can be done at any time of the year (ground conditions permitting, of course).

Grass growth will also be adversely affected if there isn't enough P &K available. Animal dung is high in potash (phosphate). These can be applied as straights ie individually or as a P&K combined fertiliser depending on what you need.

Commercial farmers will often apply bagged nitrogen to encourage grass growth - this can be straight N or an NPK combination. This needs to be applied when the grass is actively growing or it will be washed away. Clover fixes nitrogen from the atmosphere and makes it available to grass, so you can get a good N fix if you have a good clover sward. Applying bagged nitrogen will reduce the clover in a sward because it allows the grass to outcompete the clover. Grass from bagged N is usually soft and lush ie not good for hairy native ponies  ::)

You can also have a full soil test that does all the micronutrients as well - we had one done the first year we were here. The only one significant for grass production was sulphur, which we did have applied. The other deficiencies had implications for animal health but we decided to put the minerals straight into the animals via mineral licks rather han put them on the soil, where (on our very sand soil) they'd be quickly leached away.

Some information on here http://www.accidentalsmallholder.net/smallholding/grassland-management/

midtown

  • Joined Oct 2013
  • English Lake District
Re: What to fertilize grass with?
« Reply #4 on: March 28, 2014, 09:44:33 am »
Good words Rosemary :thumbsup:.

Be it 5 or 500 acres, without soil tests the landowner will never know for sure what may be missing, with the point you make about micronutrient requirements being especially valid.
Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so.  ~Douglas Adams

SallyintNorth

  • Joined Feb 2011
  • Cornwall
  • Rarely short of an opinion but I mean well
    • Trelay Cohousing Community
Re: What to fertilize grass with?
« Reply #5 on: March 28, 2014, 09:50:28 am »
The other thing about using too much 'artificial' (as they call it around here) is that the grass it promotes can be too fragile for hay.  Hereabouts we have to work our hay hard in order to dry it, and a bright green sward pretty much crumbles to dust under that treatment.

You probably have much better hay-making weather than us so may not need to turn it more than once or twice, in which case it would be less of a problem.

You'll probably do much better with re-seeding (have you thought about doing some aerating first?) as you are doing, and an occasional load of FYM from a helpful neighbouring farmer with a muck spreader ;)

The other thing to think about is inputs and outputs.  If you are taking nutrients out of the equation you need to put them back.  So if you take a hay crop off, you remove nutrients (in the grass) and need to replace them.  But of you only graze it, the grazing animals are putting back pretty much what they take out in their dung ;), so it won't need a lot of topping up, certainly not every year.

BH does use artificial, but tiny amounts and not every year, and generally only on areas that we take a hay crop (or silage) from.
Don't listen to the money men - they know the price of everything and the value of nothing

Live in a cohousing community with small farm for our own use.  Dairy cows (rearing their own calves for beef), pigs, sheep for meat and fleece, ducks and hens for eggs, veg and fruit growing

dgr

  • Joined Mar 2014
Re: What to fertilize grass with?
« Reply #6 on: March 28, 2014, 07:41:24 pm »
something for you to consider is calcified seaweed granules its a natural organic product that balances pH and puts trace elements back in the ground which pass on to the livestock grassing it. Also you can keep the animals in the field after you spread it. Buttercups tend to spread like mad in acidic ground and are a good indication that pH levels are low this usually happens after very wet winters or crops of hay the year before

devonlad

  • Joined Nov 2012
  • Nr Crediton in Devon
Re: What to fertilize grass with?
« Reply #7 on: March 28, 2014, 08:00:25 pm »
everything said so far is spot on. the importance of getting ph right before anything else is key. plants ability to access "free ! nutrients contained in the soil  improves hugely if you can get the pH up to 6-6.5. start with a soil test which should reduce the need for expensive and potentially unnecessary fert use. not sure where you are but my advice is do a proper one thru a local ag merchants- including not only ph P K mag etc  but all the trace elements. the little bit extra per field is worth it to get a clear picture of the true nutritional value and growth potential of any field. the sure I'm not the only one who can help but I produce fertiliser/soil conditioner plans as a day job so happy to give some pointers based on soil results.

artscott

  • Joined Nov 2011
  • Methlick, Aberdeenshire
Re: What to fertilize grass with?
« Reply #8 on: March 28, 2014, 11:09:54 pm »
Thank you all for the advice so far.  I will get the soil tested as advised, i believe it will probably be acidic the water from our well is low PH.
We are in Aberdeenshire, near Methlick, soil is pretty good, and not too wet as we are on the side of a hill.  Soil shouldn't be compacted as it was abandoned to the weeds for a number of years before we moved in.
We don't want supper lush grass as I have welsh mountain sheep and it wouldn't be suitable for them.  I don't want to take hay as with the stocking level we can rotate sheep for most of the winter and just buy a couple of big bales to see them though to spring.

AndynJ

  • Joined Sep 2010
  • uk
  • Says it as it is. don't like it don't look
Re: What to fertilize grass with?
« Reply #9 on: March 29, 2014, 05:49:01 am »
If by soakaway grass is much greener, why not just pump a little water only ish from septic tank to not so green areas ??

SallyintNorth

  • Joined Feb 2011
  • Cornwall
  • Rarely short of an opinion but I mean well
    • Trelay Cohousing Community
Re: What to fertilize grass with?
« Reply #10 on: March 29, 2014, 08:52:49 am »
Green isn't always good ;)   On the moorland farm we had a field called Sink Pits, because the ancient cess pit system caused boggy bits that looked firm and grassy but really weren't  :o.  (The next field down could be worse in bad weather, and was called Sink Pits Bottom after I sank in it up to that region!  :D)

The grass around these boggy bits was lush and dark green.  And the sheep avoided it ;)
Don't listen to the money men - they know the price of everything and the value of nothing

Live in a cohousing community with small farm for our own use.  Dairy cows (rearing their own calves for beef), pigs, sheep for meat and fleece, ducks and hens for eggs, veg and fruit growing

shygirl

  • Joined May 2013
Re: What to fertilize grass with?
« Reply #11 on: March 29, 2014, 04:03:03 pm »
have you considered the Ley? usually farmers plant a type of grass/ley that has a lifespan. ie (a bit like a hybrid hen - lol) where as it will give highly nutritious grass for, say 2, 5 , 10 yrs and then needs replacing.
permanent pasture is a different as that is designed to last a very long time.
our land has a lot of wild grass that has self-seeded and whilst we can let our native ponies freerange without a hint of laminitis, our sheep were never very fat. hybrid sheep especially slim.
if the grass is ending its lifespan then fertilising may be a waste of money.
you can spray the grass with weedkiller and reseed totally - or get someone with a seed drill and reseed through the existing pasture.
a sign of nettles and docks indicates good soil. buttercups means too acidic.

 

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