[nic99]

Hi, I was hoping someone could help me with the scottish rules and regs for keeping pet kune kune pigs.

I have applied for my CPH number, although this will technically be a landless keeper's number as the estate maps are out of date and don't show our land as belonging to us. Will this pose a problem?

The SGRIP (the people I applied for the CPH number from) have told me that they will inform animal health and the local authority (by which I assume they mean the local council) that we will be keeping pet pigs. I assume that means they will then send me a herd number without me having to apply for it myself?

However they have also said that it is then up to me to inform the authorities that I am keeping pigs at any given location. I am very confused by this. Is it because a landless keeper's number doesn't specify what land?

They also told me that I need confirmation from trading standards that I am eligible to keep pigs before I am allowed to purchase them. I cannot find anything relating to this in the info I can find online. How do I do this?

Please help, I am so confused!

Nicola

[lachlanandmarcus]

i would contact animal health once you know the CPH number and advise them of the pigs. They will issue a herd number, often over the phone with written confirmation following. Dont rely on the SGRIP getting you the herd no, as there are a lot of CPHs without herds attached, they will p[rob just advise the CPH no and thats it.

You will need a herd no for each species of farm animal you keep (sheep, goats,cattle, pigs etc) but often they will allow you to have the same herd no across species, BUT you have to still advise them every time you start keeping or stop keeping one of the species (so they can start/stop sending you the relevant docs and for disease monitoring).

I dont quite understand the 'estate' maps bit, the CPH will be covering land which is identified using the latest Ordnance survey map, and they dont miss stuff out, far from it, even our high fence within a field is shown in the latest one! And ownership is not that relevant as you could have been a tenant farmer, they could still be the farmer and have the  CPH/herd no, so I dont think that matters so much, altho maybe it does when it comes to claiming subsidies and grants (we dont claim any so doesnt affect us)

Should add we are in Scotland too, currently only have sheep but did previously have cattle and sheep.

[EdayOrkney]

I would agree, I would get in touch with the Animal Health place myself, they're quite a laid back bunch and don't get stressed like the agricultural department do!  Its a very simple paperchain that they have to follow.  Never heard about the trading standards needing to be involved and we have kept pigs forever so will be interested to hear about that one.
You will need to keep records about when your pigs move onto your holding, bred, died, moved etc, but thats very simple. You don't have to be a crofter but the Scottish Crofting Federation have a croft record manual which had all the forms and information needed for not only pigs but cattle, sheep and in fact everything, excellent document and very helpful.  Might be worth getting in touch with them . http://www.crofting.org/index.php/publications/66
Hope that helps.

[robert waddell]

trading standards is your point of contact      movement licences are faxed/posted or hand delivered to them    they also inspect your records and should you be doing something wrong will advise you or inform further up the chain     defra issue the cph number       what part of Scotland are you from     DO NOT RELY ON OTHERS TO OBTAIN YOUR ESENTIAL INFORMATION AND PAPERWORK
if you have bought land or property recently the o/s maps go with that transaction (they are not accurate since they have been computerised i know of two instances where they are wrong the first had a verbal agreement that the boundary was inaccurate the second challenged o/s and had to get a surveyor out to do a gps map and delayed the sale by four months and several thousand pounds)
enjoy your pigs when you get them

[nic99]

Thanks for all your help. The problem with the land is that our house and garden are still registered with the SGRIP as part of the estate they used to belong to (which is a farm that just so happens to belong to my boyfriend's parents). Apparently this means we cannot be given our own CPH number but be granted a landless keeper's number instead in which we then get permission to keep our pigs on "their" land. This is what I was told by the SGRIP. I guess it could be possible that our land already has a CPH number belonging to the farm and so cannot be assigned a new one?

I have since received a further email from the SGRIP which has confused me even more and seems to contradict things I have read elsewhere. Am I right in thinking this guy doesn't actually know what he is talking about?

I am in North Fife but dealing with the Perth SGRIP office, as it is the closest one.

"Number one. You will not be given a herd or flock number for a landless keeper. The herd/flock number is related to the land and farm code. Animal health require to know where you are keeping livestock. They register both you as a keeper on a holding, and the occupier as well. The holding must be registered with them so that they can ensure that the land has a flock number. Not all holdings are registered.
Number two The Local Authority Trading Standards are basically responsible for all legislation pertaining to pigs. They should be your first port of call inn anything to do with keeping pig including movements and records. The acronym PRIMO covers pigs (Pig Record, Inspections and Movement Order)
Number 3 When you ask someone if you can keep pigs on their holding you need to know two things. What is the agricultural code number for the land you are going to use, and is that person registered with Animal Health."

[robert waddell]

from what you have said you want to do things right       that could be your first mistake        if the land is registered in your boyfriends parents name just use there cph number  end of problem 
you have approached the wrong dept   do as he advises and contact the local trading standards and start over again
i do not think his e mail is confussing but trying to help you
just to upset everybody not all employees in the paper chain know the rules and regulations inside out as we have found out and they do pass out some duff info  far to many instances to list and it always comes right in the end and is the learning curve that is pig keeping

[dizzy1pig]

animal health officer... for fife ..Estelle sessions...
I  got my cph number with no land of my own. is best if you have your own as all mail will be sent to you.
and there is another cph on the land as well.