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Author Topic: Weaning lambs from ewes  (Read 5116 times)

tommytink

  • Joined Aug 2018
Weaning lambs from ewes
« on: May 21, 2020, 12:21:11 pm »
I’m getting to the point where I need to separate my ewes and lambs. Can anyone give me a clue as to the best way to do it? I’m looking online for info. I read 12 weeks is the optimum age? They are still feeding from the ewes every now and again (although the ewe usually walks off, I get the feeling she’s had enough!) but are mostly munching grass. At 12 weeks they should be digestive system should be developed enough to stop the milk?
I also need to think about BCS and how long it’d take to alter if needed.
Ewes need to be on poor grazing for a couple of weeks? But it then says after that they may need attention if raised twins or if they’re gimmers or hoggs. (The different names for different ages still confuses me - ours are aged just over two now, so gimmers??)
And how far apart do they have to be when we split them (I realise as far as possible is probably the answer but in realistic terms we are struggling with fields as it’s now been so dry)? Do we just separate and let both ewes and lambs get used to being without each other?

Fleecewife

  • Joined May 2010
  • South Lanarkshire
    • ScotHebs
Re: Weaning lambs from ewes
« Reply #1 on: May 21, 2020, 12:32:07 pm »
Why do you need to separate them? 
If you leave them together until 4-5 months old, then the ewe will have weaned them herself, with no stress to either ewe or lambs.  It gives the ewe plenty of time to regain her condition before tupping time, and the lambs get no growth check from a sudden change in diet.
"Let's not talk about what we can do, but do what we can"

There is NO planet B - what are YOU doing to save our home?

Do something today that your future self will thank you for - plant a tree

 Love your soil - it's the lifeblood of your land.

SallyintNorth

  • Joined Feb 2011
  • Cornwall
  • Rarely short of an opinion but I mean well
    • Trelay Cohousing Community
Re: Weaning lambs from ewes
« Reply #2 on: May 21, 2020, 01:12:00 pm »
If you decide you do still want to wean, then :

Yes, at 12 weeks the lambs are perfectly capable of getting all their nutrition ruminantly.  Up to you whether you give them some cake, or grass pellets, to make up for the milk they will be losing.  As long as you have good grass for them, they will be fine.

If the ewes and lambs are in the next field to each other you are likely to get heads stuck in fences, lambs ramming fences, etc, so it's best to have at least two fences (ie., one clear field or other ground) between them.  If you can put them out of sight, smell and as far as possible sound of each other, they'll adjust quicker, in my experience.  If they can hear each other call, the calling goes on for a couple of days, sometimes a bit longer.

It makes it easier on the lambs if you do these things :

* leave them where they were and take the ewes away, so the lambs know the ground, where to shelter, etc.  Just for a few days till they stop crying and settle into being grazing animals again, then move them onto the fresh ground you have ready for them.  They won't eat a great deal of grass for a day or two while they shout their heads off anyway ;)

* have a couple of older sheep with them to be "aunties".  Maybe ewes without lambs, or last year's lambs, or a couple of ewes with lambs who don't need to be speaned because they have plenty of condition and or you are not going to breed them this year.  (Assuming you don't have an "unringed tup lambs approaching sexually mature" problem).


Yes the ewes will need to be "dried off", so put them on slim pickings for a couple of weeks.  Some people put them in a yard or shed with straw for a few days, then, if the grass was getting short where they were, you can put them back where you took them from after you move the lambs to better ground.  Grass makes milk, and cake makes milk, and you don't want milk; hay and straw don't make much milk, so if you think they need a bit more food than the grass gives them, give them some hay or (better) nice barley straw to top up with.


"Gimmer" is the sheep equivalent of "heifer".  It's not an age, it's a condition, basically a maiden female.  So you can have a gimmer lamb (ewe lamb), gimmer hogg (ewe hogg : after her first Christmas and before her first shearing), gimmer shearling (after her first shearing), etc.  As with heifers, they are confusingly often still referred to as gimmers (or heifers) when they have their first lambs / calves  ::)

So the advice you have been given relates to weaning first time mums earlier to give them more time to regain condition before going to the tup for the second time.  It's definitely something I would do if I lambed hoggs (tupped them as lambs, so they had their own lambs when they were just 1 year old), and with first-timers who reared twins and have put a lot into their lambs, so look a bit scruffy and scrawny.

The rule of thumb is that it takes a fortnight to see a change in BCS.  If you are weaning them, they will be on slim pickings for two weeks, but not producing milk, so their condition will probably stay about the same or improve very slightly for the first two weeks after weaning.  Then check them, and anyone who seems skinny might want better grass, a bit of cake too perhaps if the grass isn't great.  But you have quite a long time yet before tupping, so you don't really need to be in a hurry to put condition on them unless they're really poor.  If you will want to flush them (to get as many multiples as possible), you need a bit of leeway to have them on "a rising plane of nutrition" (ie., putting weight on) as you put the tups in, so don't overdo the feeding up now ;)

ETA, if it takes a fortnight to add 0.5 to BCS, and it's 4 months to tupping now, and you want them at 2 or 2.5 for tupping, you can see that you really don't need to be in a rush.  Although of course they will add condition quicker on summer grass and you might need to use a bit of cake to add condition come October.
« Last Edit: May 21, 2020, 01:16:08 pm by SallyintNorth »
Don't listen to the money men - they know the price of everything and the value of nothing

Live in a cohousing community with small farm for our own use.  Dairy cows (rearing their own calves for beef), pigs, sheep for meat and fleece, ducks and hens for eggs, veg and fruit growing

twizzel

  • Joined Apr 2012
Re: Weaning lambs from ewes
« Reply #3 on: May 21, 2020, 02:15:29 pm »
I send lambs for killing straight off the ewe- weaning will cause a stress induced growth check for a week or 2. Once a ewe has her last lamb sent away she stays in the shed for a week to dry off. Our grass is too good to dry ewes off on even when very short. Come end of July any ewes still with lambs are all brought in and weaned off. Then the remaining lambs go back out field with the ewes dried off earlier in the summer. Normally after a week both ewe and lambs will have forgotten about each other enough to graze in same field with a electric fence between them. Keep them separated for a good month after though.


I wean my ewes late- they get too fat otherwise and that makes a rising plane of nutrition to tupping difficult to achieve. Most people who wean at 12 weeks either have entire ram lambs or are short in grass- then the lambs can have the best grass and the ewes put on poorer grass.

Bramham Wiltshire Horns

  • Joined Oct 2014
  • leeds
  • Bramham flock Wiltshire Horns
Re: Weaning lambs from ewes
« Reply #4 on: May 21, 2020, 02:43:35 pm »
HI
i leave my Lambs with the ewe for 4 months if the tups are left entire and i would take them to a different field out of sight i would leave the gimmers with the ewes, usually by then the ewe has self weaned them herself anyway,

i find the ewes dry up better this way and i have had no issues with Mastitus at weaning

this year i have castrated the males so when it comes to weighing i will check that the testicles have dropped off,

the Wethers will go in with the stock tup for company and given a bit of feed for the first few days so they dont drop any condition

its worth noting that mine are native and are slightly slower in growth to the commercial tups, so if i guess you could be dictated to buy weight

hope this helps
follow on FB@BramhamWiltshireHorns

bj_cardiff

  • Joined Feb 2017
  • Carmarthenshire
Re: Weaning lambs from ewes
« Reply #5 on: May 22, 2020, 06:05:07 am »
It depends on the ewes, if you have plenty of grass and they are in good condition I would leabe them for another 30 days, if a few are looking a bit ropey (usually the older ewes) I would pull them out of the flock and leave their lambs with the rest of the lambs.

Weaning, I usually graze a field down quite hard with the ewes and lambs, bring them all in and separate the lambs, usually worm and spray them and send the lambs (and the rams) to a new field with loads of grass. Physically as far away from the lambs as possible. I don't have anywhere they can't hear each other if the wind is right, but definately out of sight! Then return the ewes to the field they have just been in. Hopefully the grass will recover along with the ewes

Fleecewife

  • Joined May 2010
  • South Lanarkshire
    • ScotHebs
Re: Weaning lambs from ewes
« Reply #6 on: May 22, 2020, 12:37:23 pm »
Back when we did used to separate out the ewes and lambs, about 15 years ago now or longer, we found it was far less stressful for all to leave them in adjacent fields, with just a stob and mesh fence between.  This way, couples (a ewe and her lamb or lambs) could sit and even graze side by side, on either side of the fence, without the lambs being able to suck.  There was never any calling, crying or fuss - everyone was happy, familes were not broken up.  So this thing about separating ewe and lambs out of sight of each other is questionable.  Even a mile apart, the ewes can hear their distressed lamb.


It's an alternative view to 'common practice', but we should question how we do things sometimes, with surprising results.

« Last Edit: May 22, 2020, 12:41:03 pm by Fleecewife »
"Let's not talk about what we can do, but do what we can"

There is NO planet B - what are YOU doing to save our home?

Do something today that your future self will thank you for - plant a tree

 Love your soil - it's the lifeblood of your land.

SallyintNorth

  • Joined Feb 2011
  • Cornwall
  • Rarely short of an opinion but I mean well
    • Trelay Cohousing Community
Re: Weaning lambs from ewes
« Reply #7 on: May 22, 2020, 04:57:57 pm »
Back when we did used to separate out the ewes and lambs, about 15 years ago now or longer, we found it was far less stressful for all to leave them in adjacent fields, with just a stob and mesh fence between.  This way, couples (a ewe and her lamb or lambs) could sit and even graze side by side, on either side of the fence, without the lambs being able to suck.  There was never any calling, crying or fuss - everyone was happy, familes were not broken up.  So this thing about separating ewe and lambs out of sight of each other is questionable.  Even a mile apart, the ewes can hear their distressed lamb.


It's an alternative view to 'common practice', but we should question how we do things sometimes, with surprising results.

I would agree, if the lambs are half-weaned already and doing just fine without the milk.  But if they still really want the milk then you can get the heads-stuck-in-fences and lambs-ramming-fences things, which can cause probs.  So it's maybe a case-by-case thing.  And dependant on the temperament of your flock too (thinking about some of the Shetland and Manx crosses I've had! lol)
Don't listen to the money men - they know the price of everything and the value of nothing

Live in a cohousing community with small farm for our own use.  Dairy cows (rearing their own calves for beef), pigs, sheep for meat and fleece, ducks and hens for eggs, veg and fruit growing

Fleecewife

  • Joined May 2010
  • South Lanarkshire
    • ScotHebs
Re: Weaning lambs from ewes
« Reply #8 on: May 22, 2020, 06:03:32 pm »
Back when we did used to separate out the ewes and lambs, about 15 years ago now or longer, we found it was far less stressful for all to leave them in adjacent fields, with just a stob and mesh fence between.  This way, couples (a ewe and her lamb or lambs) could sit and even graze side by side, on either side of the fence, without the lambs being able to suck.  There was never any calling, crying or fuss - everyone was happy, familes were not broken up.  So this thing about separating ewe and lambs out of sight of each other is questionable.  Even a mile apart, the ewes can hear their distressed lamb.


It's an alternative view to 'common practice', but we should question how we do things sometimes, with surprising results.

I would agree, if the lambs are half-weaned already and doing just fine without the milk.  But if they still really want the milk then you can get the heads-stuck-in-fences and lambs-ramming-fences things, which can cause probs.  So it's maybe a case-by-case thing.  And dependant on the temperament of your flock too (thinking about some of the Shetland and Manx crosses I've had! lol)

I would argue that if they still really want the milk then they are not ready to be weaned!  But yes, it would take a judgement based on the individual flock.  As I say, it's an alternative viewpoint to consider.  When we have done this, the lambs barely seem to notice, as they were already spending quite a lot of time some distance from their dams, and the ewes are of course delighted not to be pummelled any longer  :D
"Let's not talk about what we can do, but do what we can"

There is NO planet B - what are YOU doing to save our home?

Do something today that your future self will thank you for - plant a tree

 Love your soil - it's the lifeblood of your land.

tommytink

  • Joined Aug 2018
Re: Weaning lambs from ewes
« Reply #9 on: May 24, 2020, 09:55:58 pm »
I do have tup lambs to think about after a failed attempt to band them when they were young  ::) I am also keen to put said tup lambs in with our ram, who has been on his own since he couldn’t control his sexual urges, which I feel bad about as I want him to have company. I realise lamb health is more of a priority though!
The girls seem healthy enough although all first-timers and most had twins so extra strain on them. They are getting shorn this week so will get a good look at how much meat they have on their bones.
I’m confident about having time to get their condition right for tupping.
So they’re in a field now. Move ewes away. Leave lambs for ??? until they settle and then move to better ground. Ewes should be on poor grazing to dry up.
Someone may have said and I missed it - how long before they can go back together? I have three ewes without lambs and would leave them too but OH wants the ewes to stay together.
Wish I had your grass Twizzel. Still too good even when it’s bad!! Sounds like a good problem to have.
bj_cardiff - when you say you spray them do you mean for flies?

bj_cardiff

  • Joined Feb 2017
  • Carmarthenshire
Re: Weaning lambs from ewes
« Reply #10 on: May 25, 2020, 06:09:14 am »
I would put the ewes back on the grazing you have them on now - I assume its all eaten down? The ewes won't need much grass while they dry up as they will only have themselves to support now. The lambs will need the best grass you have and I would also offer them creep for a few weeks to help them adjust and not knock them back too much.

I wouldn't put them back together either, the lambs will need your very best grazing, its a bit of a race to have them ready before the winter when the grass goes and you need to feed them (so your profit vanishes) some years I have grazed the lambs on the best of the grass, moved them on and put the ewes on their field and rested the field the ewes were on so there is plenty for the lambs. I hope that makes sense?

tommytink

  • Joined Aug 2018
Re: Weaning lambs from ewes
« Reply #11 on: May 25, 2020, 10:22:34 pm »
I’m retaining some ewes, for now at least, so they’ll need to go back with their Mums at some point.

Your rotation makes sense, yes! All I need is some rain now...

twizzel

  • Joined Apr 2012
Re: Weaning lambs from ewes
« Reply #12 on: May 25, 2020, 10:52:38 pm »
I put my retained ewe lambs back with their mothers after a month, then pulled them out again at tupping into a separate field.

samdunford

  • Joined Apr 2018
Re: Weaning lambs from ewes
« Reply #13 on: May 28, 2020, 09:42:28 pm »
interesting discussion. We ae so dry at the moment our grass is going backwards. I'm debating whether to wean early (10 weeks) so the lambs can have what best grass is left, or to keep lambs on ewes and move both onto remaining best grass. This will let lambs feed longer on their mothers but mean there is no rich grass to wean them onto. I'm worried if we leave lambs on ewes with very little grass for another 4 weeks milk production will dry up and ewes get mastitis from hungry lambs biting on them. Anyone else faced or facing this dilemma?

bj_cardiff

  • Joined Feb 2017
  • Carmarthenshire
Re: Weaning lambs from ewes
« Reply #14 on: May 29, 2020, 05:53:12 am »
interesting discussion. We ae so dry at the moment our grass is going backwards. I'm debating whether to wean early (10 weeks) so the lambs can have what best grass is left, or to keep lambs on ewes and move both onto remaining best grass. This will let lambs feed longer on their mothers but mean there is no rich grass to wean them onto. I'm worried if we leave lambs on ewes with very little grass for another 4 weeks milk production will dry up and ewes get mastitis from hungry lambs biting on them. Anyone else faced or facing this dilemma?

Its a gamble isn't it.. Wean early or move to a different field and give them 2 weeks (or whatever) but then you have no grass.. I think in your situation I would take the gamble and keep the ewes with their lambs for an extra 2 weeks. Hopefully it will rain at some point, however if it doesn't you will have to wean and possibly feed the ewes hay and lambs hay/nuts.

 

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