[SallyintNorth]

We've a dwindling flock of mixed hybrid egglayers here, who've done us well but are due for replacement soon.

We'd like chickens to eat, too, but don't want to run two completely separate flocks (although we know we'd need to keep the table males in their own run from pre-puberty.)

We're a community of 20+ adults and 9 children, with a small farm we run ourselves, rearing livestock, milking our Jersey and growing veg.  We're always all very busy, so don't want to stretch ourselves too thin.

We need 20-25 hen eggs a day, are happy to buy extra eggs in winter when production is lower, and would probably eat a couple of cocks a week, at least, once we hit steady state.

We think our favoured two options are:

• Find a nice cockerel of a good-sized dual purpose breed, let him run with our girls and let nature take its course.  Buy eggs to make up the shortfall until the new generation kicks in.
• Clear out the current flock and buy a new flock of POLs of our chosen breed, with an unrelated cockerel.

Comments welcomed, particularly on your experiences with dual purpose breeds / egg-laying breeds whose cockerels are big enough to make a decent meal, and whose hens will make a good job of rearing. On the shortlist at the mo are Rhodies, Silver Dorkings, Light Sussex, Welsummer but we're open to suggestions of other breeds to look at.

It's entirely possible we'd get one breed to start off with, then after a couple of years a new cockerel of a different breed.  (One breeding programme I unwittingly participated in bred superb cockerels from Rhodie x LS, then x Silver Dorking.  But that was very small scale, and we got all cockerels in the last generation, so I've no idea how the hens would have performed! Lol)

[YorkshireLass]

Do chickens work like sheep (bear with me here!)?
As in, hens of a small, productive breed, and then a big ol' meaty cockerel? Anything you hatch, you eat, so replacement hens would have to be sourced elsewhere.


If purebreeds are better, for replacements etc, have you considered Barnevelders?

[SallyintNorth]

Have been reading about Barnvelders. Thanks for that idea.  Docile and pretty as well as medium-large dual purpose - sounds interesting. 

Anyone any experiences to share with this breed?  (Good and bad.). Not too docile / lazy?  (Had a couple of Buff Orpingtons. Cuddly and meaty. But so greedy and got so fat!)

[macgro7]

Do chickens work like sheep (bear with me here!)?
As in, hens of a small, productive breed, and then a big ol' meaty cockerel? Anything you hatch, you eat, so replacement hens would have to be sourced elsewhere.


If purebreeds are better, for replacements etc, have you considered Barnevelders?

Are bit different.
Cross breeds might prove to be more productive, I. E. Lay more eggs and grow faster than either of the parents.
Generally it is a good idea to cross your hens with something like dorking, bresse, Indian game or something similar.
Have a look at our other thread - the really long one in which we are mostly talking exactly about that - having a sustainable flock of home produced meat chickens - not the ugly Ross cobb broilers.
I'm hatching poulet de Barbezieux and hopefully la bresse to keep for meat plus eggs, as they are really good egg layers too. I also have muscovy ducks for meat.

[Eve]

We had an Ixworth boy in with Dorking girls. Neither of them pure breeds as we have the odd funny colour in their offspring.
We now keep their offspring: boys worth eating, girls fine for eggs, and importantly: the stud cockerel is friendly. Something worth considering with the number of kids at your farm.

[Charlie1234]

I.M.O. pure breeds for eating are a waste of time,they take ages to get big enough to bother + there is never much on them really.I`ve tried pretty much all breeds over the years.Then they stop laying as the nights draw in.

I reared some cobbs but they get too big too quick and have leg problems..8 week old cock weighed 4kg Dressed.

Get some hybrids for eggs (columbian blacktails) lay nearly every day through the winter as well.
and find some slower growing hybrid meat birds.

[YorkshireLass]

Have been reading about Barnvelders. Thanks for that idea.  Docile and pretty as well as medium-large dual purpose - sounds interesting. 

Anyone any experiences to share with this breed?  (Good and bad.). Not too docile / lazy?  (Had a couple of Buff Orpingtons. Cuddly and meaty. But so greedy and got so fat!)

Nice birds, the cock was respectful and trusted, took a while to get to eating size but I don't know how that compares to other breeds. A few stubborn old girls, very habit-driven so didn't like change!

[Marches Farmer]

Dorkings would get my vote - meaty bird, nice temperament, start laying around three weeks younger than our other soft-feathered large fowl, those that go broody do an excellent job. 

[Dave C]

Hi Sally, wow that's quite a project 

The eggs side won't be a problem, but have you priced up the cost of putting 2 cockerels a week on the table of a traditional breed.

I know you don't want to but if you could have 2 breeding flocks it would make things a lot easier.

If you were looking for maximum production at the lowest cost, it would be Hybrid layers being kept a few years, culled and replaced and hybrid meat birds bought in batches, the free range types can be kept and bred from.

If your sticking with traditional breeds I would go for the main flock of Possible Light Sussex as your layers, with a smaller flock of Indian Game to cross with them for meat and the IG hens make excellent broodys.
IG will also help with eggs and extra cockerels are excellent table birds in there own write.

[harmony]

We're a community of 20+ adults and 9 children, with a small farm we run ourselves, rearing livestock, milking our Jersey and growing veg.  We're always all very busy, so don't want to stretch ourselves too thin.

That sounds really interesting Sally. Would love to hear more.  Oh nothing to add about chickens! Lol!

[Bramham Wiltshire Horns]

Hi
I had some LS last year from good strain and probably a little disappointed
I also had IG x LS and again probably a little disappointed all the pulleys seem to have better meat to bone but in the smaller side to the cockerels

I have found that all 6 of the hens I kept are now all broody at same time

I have cou cou de Rennes this year so will let you know how I get on
Been laying since Feb and not a broody insight

[Terry T]

We had a similar plan to you, although there is only the two of us. We gave copper black marans a try and got a cockerel that attacked us regularly. We ate him last week and are reconsidering the breed /s. The other breed we are considering is the Australorp which on paper looks good although I've no direct experience.

[DippyEgg]

If you were looking for maximum production at the lowest cost, it would be Hybrid layers being kept a few years, culled and replaced and hybrid meat birds bought in batches, the free range types can be kept and bred from.

What hybrid meat birds is there, that can be free range and kept and bred from?

[macgro7]

If you were looking for maximum production at the lowest cost, it would be Hybrid layers being kept a few years, culled and replaced and hybrid meat birds bought in batches, the free range types can be kept and bred from.

What hybrid meat birds is there, that can be free range and kept and bred from?

I ordered the red one from piggies hatchery and was very pleased with them last year. I think Dave has the same ones or  very similiar, bit from different supplier:
http://piggottspoultry.co.uk/meat.html

[Dave C]

Mine are Sasso's, which are a French producer for the Label Rouge market, which is a standard for free range.
http://www.thepoultrysite.com/articles/1888/label-rouge-pasturebased-poultry-production-in-france/

Last year I kept some Sasso slow growth Pullets and 2 cockerels back for breeding along with some Sasso medium growth Pullets (cockerels of medium growth were to big with bad movement).
Pullets came into lay at 18 weeks and laid all winter, cockerels dressed out at 2kg at 14 weeks old.
Hatched eggs from them and the chicks are 6 weeks now and doing very well.

Have a look at the pics on Breeding for Meat & Eggs thread.