The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Smallholding => Buildings & planning => Topic started by: The Wandering Hobbits on January 01, 2018, 03:25:28 pm
-
Hey Guys, This is my First Post so Bear with! Been studying this site for a while now, gaining ideas from everyone's experience (so Thank you) Getting really close to finding some land, its a 30+ acre old conifer plantation, recently felled and some new added, i want to purchase this and go for a permitted development right to install a (so called agricultural barn) i will build this myself so the entitlement means i can stay on the land during construction. Static Caravan.This is my intentions. My only worry is what they ask i am doing with the land. I want to live lo impact, encourage and love the nature, grow my own food live sustainably etc, Earning the minimum wage wont be hard, i have knowledge of commercial growing. Guess im asking to put my mind at rest before i spend the hard earned pennies! Please can anyone help!! Many Thanks and Happy New Year Guys!
-
Hi and a big welcome ot the forum :) I wopuld talk to a planning officer about this just to be on the safe side. Sorry can't help further. Hope you get it sorted soon and all the best :thumbsup:
-
I'm no planning expert but cant see that you would be able to erect an 'agricultural barn' on what is in effect forestry land.... and as for living there you might get temporary permission for a mobile caravan... but unlikey ever to become residential............
-
Its really hard to get planning permission for a static caravan or any sort of accommodation on virgin land even if you have farm animals and are running a business. Neighbours experience.
If you are in not in a special area like a national park you can get PD for a barn if you have enough acerage, you just tell them what you are going to do. There is nothing to stop you storing a caravan in the barn.
I would not talk to the planers, I would look on the local planning portal, see who gets things passed and pay to see a planning advisor.
In my experience its very rare that the local planning department are there to help you. We have had one project passed but are having trouble with the next as the planners are being ****.
-
If you want to be sure what you do is allowed then take proper planning advice, from an advisor or the planners otherwise be prepared for the consequence and costs.
People generally dislike the planners on here. Usually because they wont let them do what they want. Most of the time because it isn't allowed under current planning law and sometimes because they have been given the wrong advice.
Getting a static seems to be the first step to getting a permanent dwelling in many people's minds, especially if you add animals into the equation. It doesn't always work.
-
I am pretty sure getting permitted development for an agricultural "barn" does not entitle you to live on site to supervise the work.
-
Sound thoughts/advice have already been offered Wandering Hobbits. Just to say that, in the circumstances (trees already felled), I imagine the planners will, indeed, press you on your intentions and your need for a storage building. As suggested by others, I believe advice from a good planning consultant would be advisable before purchase if the intended purchase is absolutely contingent on you finding a way (by hook or by crook) to live on the land. However, even if you can "sell" your case to the planners, there will still be the reaction of neighbours to consider in future when it becomes apparent that you are living on the land - they might not be sympathetic and then the game will be up.
-
I would definitely NOT talk to the planners. With experience of about 6 different projects, all of which we eventually got planning for, I have found the planners unhelpful and downright obstructive, to the extent of dreaming up reasons why we couldn't get permission which were clearly irrelevant.
You cannot beat talking to a good planning professional and that is your problem. Do some research to find someone that is recommended to you. Some are good at drawing up plans but not sufficiently knowledgeable to put a good case forward. Others will charge a fortune for poor advice. Do your own research on the internet so you have an idea what you want of your planning professional. Martin Goodall's Planning Blog is very informative.
-
Taken from the FC guide on felling trees, i would ensure there are no conditions placed on the owners to 'replant/replace' the trees felled previously.
Quote: You must explain how you intend to restock the felled area. Under the Forestry Act 1967, (as amended), we usually attach conditions to the licence to secure restocking. We will
discuss any proposed restocking conditions with you before a licence is issued. If you
propose to clear the area and not restock we will consider your application under the
Environmental Impact Assessment (Forestry) Regulations 1999 (see above).
-
Planning aside, a felled conifer plantation is a very hostile environment for growing anything except more conifers. And flies. And ants.
-
Planning aside, a felled conifer plantation is a very hostile environment for growing anything except more conifers. And flies. And ants.
Or outdoor pigs :pig: , or poultry :chook: . . . . .
-
wandering hobbits, this may be more your thing - it's certainly a project and a half for somebody!
https://www.theguardian.com/money/gallery/2018/jan/05/french-hilltop-home-on-the-site-of-a-roman-fortress-in-pictures (https://www.theguardian.com/money/gallery/2018/jan/05/french-hilltop-home-on-the-site-of-a-roman-fortress-in-pictures)
-
Planning aside, a felled conifer plantation is a very hostile environment for growing anything except more conifers. And flies. And ants.
Or outdoor pigs :pig: , or poultry :chook: . . . . .
Good ideas :thumbsup:
-
Planning aside, a felled conifer plantation is a very hostile environment for growing anything except more conifers. And flies. And ants.
I'm just interested to know: why is a felled conifer plantation not good for planting other stuff (apart from lots of roots of course)?
-
Acid soil?
-
Acid soil?
Very! All those pine needles create a very acidic soil
-
forget it you cannot build on agricultural land nor can you plonk a caravan on it. You need to read up what is classed as permitted development and putting any form of building in the countryside is def not. If this was the case then every man and his dog would be living in the woods. Sadly even those living in the woods and making a big contribution are not seen to have any legal rights.
-
There is permitted development to erect an agricultural building on agricultural land, although as pointed out, getting planning for a habitation is a different matter.
However, if Wondering Hobbit can prove he can make the minimum wage off his land, and with 30 acres this is possible, then he has a good chance to get permission for a house as well. :sunshine:
-
There is permitted development to erect an agricultural building on agricultural land, although as pointed out, getting planning for a habitation is a different matter.
However, if Wondering Hobbit can prove he can make the minimum wage off his land, and with 30 acres this is possible, then he has a good chance to get permission for a house as well. :sunshine:
Totally depends on where he is in country. (not sure how you would make living wage of 30 acres of exconifer!)
-
There is permitted development to erect an agricultural building on agricultural land, although as pointed out, getting planning for a habitation is a different matter.
However, if Wondering Hobbit can prove he can make the minimum wage off his land, and with 30 acres this is possible, then he has a good chance to get permission for a house as well. :sunshine:
Totally depends on where he is in country. (not sure how you would make living wage of 30 acres of exconifer!
Bit of a bleak answer Backinwellies!
It might not be your idea of how to get into agriculture, but it's highly possible to make a decent living on 30 acres of poor grade land by means of pigs or poultry - to name but a few. :thumbsup:
-
My neighbour was going to go for planning based on an agricultural business and would have had to put in a five year business plan.
Its not impossible just hard.
-
Have a read of this :-
http://www.woodlands.co.uk/owning-a-wood/woodlands-and-planning-legislation/ (http://www.woodlands.co.uk/owning-a-wood/woodlands-and-planning-legislation/)
-
Hello - Hello - Wandering Hobbits, are you there or have you gone already?
-
Well worth a read enforcement notice appeal
-
Interesting mart6!
-
My primary concern would be the "once a forest, always a forest" rule, unless you have planning permission for change of land use. I was under the impression that all felled trees must be replaced, and that you are not allowed to remove/reduce a wood / forest slowly over time using your quarterly allowance.
-
My primary concern would be the "once a forest, always a forest" rule, unless you have planning permission for change of land use. I was under the impression that all felled trees must be replaced, and that you are not allowed to remove/reduce a wood / forest slowly over time using your quarterly allowance.
Under The Forestry Act 1967 (as amended) you have to say how you intend to replace the trees once felled. And the FC tend to place conditions in the licences granted to do just that. If you intend to not replace that trees once felled, you have to gain permission and it often involves an evironmental impact assessment.
http://scotland.forestry.gov.uk/supporting/grants-and-regulations/felling-licences (http://scotland.forestry.gov.uk/supporting/grants-and-regulations/felling-licences)
-
Interesting mart6!
Its worth reading through enforcement appeals, i read trough many years of them
Could save yourself £ thousands and dont always take what the council tell you as being fact.
I have a file of things the council told me many from head planning officer and majority of it
was not even worth the paper it was wrote on totaly clueless comes to mind
-
Interesting mart6!
Its worth reading through enforcement appeals, i read trough many years of them
Could save yourself £ thousands and dont always take what the council tell you as being fact.
I have a file of things the council told me many from head planning officer and majority of it
was not even worth the paper it was wrote on totaly clueless comes to mind
Me too!
Yet people still, in their ignorance, advise someone to "talk to the planners". It's the worst thing you can do! There's all the information about what you can or can't do the internet. Written by experienced planning professionals, not just some public jobsworth that has been promoted to the level of his incompetency. :dunce: Martin Goodall's Planning blog is very informative. :thumbsup:
-
Sorry this is a bit late...Can you use coniferous trees to make charcoal? Need to be on site for that, I think?