The Accidental Smallholder Forum

Smallholding => Land Management => Topic started by: deadtomorrow on December 17, 2020, 01:44:13 pm

Title: 10 year rule
Post by: deadtomorrow on December 17, 2020, 01:44:13 pm
Hiya everyone, I was just wondering, if part of pasture or agricultural land has been used as a veg growing patch for over ten years, does that mean it's beyond being questioned?
Title: Re: 10 year rule
Post by: Possum on December 17, 2020, 08:00:04 pm
I'm not sure what you mean by not being questioned. What is it that you want to do with the land? :farmer:
Title: Re: 10 year rule
Post by: doganjo on December 17, 2020, 08:23:05 pm
I think maybe you mean cultivating land that isn't yours? i.e. Adverse possession

This is from an English law firm -
"Minimum time requirements Before any adverse possession application can be considered you must have been using (or in possession of the land) for at least ten years. If the land is registered with someone else then the minimum time is extended to twelve years. It may be possible to use any period of adverse possession by a predecessor in title towards establishing the 10 or 12 year period.

Proof of possession You need to demonstrate that you have enjoyed uninterrupted factual possession of the land for the minimum time period. In order to show this, you will need to evidence - a sufficient degree of exclusive physical control over the land.
In general this means that the person in possession must have been dealing with the land as an occupying owner might have been expected to deal with it.

Proof or intention You will also need to prove that you intended to possess the land during the relevant period. In most cases, the factual circumstances of possession will demonstrate intenti

Do you have the landowners consent? If you have consent to use the land from the landowner then it is not possible to acquire the land through an adverse possession claim.

Deliberate obstruction of land You should be careful not to commit a criminal offence in possessing land that does not belong to you and any attempts to deliberately obstruct access to land or block public highways can jeopardise any adverse possession application.

Making an application Once you have established the relevant period, you will need to make an application to the Land Registry. The Land Registry may then write to any neighbouring properties who may have claim to the land. They may also arrange for a surveyor to inspect the land and produce a report. Should any other party wish to object to an application, they will need to make their objection in writing. If the Land Registry considers that an objection may have some merit, the matter can then be referred to the Lands Chamber of the Upper Tribunal for a determination."
Does that help?
Scottish law is different I believe
Title: Re: 10 year rule
Post by: deadtomorrow on December 18, 2020, 08:32:07 am
Hi everyone, sorry I probably wasn't clear, I was just wondering, on my own land, the previous owners used an area of agricultural pasture land for vegetable growing. So that area has been used for growing crops for over ten years now and I wondered if, rather than needing to apply for change of use, this means it automatically obtains that permission due to the 10 year rule?
Title: Re: 10 year rule
Post by: doganjo on December 19, 2020, 02:12:26 pm
The ten year rule as I understand it relates to ownership or not - not what is actually grown on it.

Vegetables are classed as agricultural so if you want to use it for grazing or something else agricultural I can't see why you'd need permission from anyone
Title: Re: 10 year rule
Post by: bj_cardiff on December 21, 2020, 07:20:38 am
I can't comment on the 10yr rule, however, if no-one has complained about it being used for growing vegetables for 10yrs I think it would be a huge mistake to apply for planning, or even enquire about it with the planning department. The answer will probably be that you do need planning and once you start down that route the chances of you loosing your vegetable garden increase dramatically!

Just carry on as you are, if it is ever questioned, you can say you brought the land with it being used as a veg garden and have carried on using it as such
Title: Re: 10 year rule
Post by: honeyend on December 23, 2020, 08:15:31 pm
Just in case anyone queries that its always been used as a veg plot, I would print any photos off google earth, Facebook, or just datable pictures, may be the estate agents ad, as a just in case.
Title: Re: 10 year rule
Post by: landroverroy on December 23, 2020, 08:47:28 pm
As Doganjo has said - growing vegetables, ie crops is an agricultural use and as such does not require anyone's permission. You surely don't imagine that a farmer applies for planning permission every time he ploughs up some grassland, or grows cabbages after wheat, and then a year of peas? 
Title: Re: 10 year rule
Post by: honeyend on December 23, 2020, 11:30:22 pm
I suppose if seen as extension of a garden, rather than commercial crops, as non-agricultural land is usually more expensive especially if its attached to a dwelling. If it's seen as part of the curtilage there could be more scope for planning under PD.