The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Pets & Working Animals => Dogs => Topic started by: DavidandCollette on November 30, 2017, 02:16:40 pm
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We have a 6 month old sprocker. To say that she is lively is an understatement! She is on Skimmers puppy good at present and we wondered if it was a bit rich for her, and maybe we should move to something like Dr John's. Our 4 year Springer seems to do well on the adult version. Anyone have any experience please?
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We used Eukanuba puppy for our dogs and then swapped them onto Harrington when older. They seem to love it
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What breed please?
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Why do you think it is a bit rich? Because she is lively? That'l be the Cocker in the Sprocker!
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What breed please?
We have Boxers :excited:
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Harmony - when I said a bit lovely, I meant manic :yippee: but lovely: -)
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Why do you think it is a bit rich? Because she is lively? That'l be the Cocker in the Sprocker!
And the Springer in the Sprocker :).
I’ve found all my collie and collie cross dogs to be too hyper, unless working hard, for other than Chappie and a plain wholewheat biscuit. Next best is Autarky, only small flights of the helicopters on that... :/.
But I’d hesitate to reduce protein before 6 months. Young growing bones need the input.
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I agree with Sally about reducing protein levels too soon.
Yes, Springers are busy dogs too but Cockers beat them hands down. And yes, two lively breeds there so manic is probably a good word. At gun dog training it is the cockers who do the most miles and are the coiled springs.
We have always put pups onto Beta Puppy then moved them onto Beta Junior.
You could always look at it from another angle and look at your diet and see if you could increase your energy levels to keep up! Lol!
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Thanks Harmony, I'll try Skimmers myself :roflanim:
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You could always look at it from another angle and look at your diet and see if you could increase your energy levels to keep up! Lol!
Thanks Harmony, I'll try Skimmers myself :roflanim:
:roflanim: :roflanim: :roflanim:
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I don’t know how experienced you are, [member=27141]DavidandCollette[/member], so please forgive me if I’m teaching granny to suck eggs... but a few insights into keeping working dogs as pets that I’ve gleaned over the years.
- many such dogs cannot be tired out by just running about. They need their minds exercised too. You can run a collie all day and it’s still fresh as a daisy, but add some obedience, nosework, agility or something and you can have it sleeping it off after only a couple or three hours. You can start the less physical options at a very young age; agility and so on is usually best left until they’re 18 months old.
- do not feed a working dog feed. They only need that level of input if they’re actually working - and proper, all day out in the fields and moors type working, not just a bit of training or trialling. And not just an all-day walk, either - see above.
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Thanks Sally. I will bear that in mind and adjust her diet accordingly. We are thinking about gun dog training for her as well.
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I agree with Sally, mind games as well as physical ones will help. I have had Brittanys for 35 years since they came to the UK and they are basically a hunting machine on legs, which is fine so long as you are fit and able to take them out shooting or hunting with hawks etc (which I used to do, sometimes twice a week in season :innocent:), but as a 74 year old with mobility issues I needed other ways of tiring my lot out. I have bought indoor treat games for my youngster (four this week), and they definitely work as well as the hour and a half free running in woodlands.
They also do 'hide and seek' games in the house, retrieving, and the best game for Missy is the 'chase the hens along the fence and back again' game :roflanim: Occasionally Henny Penny jumps up onto teh fence and down onto teh grass foor alook see. She chases Missy if she gets too close, and Missy spends a lot of time stalking her around the back garden
But I would add in addition, please do not take her off puppy food too early - pups need the protein and nutrition that most good brands contain.
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It's not protein that makes them hyper, it's carbs. Get a low carb food - they are usually the ones that are grain free.
(oh and just to be annoying manufacturers don't print the carbs on the label, you have to work it out from the other analysis - google can tell you how. high carbs would be 40%+, low carbs would be 20-40%)
Note that there are dog foods that are suitable for all ages (puppy through to senior).
I'm a Millies Wolfheart fan myself :).
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It's not protein that makes them hyper, it's carbs.
I think it's probably more correct to say that with some dogs, it's the carbs / cereals, and with some dogs it's the protein / red meat. I feed my collie dog (and the collie crosses before her) partly on tinned Chappie, which is 6% protein and that mostly fish-derived, with a wholewheat biscuit. Any other feed for both her meals and she's completely hyper (as were the crosses before her.).
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If the protein source is from cereals (which are quite indigestible to a dog) then this can cause hyperactivity and fizzy behaviour- I think it's something to do with starch if I remember rightly. If the protein source is from meat (very digestible) then it will pass through the system and not cause adverse behaviour. Our 2 are fed Millies Wolfheart, the protein levels are high but the food is grain free and thus doesn't cause problems as the protein source is quality meat (not derivatives).
I would disagree with not feeding working dog food to pets- quite often it is the same food, just packaged differently, to avoid VAT. Milies Wolfheart is a working dog food but our 2 sprockers do very well on it.
Dr Johns is pretty awful as a food- look at the list of ingredients- if it contains cereals listed first, meat derivatives... say no thanks and find something else. Skinners is a good mid range food but we now feed grain free Millies and have seen a huge difference in the condition of our 2 girls.
Spaniels need a lot of mental stimulation, we have 2- mother and daughter. The mother is 6 and quite happy to bumble along in the tractor but the daughter (3) is a product of her Cocker father and quite honestly mad as a box of frogs :roflanim: but I wouldn't be without either of them.
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Another millies fan here too :) I was previously feeding raw but currently cannot stomach raw meat.
I have 3 adult collies and a chinese crested puppy now. No-one is "worked" but 2 collies and the crestie are shown in the breed ring and 2 collies also do a lot of training for search and rescue - fingers crossed we'll end up qualified this time next year.
I've never had a problem with energy levels or "fizziness" or manic behaviour on anything I've fed and with the older collie I think I have tried them all bar Bakers - for him we were searching for something to settle his stomach rather than for behaviour and eventually had to go grain and chicken free. What does result in manic behaviour or fizziness is the lack of brain work in this house.
We do a lot of scent games (talking dogs scentworks is a nice easy start), all meals are fed in activity and slow feeders (and amazon basics do a nice range for just £5 a bowl) and they all learn tricks and do fitpaws too.
Another plus of Millies is with all the different flavors and ratios is there is something for everyone snd you can swap around if needed with no issues
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We have a red and white Welsh sheepdog and found a rice-based element to the diet (Chappie) suited him much better than wheat-based.