[DenisCooper]

Evening all.

What a gorgeous day its been.

I don't know how many others, if any, feed organic food to their livestock but one of the main reasons i wanted to start my smallholding was to ensure i was getting the best quality produce.

When i started looking at organic feed i was quite upset to find how much more expensive the feed was, i could afford to feed my chickens an organic feed but the pigs and sheep would be a problem. That was until i found HiPeak organic feeds.

They have a wide selection of feeds for all livestock and its only a few pound more expensive than non organic, generally around £7 to £8 a bag of feed.

I just wanted to share this in case anyone else had found the same and was struggling to find feed.

PS: i don't work for them

[Mad Goatwoman of Madeley]

I've not heard of them. I always did give my goat organic until I started finding it harder and harder to source.

[DenisCooper]

I hadn't either, the ones that kept coming up on my searches where the small holdervrange and organic feed company. It took a good while for me to stumble past these.

[waterbuffalofarmer]

yea I have heard of them a few months back, I think it was? Problem is I keep too many animals for it to be cost effective, if you know what I mean. I did think of going organic myself  but the regs were way too strict, even still I follow an organic approach to my pasture and buy in as much gm free animal feed as is possible

[SallyintNorth]

yea I have heard of them a few months back, I think it was? Problem is I keep too many animals for it to be cost effective, if you know what I mean. I did think of going organic myself  but the regs were way too strict, even still I follow an organic approach to my pasture and buy in as much gm free animal feed as is possible

Can't let you get away with that, wbf.  You can't "follow an organic approach" and not feed organic feed!  You can, of course, farm in as environmentally-friendly way as possible, you can avoid the use of chemicals, and so on, but unless you're actually following all the rules and regs for organic, you really shouldn't use the term.

Sorry, off hobby horse now

[harmony]

yea I have heard of them a few months back, I think it was? Problem is I keep too many animals for it to be cost effective, if you know what I mean. I did think of going organic myself  but the regs were way too strict, even still I follow an organic approach to my pasture and buy in as much gm free animal feed as is possible

Can't let you get away with that, wbf.  You can't "follow an organic approach" and not feed organic feed!  You can, of course, farm in as environmentally-friendly way as possible, you can avoid the use of chemicals, and so on, but unless you're actually following all the rules and regs for organic, you really shouldn't use the term.

Sorry, off hobby horse now

Why can't someone follow "an organic approach" to one aspect of their farming practice? WBF was not saying her farm or animals were "organic" and certainly to advertise them as such would be incorrect and trading standards would have something to say. The OP could advertise his pigs are fed on organic food and it would be correct surely as long as the implication was not that his farm and stock were organic?

[SallyintNorth]

I think, to someone who is organic, you can no more be 'a little bit organic' than you can be a little bit pregnant.

Using the term to mean "I farm in an environmentally-sensitive manner" and/or "I use chemicals as little as possible" devalues the term for those who practice the approach in its entirety.  And, to a purist, cannot be correct.  An organic system is that - a system, you can't pick and choose bits to do and bits to not do, and still be organic.

[harmony]

I think, to someone who is organic, you can no more be 'a little bit organic' than you can be a little bit pregnant.

Using the term to mean "I farm in an environmentally-sensitive manner" and/or "I use chemicals as little as possible" devalues the term for those who practice the approach in its entirety.  And, to a purist, cannot be correct.  An organic system is that - a system, you can't pick and choose bits to do and bits to not do, and still be organic.

This is from the Soil Association who say organic means working with nature and I think an awful lot of farmers could claim that they do this too.

Must have access to pasture (when weather and ground conditions permit) and are truly free range.

• Must have plenty of space – which helps to reduce stress and disease.

• Are fed a diet that is as natural as possible and free from genetically modified organisms (GMOs). Over a million tonnes of GM crops are imported each year to feed the majority of non-organic livestock which produce chicken, eggs, pork, bacon, milk, cheese etc. This practice is banned under organic standards.

• Graze and forage naturally on organic pasture (grasses and other crops) where only natural fertilisers are used and pesticides are severely restricted.

• Cannot be given hormones which make them grow more quickly.

• Must not be produced from cloned animals.

• Must not routinely be given antibiotics. Farm animals now account for almost two-thirds of all antibiotics used in the EU. These are passed to us through the food chain

• 
  [/size]Now my interpretation of the above apart from not feeding GM food, giving growth hormones or to be produced from cloned animals, actually still gives organic farmers leeway to use pesticides and antibiotics. In fact aaprt from the actual certification plenty of people could practice all of the above quite easily. So, I see nothing wrong in what WBF said at all.
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  

[SallyintNorth]

Well, perhaps they've mellowed since I was last involved with organic agriculture, but they certainly used to take a very stern line with anyone using the term organic who wasn't doing it all.

There are things a knowledgeable consumer would know they could rely upon when buying certified Organic, which would not be true of uncertified produce.  Therefore the use of the term organic, when not certified, was deemed to be misleading.  However, I haven't been actively involved for nearly a decade, so maybe things have changed.  I doubt it, though, else why would people pay an arm and a leg for the certification?

[harmony]

Well, perhaps they've mellowed since I was last involved with organic agriculture, but they certainly used to take a very stern line with anyone using the term organic who wasn't doing it all.

There are things a knowledgeable consumer would know they could rely upon when buying certified Organic, which would not be true of uncertified produce.  Therefore the use of the term organic, when not certified, was deemed to be misleading.  However, I haven't been actively involved for nearly a decade, so maybe things have changed.  I doubt it, though, else why would people pay an arm and a leg for the certification?

I quite agree that a stern line line should be taken with anyone who calls their product something it is not and fortunately no-one here has done that as far as I can see. I copied and pasted from the SA web site so you can make your mind up about how mellow or not they might have become.


Why do people pay an arm and a leg for certification? Well no doubt there are lots of reasons and the SA say organic farms have the highest standard of animal welfare than any other system of farming but I have seen organic farms and the standards were poor. You mentioned devaluing in an earlier post and surely a statement like that devalues anyone who is not organic certified?

[waterbuffalofarmer]

yea I have heard of them a few months back, I think it was? Problem is I keep too many animals for it to be cost effective, if you know what I mean. I did think of going organic myself  but the regs were way too strict, even still I follow an organic approach to my pasture and buy in as much gm free animal feed as is possible

Can't let you get away with that, wbf.  You can't "follow an organic approach" and not feed organic feed!  You can, of course, farm in as environmentally-friendly way as possible, you can avoid the use of chemicals, and so on, but unless you're actually following all the rules and regs for organic, you really shouldn't use the term.

Sorry, off hobby horse now

Why can't someone follow "an organic approach" to one aspect of their farming practice? WBF was not saying her farm or animals were "organic" and certainly to advertise them as such would be incorrect and trading standards would have something to say. The OP could advertise his pigs are fed on organic food and it would be correct surely as long as the implication was not that his farm and stock were organic?

You are very right @harmony thanks for that I don't use the term organic no, but I don't use chemicals or fertilizers on my land if I can help it, as it does ruin the ground and I want to be as natural as possible. Also it helps my animals immune systems to be all natural, you wonder whether that's why certain farms are prone to TB also, as well as badger population but lets not go into that, because of all the chemicals thrown into the pasture lowers good vitamin and mineral levels.  It's OK @SallyintNorth I was using the term to describe how I farm, in a sort of organic fashion, but I do not use the term organic in my products ever! I should really have used nature friendly. Question for another board why isn't nature friendly a label like organic?

[Mad Goatwoman of Madeley]

I garden organically, ie I follow all the guide lines but I could never call myself organic if I were to sell any fruit or veg because I am not registered with the Soil Association.


I would still like to feed my goats with organic food though so I could be sure it was GM free.

[devonlady]

I feed even my non-productive animals with organic feed. I also won't use pesticides, herbicides or artificial fertilizers on my land. The dear boy up the road didn't have time to top my fields, so I am swamped in thistles, all blowing their seeds across to my neighbours!!!

[Womble]

Why can't someone follow "an organic approach" to one aspect of their farming practice?

I follow a "vegetarian approach" with about 60% of my diet, and 100% of the food I've so far eaten today complies with vegetarian principles. See the problem?