[Penninehillbilly]

Hi,
My tup was in with tenants sheep, brought him back into 'my' fields (adjoining) on Jan 5th.
Didn't look right recently at weekend found he has what I presume is scab (googling suggests lice but he is doing the classic 'air nibbling.).
He is a very unhappy chap just now, taking him haylage and water, he's not following the others over to feeder.
Caught him and injected with Dectomax.
However then realised it is about 18 month since I started bottle. Been kept in filing cabinet in cool area. Bottle says use in 6 months.
Any advice please? Should I buy some new, or will there be a possibility of overdosing? Is there anything else available?
Very small scale, I only have 4 sheep,  I realise I will have to treat them as well now. 2 spring 2019 lambs not been mixing with adults, hopefully they will be OK Not to treat?
Sheep man seems to think Heptovac covers for scab! Unless OH got it wrong in passing message on!
I realise I will have to buy more to treat others, but should he be treated again?

[Me]

You will likely need a second dose of dectomax at least at the 14 day mark. I wouldn't consider using anything other than the cydectin 2% injectable and cross fingers as that might not work either. If he has scab and is that near you need to do the whole flock really.

Commonly, flock with scab also have lice.

[Penninehillbilly]

Thanks Me, do you mean leave it at least 14 days?
Is Cydectin the one you inject behind the ear and need training for?

[tommytink]

We had incidence of scab and lice end of last year. Believe it was both. Ours had a does of Zermex 2%, which I believe is the same product as Cydectin 2%, and it was injection at base of ear. Luckily the guy we got the sheep from did it for us (not so lucky as we believe they contracted it from his ram). It didn’t work anyway.

Here’s a link with useful info: https://www.nadis.org.uk/disease-a-z/sheep/sheep-scab/

Tells you about the injections etc.

We were told by someone in the business if they’re pulling at their wool it’s lice, and if they’re rubbing against fences etc it’s scab.

Either way you need to treat everything you have. I have two flocks and was convinced they hadn’t shared fence lines etc but the other flock started showing signs anyway. To remembered that I had pushed a feeder from one flock to another, but think it can also be transferred via yourself, as well as wildlife. So best do everything and have done with it.

[Penninehillbilly]

Thanks TT, keeping an eye on them at the moment, hopefully do them all at the w/e, tenant will help.
When tup got over, (tenant did fencing so he can't complain), we decided my 2 older sheep might as well go in as well, big mistake, now one has a nasty sore on the side of her mouth, I'm worrying about orf, never had it here. But he has read you need a certain number of sheep to make a living from them, and I think he is buying the rubbish at auctions, certainly the ones in my fields look past their best. I dread to think what else mine have picked up. Really cross (with myself as much as anything),
Maybe because he got a bit run down he is affected more, but ewes still seem OK regarding the scab.

[Me]

Someone in the business was talking shite then! If a fence could differentiate scab from lice we wouldn't need blood tests and microscopes!

[Me]

Sounds like you need a diagnosis, to treat all your sheep and the tenants and to make a biosecurity plan between you for the future

[Penninehillbilly]

Today he was grazing with the others, (was laying down a lot at the w/e) tonight he is back under the wall, put him haylage and a mix down, so he is eating OK. Gave me a bit of a threatening show of his horns when I put my hand towards him, which he didnt bother last night.
Hopefully that means he is feeling a bit happier. 

[Penninehillbilly]

We had incidence of scab and lice end of last year. Believe it was both. Ours had a does of Zermex 2%, which I believe is the same product as Cydectin 2%, and it was injection at base of ear. Luckily the guy we got the sheep from did it for us (not so lucky as we believe they contracted it from his ram). It didn’t work anyway.
.

The Zemex didn't work?  So what did you do then?

[Backinwellies]

you need current vet advice …. scab is on the increase and a real problem … and is becoming immune to injectables too I believe.    It is VERY contagious.   You need a vet diagnosis and direction on treatment.

[tommytink]

Someone in the business was talking shite then! If a fence could differentiate scab from lice we wouldn't need blood tests and microscopes!

They weren’t declaring it an exact science, I think it was more an observation based on what they’d experienced.

[tommytink]

We had incidence of scab and lice end of last year. Believe it was both. Ours had a does of Zermex 2%, which I believe is the same product as Cydectin 2%, and it was injection at base of ear. Luckily the guy we got the sheep from did it for us (not so lucky as we believe they contracted it from his ram). It didn’t work anyway.
.

The Zemex didn't work?  So what did you do then?

Well we got a sheep dip guy in. I always thought dipping wasn’t that common but where we are it seems it is routinely done each year.

I would say ours weren’t withdrawn or off colour in any way with it, just rubbing everywhere. I am sure someone can correct me but the guy who injected for us said it could take a few days to notice it making a difference. Would Dectomax be the same? I don’t know.

I think you need a hell of a lot of sheep to make a living! And you won’t make a living out of the cheapest animals at the auction. I came across someone that said they had “rescued” some cull ewes. Trouble is they’re cull ewes for a reason! Would agree with Me in that if that’s what they’re going to do you’d prob be best to try and up your biosecurity to protect your animals.

[Penninehillbilly]

Apparently (he has read/been told) you need 350 sheep to make a living from them, trouble is, you need the land and fences to support that many!. Ours is supposed to be his summer grazing, and they are still on, keeps saying he will take them off and then that my fields are the only fields that will keep them in. He should spend some money fencing instead of abusing friendships (seems to be OH bestie friend just now, perhaps he has his reasons for cultivating that friendship, ie free winter grazing).
Lucifer seems much better, came with the others for his supper tonight, and he's been grazing instead of laying about chewing at air.
Planning on double fencing that side, he can do it. I'm not very happy but he's the sort of bloke who is so nice to you you can't tell him you are angry with him ?.